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How long does it take to freeze acacia confusa?

.:Holy::Toast:.

.:Holy::Toast:.

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Sep 12, 2010
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The tek I'm looking at recommends at least two freeze and thaws but I can't find anywhere on the internet how long to leave the powdered root bark in the freezer for each time.
I was thinking probably 8 hours but I'm really not sure
 
It depends on how good your freezer is.

Keep it in there 'til it stops getting any colder ;)
 
.:Holy::Toast:. said:
The tek I'm looking at recommends at least two freeze and thaws but I can't find anywhere on the internet how long to leave the powdered root bark in the freezer for each time.
I was thinking probably 8 hours but I'm really not sure
Click to expand...

is this for tannin removal?
 
It's supposedly to lyse the cells.
I don't see why the acid cook wouldn't be enough but it's what a few guides recommend
 
Ok. I would also think that the acid would do it.
Do you HCl or vinegar?...I prefer HCl personally.
I've only used A. confusa once, and the NMT diluted everything to the point that I tossed it...neglected to defat it too.
Also, while I was looking at the freeze thing for acacia I noticed a tek to, supposedly, precipitate the NMT out at room temp...might be bullshit, but also...might not...?

https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=38967

It's from The nexus and, IMO, the "Nexians" are a bunch of pretentious, pompous fuck sticks...you never know though..."even a blind pig finds an acorn now and then."
Might still be worth a look.
 
I use vinegar. This is my first extraction, I wonder what the solubility differences there are with naptha between DMT and NMT.
I don't see why the defat would be necessary with an A/B don't the fats stay dissolved in the naptha after you basify and crystallize?
 
I'm not sure but I think that the fats may make crystallization more difficult, but not sure.
Might try a small amount w/o defat and see. Once you basify there's no going back for a defat.
I'm sure there are some good teks out there for acacia.

as for solubility differences between NMT & DMT...I think they are almost identical and hard to separate once extracted.

You might check out that tek that claims to be able to separate them.
My opinion of that tek is that the person who wrote the tek just assumed the room temp precipitate was NMT...What I think is that his solvent was saturated at a higher temp and when he let it sit the DMT/NMT both precipitated out together.

Wish I were more help.

Also...this freezer thing to burst the cells...it's done with acacia that is soaked in water...right?
I can't imagine it would make any difference on dry bark.
 
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Toast, I pulled this off the Nexus:

With MHRB getting scarce in some parts of the planet it looks as though some nexians will be looking to acacia as possible source. One drawback being NMT impurities.

Sister just came across a paper she would like to share with you (US patent 3131221 see attachment). It has a facile method for removing primary and secondary amines from a mixture containing tertiary amines. When a solution containing a mixture of amines is treated with CO2 a carbamate is formed with both primary and secondary amines that will form a precipitate that can be filtered off (possibly requiring refrigeration).

FYI - DMT is a tertiary amine, NMT is a secondary amine, so the NMT will precipitate as a the carbamate leaving the dmt in solution, which can then be recovered by distilling or evaporating your solvent.

CO2 can be generated by dripping vinegar onto baking soda, there are several ways a CO2 generator could be made in the ghetto using pop bottles and tubing.

P.S. Shulgin (god love him!) used acetic anhydride to do the same thing. CO2 is a lot safer to work with and otc to boot.


This sounds feasible to me, but maybe Sekio can take a look...he's the chemist.
 
I guess this could be done. I don't see why it wouldn't extend to tryptamines. Try it and see, if it's that easy then it's probably worth a look. (Use something like hardware store sulfuric/phosphoric acid = high acidity per gram rather than 5% vinegar for your gas generator, unless you like generating gallons of dilute brine.)

As for breaking cells: The idea is you're supposed to (slowly) freeze water-saturated MHRB or whatever and let the ice crystal growth destroy the cell walls. Boiling does the same thing but at a higher temperature. So does letting the plant material sit with lye or acid.

Typically people defat initially at least with "straight to base" teks because the fatty acids have a tendency to form soaps (...fatty acid salts) if you basify them, and soaps are good at making messy emulsions (layers never seperate). With acid/base teks the fatty acids should stay water-insoluble when you extract them with acid.

NMT and DMT are pretty much twin brother and sister, they're damn near impossible to seperate with "easy" methods. (same solubility, similar melt point etc)
 
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