How fast does dopamine depletion occur with 5HTP

[Byzek]

Im taking 5 htp and it helped me but after 5 weeks i have to say that tolerance builded up.
i read this :

Administration of 5-HTP alone is contraindicated for depression and any process involving a catecholamine component due to its ability to facilitate depletion of these neurotransmitters. 5-HTP should be administered carefully in patients because depletion of dopamine and norepinephrine may exacerbate existing disease processes or precipitate onset of catecholamine-related problems.

Administering serotonin or dopamine amino acid precursors should never involve administration of only one amino acid. Improperly balanced amino acid precursors are associated with decreased efficacy, increased side effects, and depletion of the nondominant system.

How fast does this depletion occur and how can i reverse it ? because i assume that it already happened to me thats why i need more dose of 5htop

 

[Keif' Richards]

Hey Byzek! We are happy to try and help you with this stuff, but I have to warn you, its complicated.

We are talking about some pretty complex variables here. When you ask questions about these neurotransmitters and processes, we cannot provide any answer above and beyond a very approximate one.

I know it is far from what you are probably after, but the only thing I can say with certainty, is that taking this medication has made you feel a certain way, and that by ceasing your use of this substance, you can probably reverse some of these negative symptoms.

Questions like "how depleted, how much, how fast, when will?" are going to be very difficult. At the end of the day, you will likely be the most effective and accurate answer to your own questions, essentially, you know how these substances effect you and have effected you. You have to use this knowledge as a benchmark and experiment with changing the dosages to find what is most effective/beneficial for you.

I'm going to move this to neuroscience in the hope that they can be more helpful with some of the specifics. We are happy to help you with whatever you need, but I think these guys will likely be of more help.

 

[4meSM]

I don't know how long it would take, probably varies from one individual to another, but higher doses would make it happen faster.

AFAIK it can be prevented by taking it with either L-dopa or tyrosine (dopamine precursors) and ideally with methionine and cysteine as well. But it's not as simple as taking a bunch of each, you need to figure out the right doses.

The easiest way to prevent it is by stopping the 5-htp if you're experiencing side effects...
Its not a harmless substance if abused.

 

[Byzek]

I don't know how long it would take, probably varies from one individual to another, but higher doses would make it happen faster.

AFAIK it can be prevented by taking it with either L-dopa or tyrosine (dopamine precursors) and ideally with methionine and cysteine as well. But it's not as simple as taking a bunch of each, you need to figure out the right doses.

The easiest way to prevent it is by stopping the 5-htp if you're experiencing side effects...
Its not a harmless substance if abused.

its a fucking great substance i love it but i think it lost his efficiacy.
in the beginning i just took 400mg now up to 4g.
the question ist: how can i restore the efficacy ? stop taking it and taking l tyrosine or l dopa ? how much of these substances ? and isnt l dopa somethingfor parkinson ?
mhhh maybe i have parkinson now because imvery very irritated and i feel sometimes like someone with parkinson

 

[4meSM]

its a fucking great substance i love it but i think it lost his efficiacy.
in the beginning i just took 400mg now up to 4g.
the question ist: how can i restore the efficacy ? stop taking it and taking l tyrosine or l dopa ? how much of these substances ? and isnt l dopa somethingfor parkinson ?
mhhh maybe i have parkinson now because imvery very irritated and i feel sometimes like someone with parkinson

L-dopa is a dopamine precursor, the same way 5-HTP is a serotonin precursor. Yeah it's used to increase dopamine levels in people with Parkinson's disease.
In your case I'd just stop for a while and let the body go back to baseline.
Sorry I don't know about the exact amounts of L-dopa/Tyrosine and sulfur amino acids, would have to do some research but you might not even need them, just taking a break from 5-htp might be enough.

What exactly are you seeking from 5-htp?

 

[Byzek]

L-dopa is a dopamine precursor, the same way 5-HTP is a serotonin precursor. Yeah it's used to increase dopamine levels in people with Parkinson's disease.
In your case I'd just stop for a while and let the body go back to baseline.
Sorry I don't know about the exact amounts of L-dopa/Tyrosine and sulfur amino acids, would have to do some research but you might not even need them, just taking a break from 5-htp might be enough.

What exactly are you seeking from 5-htp?

I have mild depression and anxiety im 27 years old and i wanted to start with antidepressant.
I took escitalopram just for 2 days and i wanted to kill me lol.
BUT i found 5htp and it was like the holy grail for me omg.
Just after 3-5 days of taking 200mg-400mg made me so calm, relaxed and my libido came back and anxiety completely disappeared.
Oh man it was sooo nice finally i could live my life. But then it stopped to work, the last time it worked was on sunday.
Maybe it stopped due to overtraining or too much of ot. I dont know.
But i want that magic feeling back.
And at first i just took 200mg then 400 then 800mg till i landed last week to up to 4g per day.
So i assume my dopamine is completely depleted and thats why it does not work anymore like on 600mg.
Im crying

 

[Byzek]

I found this:
To achieve optimal efficacy, minimal side effects, and prevent depletion of other amino acids and neurotransmitters, 5-HTP must be administered in proper balance with dopamine amino acid precursors along with proper levels of sulfur amino acids

Optimal group results cannot be obtained without MTO. The following are group effective therapeutic ranges defined by MTO during simultaneous administration of serotonin and dopamine precursors:

• 5-HTP daily dosing values > 0 to 2,400 mg per day.
• l-tyrosine daily dosing values > 0 to 14,000 mg per day.
• l-dopa daily dosing values > 0 to 2,100 mg per day.

The effective therapeutic ranges listed above are independent of each other. For example, in one patient, a daily 5-HTP dosing value of 2,400 mg per day with an l-dopa dosing value of 30 mg per day may be required for proper balance of transport to place both serotonin and dopamine in their respective Phase 3 optimal ranges.
Another patient may require 25 mg per day of 5-HTP with 2,100 mg of l-dopa for Phase 3 optimization. Dosing values required for transporter optimization are highly individualized.

Well the question is how do i found out how high the imbalance of my neurotransmurters are?

 

[Byzek]

I read that if dopamine depletion is great enough the effixiacy of 5htp or the effects of 5htp dsappear.
So in my case: my dopamine must be depleted now

 

[bongdong]

@Byzek I don't want to pollute your thread, is it ok if i interject a question of my own that's related to your initial post?

 

[Byzek]

@Byzek I don't want to pollute your thread, is it ok if i interject a question of my own that's related to your initial post?

Yes

 

[bongdong]

Well, background here is that i had a pretty fierce crash some years ago, physically and mentally, and i'm still working my out of this or try to improve things.

So i thought of 5-HTP as more of a supplement. A way to make sure my body has at least the building blocks to make serotonin (and consequently melatonin) if he chooses to do so. If not, then not and no harm is done. I think of it as quite a different approach to e.g. antidepressants, which i'm not a fan of! I have a lot of this stuff (5-HTP) at home, but havn't taken any for maybe a year or so, cause i use other things like cannabis on occasion and i think this alters my system more and i don't wan't to mix these too.

The doses i took before ranged from 50mg to 200mg, maybe 250mg at most. Is this a waste of time and money in general, since i never had any effects @Byzek described? But again, i never thought that more 5-HTP necessarily means more serotonin/malatonin in my body/brain at a given time, is that correct?

If this supplementation approach makes any sense, is it to expect that dosages of up to 600mg/day fuck with ones dopamine in the long run, cause i definitely don't want to mess with that? After my incident i lost a huge amount of motivation/drive, but i don't think my dopamine system is broken per se. I just lost the interest in many (common) things, but still can go to great length to achieve, regarding the few things left i care about.

I'm in favor of orthomolecular medicine in general, since i had good results with other compounds and i was just wondering about giving 5-HTP another go and then read this thread.

Greetings

 

[Byzek]

hmmm well first of all im not taking any other drugs or medication - so i dont have any other substances with could interfere with 5htp.
and i dont have any crazy past like most of u guys which had heroin and lots of other drugs at same time and shscizophrenia and whatever.

and yeah i guess the more 5htp u take the more serotonin u have and the greater is the depletion of dopamine AND other hormones like epinephinrenorpeinehrine.
i guess the more dopamine u have the better is the efficiacy of 5htp.
thats why i take a b reak and will buy l tyrosine and will take it like 15g for 2-4 weeks.
i hope i will restore it.

i love the feeling so much it was better than G or meth or whatever it made me soooo horny and i hope it will come back soon
but its jsut a supplement so take it

 

[Byzek]

ey guys do u think that 5htp can depletes dopamine like meth can ?=

 

[4meSM]

Dosing values required for transporter optimization are highly individualized.

Well the question is how do i found out how high the imbalance of my neurotransmurters are?

Yeah that's why I told you that I don't know the right dosage. You would have to find out through trial and error, try to find a testimony or a "trip report" of someone who's in a situation similar to yours. There are supplements containing both 5-htp and tyrosine (or L-dopa) in a single capsule, maybe do some research on that and try to figure out a sensible dose.

thats why i take a b reak and will buy l tyrosine and will take it like 15g for 2-4 weeks.
i hope i will restore it.

Don't start with the highest recommend dose of tyrosine... That's why you get into problems. When you're trying a new substance always start with the lowest recommended dose (or at least with a lowish-normal dose) and slowly work your way up if you feel like it helps.

You may have some degree of dopamine depletion but you're not fucked man (and you definitely don't have Parkinson's IMO), try not to obsess too much about it. Just stop the 5-htp for a while and see how you feel.

5-htp is not a magic cure for depression, it hasn't even been proved to work long term. But if you truly want to try and use 5-htp long term (after your break) then take a lower dose and complement it with some dopamine precursor and sulfur amino acids (methionine&cysteine).

 

[4meSM]

i love the feeling so much it was better than G or meth or whatever it made me soooo horny and i hope it will come back soon
but its jsut a supplement so take it

5-HTP isn't supposed to make you feel like that anyway. If you continue to use 5-HTP to chase that kind of high you're going to run into problems unfortunately, and it will probably stop working entirely in addition to making your depression worse in the long term.

 

[Byzek]

Yeah that's why I told you that I don't know the right dosage. You would have to find out through trial and error, try to find a testimony or a "trip report" of someone who's in a situation similar to yours. There are supplements containing both 5-htp and tyrosine (or L-dopa) in a single capsule, maybe do some research on that and try to figure out a sensible dose.



Don't start with the highest recommend dose of tyrosine... That's why you get into problems. When you're trying a new substance always start with the lowest recommended dose (or at least with a lowish-normal dose) and slowly work your way up if you feel like it helps.

You may have some degree of dopamine depletion but you're not fucked man (and you definitely don't have Parkinson's IMO), try not to obsess too much about it. Just stop the 5-htp for a while and see how you feel.

5-htp is not a magic cure for depression, it hasn't even been proved to work long term. But if you truly want to try and use 5-htp long term (after your break) then take a lower dose and complement it with some dopamine precursor and sulfur amino acids (methionine&cysteine).

But for me 5htp is magic

 

[Byzek]

Yeah that's why I told you that I don't know the right dosage. You would have to find out through trial and error, try to find a testimony or a "trip report" of someone who's in a situation similar to yours. There are supplements containing both 5-htp and tyrosine (or L-dopa) in a single capsule, maybe do some research on that and try to figure out a sensible dose.



Don't start with the highest recommend dose of tyrosine... That's why you get into problems. When you're trying a new substance always start with the lowest recommended dose (or at least with a lowish-normal dose) and slowly work your way up if you feel like it helps.

You may have some degree of dopamine depletion but you're not fucked man (and you definitely don't have Parkinson's IMO), try not to obsess too much about it. Just stop the 5-htp for a while and see how you feel.

5-htp is not a magic cure for depression, it hasn't even been proved to work long term. But if you truly want to try and use 5-htp long term (after your break) then take a lower dose and complement it with some dopamine precursor and sulfur amino acids (methionine&cysteine).

well the plan is this.
im tarting l tyrosine tomorrow with the highes possible dose whch is 15g.
the higher the dose the higher srotonin depletes and the faster i can take 5htp again.

 

[Byzek]

Something happened last sunday im desperate as fuck and i cant talk with nobody about it coz doctors dont know shir haha ist funny.
I have no power anymore

 

[bongdong]

@Byzek

Don't start with the highest recommend dose of tyrosine... That's why you get into problems. When you're trying a new substance always start with the lowest recommended dose (or at least with a lowish-normal dose) and slowly work your way up if you feel like it helps.

well the plan is this.
im tarting l tyrosine tomorrow with the highes possible dose whch is 15g.
the higher the dose the higher srotonin depletes and the faster i can take 5htp again.

Why ask for advice, when you are not ready to listen? Anyway. Non of my business..

 

[Byzek]

Im listening.
What do you think of medikinet?