Well my buddy just started doing Roxi 30's again and she needs to take 3 at a time to get a decent buzz (so 90 mg a day).. How many days in a row of taking this dosage would it take for her to start risking withdrawals if she suddenly stopped? Thanks in advance!
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BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic
How long would my buddy have to take said dosage of Oxy to start risking WD?
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Even if it is actually someone else we're speaking about, humor me by pretending it's you for the sake of easy communication. I'm assuming you've been dependent upon Opioids in the past? It seems like that's what you've alluded to at least. 90mg Oxycodone isn't child's play. In my experience, following a severe dependence episode it can take as little as 3 days of continuous use to reinduce a withdrawal 20%-25% as intense as the withdrawal from the original usage. Give this a couple of weeks and I believe the difference will be practically indistinguishable.
It's going to depend heavily on how many times you've been dependent upon/withdrawn from Opioids. Much like with Sedative/Hypnotic drugs, there is a phenomenon known as the kindling effect, which states more or less what I've covered here. Disproportionately intense abstinence syndromes in relation to amount and frequency of intake. It took me at least a year of using Opioids near-daily before I got truly sick.
It's a curse really. Opioids are already uber-addictive even to normal folks with normal, functioning personalities, so you can see how as Opioid-dependents we're constantly on the edge of a precipice where one use turns into two, turns into sick, turns into a 9 month run ending in county jail.
It's going to depend heavily on how many times you've been dependent upon/withdrawn from Opioids. Much like with Sedative/Hypnotic drugs, there is a phenomenon known as the kindling effect, which states more or less what I've covered here. Disproportionately intense abstinence syndromes in relation to amount and frequency of intake. It took me at least a year of using Opioids near-daily before I got truly sick.
It's a curse really. Opioids are already uber-addictive even to normal folks with normal, functioning personalities, so you can see how as Opioid-dependents we're constantly on the edge of a precipice where one use turns into two, turns into sick, turns into a 9 month run ending in county jail.
If its easier to pretend we're talking about me here just for communication sake I'm fine with that (even though it aint me).. Anyways, there's never been any real dependence issues in this case. The situation is a little weird though this time around as it seems "my" tolerance skyrocketed out of nowhere. "I" just started messing around with Oxy again after a little break (about 2 months), which is what "I've" done for about a year now, "I'd" use for about a 1 or 2 weeks tops with maybe a few days off here and there, and then take a month or 2 break...
It always took "me" just one Roxi to get off no matter what, however this time around "I" took one for like the first day and felt great like "I" usually would, but then the 2nd day "I" decided to give two (60 mgs) a try thinking it would be amazing... "I" was SO surprised when "I" took 60 mgs in one shot for the first time that it only felt like 30.. So "I" took another. So last night and this morning "I" took 90 mgs in one shot just by mouth on an empty stomach (like "I" always do) and that did the trick, felt like how "I" would usually feel just taking ONE Roxi 30.. Didn't even mess "me" up that much though, just a nice clean buzz.
"I" find it really scary and weird that "my" tolerance went up that quick out of nowhere like it never did before.. Anyways like I said, "I've" only used for 2 weeks tops in the past (with a day off here and there) taking about 60 mgs a day. "I've" experienced some mild WD symptoms a couple times like night sweats, cold chills, burning skin etc etc, but it was very mild and nothing too uncomfortable, lasted about 2 days... But now that its taking "me" 90 mgs a day in one shot to get where "I" need to be, it seems to me like its a whole new ball game.. How many days of use at this dosage do u really think "i" can take before hitting WD territory (mild and severe) now that u know some of the history?
It always took "me" just one Roxi to get off no matter what, however this time around "I" took one for like the first day and felt great like "I" usually would, but then the 2nd day "I" decided to give two (60 mgs) a try thinking it would be amazing... "I" was SO surprised when "I" took 60 mgs in one shot for the first time that it only felt like 30.. So "I" took another. So last night and this morning "I" took 90 mgs in one shot just by mouth on an empty stomach (like "I" always do) and that did the trick, felt like how "I" would usually feel just taking ONE Roxi 30.. Didn't even mess "me" up that much though, just a nice clean buzz.
"I" find it really scary and weird that "my" tolerance went up that quick out of nowhere like it never did before.. Anyways like I said, "I've" only used for 2 weeks tops in the past (with a day off here and there) taking about 60 mgs a day. "I've" experienced some mild WD symptoms a couple times like night sweats, cold chills, burning skin etc etc, but it was very mild and nothing too uncomfortable, lasted about 2 days... But now that its taking "me" 90 mgs a day in one shot to get where "I" need to be, it seems to me like its a whole new ball game.. How many days of use at this dosage do u really think "i" can take before hitting WD territory (mild and severe) now that u know some of the history?
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^Haha, okay man, take it easy 
. It's just that the vast majority of people who speak in the third person or refer to "other" people are vaguely afraid of law enforcement. Again, I've been caught globalizing, so I apologize for that. So your friend, if his usage is as limited as you're implying shouldn't be in any serious danger of major withdrawal symptoms. Just like you've experienced before, they will probably be mild.
It's impossible to place a date or even estimate how long it will take for you to develop severe dependence. All you can really do is reference other cases, like mine for instance. As I said, it took me probably a year of daily using before I experienced a real withdrawal episode. After that, dependence came on quick, as did withdrawal. At any rate, it takes time. Dependence does not form from a couple of days of heavy use.
You should be able to quit without any severe symptoms, but this is just my opinion. If you continue using, there's really no telling what will happen. I can tell you that Heroin and Opioids are as much a part of my life as food, sleep and sex, for better or for worse. If you continue to use them regularly, you will probably become attached as I am. You clearly enjoy Opioids, what's going to stop you from using them exactly?
I'm not judging in any way. Please understand that. This is how all addictions start; dabbling, enjoying, plotting to use, thinking about Opioids. I just want you to be aware that you're no different than any of us who at one time had never used Opioids. There is nothing special that is going to keep you from becoming addicted.
Sadly, as well, the "Plotting Phase" as I like to call it, is in my opinion, the hallmark of a budding addiction. You love Opioids, you want to use them all the time. You can't get addicted though. That just can't happen. You'll only use for 3 days then stop for 2. You'll only use this weekend. Only two more weeks of using, then I'm totally done, I'll go through withdrawal then. You're trying to figure out how to use Opioids all the time without becoming addicted; the plotting phase
Also, please don't mistake me for categorizing you. I'm speaking broadly about addiction in general.
. It's just that the vast majority of people who speak in the third person or refer to "other" people are vaguely afraid of law enforcement. Again, I've been caught globalizing, so I apologize for that. So your friend, if his usage is as limited as you're implying shouldn't be in any serious danger of major withdrawal symptoms. Just like you've experienced before, they will probably be mild.It's impossible to place a date or even estimate how long it will take for you to develop severe dependence. All you can really do is reference other cases, like mine for instance. As I said, it took me probably a year of daily using before I experienced a real withdrawal episode. After that, dependence came on quick, as did withdrawal. At any rate, it takes time. Dependence does not form from a couple of days of heavy use.
You should be able to quit without any severe symptoms, but this is just my opinion. If you continue using, there's really no telling what will happen. I can tell you that Heroin and Opioids are as much a part of my life as food, sleep and sex, for better or for worse. If you continue to use them regularly, you will probably become attached as I am. You clearly enjoy Opioids, what's going to stop you from using them exactly?
I'm not judging in any way. Please understand that. This is how all addictions start; dabbling, enjoying, plotting to use, thinking about Opioids. I just want you to be aware that you're no different than any of us who at one time had never used Opioids. There is nothing special that is going to keep you from becoming addicted.
Sadly, as well, the "Plotting Phase" as I like to call it, is in my opinion, the hallmark of a budding addiction. You love Opioids, you want to use them all the time. You can't get addicted though. That just can't happen. You'll only use for 3 days then stop for 2. You'll only use this weekend. Only two more weeks of using, then I'm totally done, I'll go through withdrawal then. You're trying to figure out how to use Opioids all the time without becoming addicted; the plotting phase
Also, please don't mistake me for categorizing you. I'm speaking broadly about addiction in general.
Johndoedoe.junk
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Yep as little as three days.
crzydiamond
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This is true when the person has had previous dependencies / withdrawals
If he has not, then he won't experience withdrawal or dependence that soon. As Keif said...it takes time for someone who just starts using to develop a dependency, regardless of if that use is 30 mg, 90mg, or 200 mg
That fact that u need 3 blues to get high is the key...that's a lot and withdrawal will set in VERY quickly....is it 3 30s at a time a few times a day? Or just 3 30s once a day? A 3 day binge with that tolerance will absolutely produce withdrawals.
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I respectfully disagree with you Roxi and substitute my previous statement. Also, please don't speak in absolute terms. I've learned through my 20 or so years of life that speaking in such terms often leads to being proven wrong
. A 3-day dabble in Opioids by the pill, gram or kilo is simply not enough time to drastically alter the metabolic and neurological processes of your body. It's different for everybody, but it will take longer than 3 days and although I normally shy away from these sort of predictions, will probably take months of regular use.A lot of people venerate Burroughs semi-autobiographical "Junkie". He was a super intelligent and articulate guy and at least from where I'm standing was very direct about things. He had a similar experience as I did and others have had with the Kindling effect, although at that time there's no name for the phenomenon so it might be hard to reference it.
90mg Oxycodone is not a prolific dosage either. I know many who would call that a morning pick-me-up, without an active tolerance of any kind.
crzydiamond
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You're spot on Keif , from my experience at least
First started using(snorting) heroin back in early 90s. This was the first opiate/opioid I really used, other than a few Percocet here and there. This of course pre-dated the OxyContin era
I used for almost a year regularly (after a year of on and off) before I ever felt a wd symptom. In fact, I wondered why others I knew would be whining in the morning about feeling blah and not wanting to get up and rushing to do a bag.
Then one morning--woke up sneezing and shaky. Still didn't connect the dots. Thought I was coming down with something. Until a bag took it away. And until it happened again the next morning....
Obviously very minor wd then. And it progressed over the years. Worsened when I started shooting. Every relapse I would start to get withdrawal sooner. First relapse I didn't get sick for weeks. A few later it was maybe a week of daily use
I had a relapse after almost 9 years clean and was only using oxycodone and after 3-4 days felt slightly off. The following relapse shooting dope, I used for 3 days and on the 4th was shaky, nauseous/diarrhea, RLS, sneezing, etc. I couldn't believe after 3 days I was that sick. I tried to tell myself it was in my mind and I was exaggerating. But I wasn't.
I haven't used since then, still on a methadone clinic, but I know I've gotten to the point if I would use consecutive days then I'm going to be sick the 3rd. I have also seen this in others (but always sorta thought they exaggerated; now I understand)
So, yeah...that kindling thing is real. I didn't know the name, but it definitely progresses. I thought that "progression" thing was some crap they fed you in rehab...but it's true
But again,
3 days of oxy use *when one does not have previous habits where they experienced physical wd* normally will not cause physical withdrawal symptoms. Psychological ,yes. Physical, no. Unless you are a statistical anomaly
It takes time to alter the receptors in the brain...
First started using(snorting) heroin back in early 90s. This was the first opiate/opioid I really used, other than a few Percocet here and there. This of course pre-dated the OxyContin era
I used for almost a year regularly (after a year of on and off) before I ever felt a wd symptom. In fact, I wondered why others I knew would be whining in the morning about feeling blah and not wanting to get up and rushing to do a bag.
Then one morning--woke up sneezing and shaky. Still didn't connect the dots. Thought I was coming down with something. Until a bag took it away. And until it happened again the next morning....
Obviously very minor wd then. And it progressed over the years. Worsened when I started shooting. Every relapse I would start to get withdrawal sooner. First relapse I didn't get sick for weeks. A few later it was maybe a week of daily use
I had a relapse after almost 9 years clean and was only using oxycodone and after 3-4 days felt slightly off. The following relapse shooting dope, I used for 3 days and on the 4th was shaky, nauseous/diarrhea, RLS, sneezing, etc. I couldn't believe after 3 days I was that sick. I tried to tell myself it was in my mind and I was exaggerating. But I wasn't.
I haven't used since then, still on a methadone clinic, but I know I've gotten to the point if I would use consecutive days then I'm going to be sick the 3rd. I have also seen this in others (but always sorta thought they exaggerated; now I understand)
So, yeah...that kindling thing is real. I didn't know the name, but it definitely progresses. I thought that "progression" thing was some crap they fed you in rehab...but it's true
But again,
3 days of oxy use *when one does not have previous habits where they experienced physical wd* normally will not cause physical withdrawal symptoms. Psychological ,yes. Physical, no. Unless you are a statistical anomaly
It takes time to alter the receptors in the brain...
Well everyone, I think my friend done messed up now... I'm going to just talk as if its me just for ease of reading.. When I first made this post I was doing 90-120 mg a day (usually in one sitting) for about 3 days. And unfortunately, I didn't stop as expected and kept using. Smh.. This thread was made on Tuesday the 22 (which at that point I already had a few days under my belt of use at the dosage just stated) and now its Saturday the 26 and since I've made this thread I've been binging taking 150 mgs (5 Roxi 30's) a day until now.
I'm so dumb for not stopping and now I'm really worried about withdrawals.. What trouble do u think I'm in for now? This sucks.
I'm so dumb for not stopping and now I'm really worried about withdrawals.. What trouble do u think I'm in for now? This sucks.
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We can't keep doing this though man. If you want to quit using Opioids, we will help you do that. If you wish to keep using Opioids in as safe a manner as possible, we will help you do that. We can't, however, chart your dependence in real time based upon miniscule dosage changes. We couldn't do it in the first place.
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Please stop saying that Buckwheat. It's arbitrary and an estimate just like any other. No "expert" in medicine would ever make a comment like that on the subject of something that is actually impossible to clearly define.
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^I didn't say you did. I just meant that, as crazy as it may sounds, when something is prefixed with "the experts say..." it adds legitimacy to it in many people's eyes. Seeing as how it's not really defined and that this is really just another person's guess, I thought it would be best not to post it in different places. I meant no offense and my bad on misspelling your name, I didn't mean any disrespect by that.