Has any one in the US tried this defense for mdma....

felix77

felix77

Bluelighter
Joined
Nov 30, 2009
Messages
418
Has any one charged with possession of pure MDMA tried an 8th amendment defense?

Since there is sufficient evidence out now that the US government sponsored fake medical studies, then banned all legitimate studies for MDMA for years. There is strong evidence that MDMA has no major side effects when taken responsibly.

While that may not justify it's legality due ti irresponsible use, that could justify it's reclassification. We all know that its interdiction leads to more harm then good, causing MDMA pills to be cut with harmful chemicals.

So basically, if a person could argue that being prosecuted under a schedule 1 substance law for a nearly harmless drug constitutes cruel and unusual punishment, the courts could overthrow the hateful restrictions on MDMA and even overturn many convictions for MDMA. This could lead to a reclassification, drop on controls of Safrole and a release of political prisoners.

It was the US's political agenda and false science that spread the anti-MDMA through the governments of the world. A blow in American courts could cause a reevaluation of the drug worldwide.
 

" There is strong evidence that MDMA has no major side effects when taken responsibly. "

MDMA is Nero-toxic i am pretty sure
 
Not according to the latest Switzerland and US studies, o the German studies, or any valid studies for that fact. Of course the fake studies quietly retract their statements after the fact claiming it was in error. After spreading their bullshit as loudly as possible.
 
Unbreakable said:

" There is strong evidence that MDMA has no major side effects when taken responsibly. "

MDMA is Nero-toxic i am pretty sure
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The bolded part is the key. In animal studies, neurotoxicity is dependent on things such as dose, route of administration, co-administration with other drugs and ambient temperature. I'm sure there are many more factors, but that's off the top of my head.
 
Pot is schedule 1, and i don't consider it to be as harmful on the body as MDMA.....

Plenty of people get locked up for that one though....

Moral of the story, don't get caught with beans....

avoid carrying more than you would feel comfortable eating.... and if you see blue lights in the mirror, eat that shit quickly.....

A better solution would be to use your 4th amendment rights to deny a search of your vehicle. Don't keep them on your person as they can ask you to step out of the car to search you for their safety....

I know so many potheads that have been arrested because they decided to let the cops search the car while riding with pot.... They find it, and just because you let them search they are not going to go easy on you. Your going to be arrested.

You could tell them you do not consent to a search and they might call in a dog but if not your free to go....And if they bring a dog your still fucked.
Or you could just let them search and be fucked.
 
I can't say I agree that pot isn't worse then extasy. According to the British study, pot is the 11th most dangerous drug I believe while extasy is 18th. High THC, low cannabidiol pot causes psychosis, hurts the lungs and saps energy.

Dancing on E is the opposite effect from a basement stoner. Of course it can be abused, but it is better to have people abusing pure MDMA then the things they are swallowing now.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2cAFRAX3Gs&feature=player_embedded
 
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felix77 said:
I can't say I agree that pot isn't worse then extasy. According to the British study, pot is the 11th most dangerous drug I believe while extasy is 18th. High THC, low cannabidiol pot causes psychosis, hurts the lungs and saps energy.

Dancing on E is the opposite effect from a basement stoner. Of course it can be abused, but it is better to have people abusing pure MDMA then the things they are swallowing now.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2cAFRAX3Gs&feature=player_embedded
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Please tell me you are fucking joking. WEED is worse for my body and mind than MDMA. What a laugh dude, seriously. I've been getting high almost every day for three years and getting through work and school every day of my life perfectly fine. However, when I take MDMA I find school extremely difficult until I'm out from under that ecstasy cloud. Honestly, do some more research. Suggesting someone swallow pure MDMA rather then other pills as if it is actually safer for your brain to do so is irresponsible of you and not harm reduction in the least. On another note, Please tell me you didn't believe the bias study that claims weed causes psychosis. That is also ridiculous bullshit. There is no definite correlation between pot smoking and psychosis. Exacerbation of latent schizophrenic genes may be caused. Which does not affect most of us. Just for good measures... my source http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2009/09/02/cannabis-schizophrenia.html
 
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Guys, you can throw sources back and forth all day long, a million different studies can say a million different things. The bottom line is, we don't know for sure what can do what, other than the first hand knowledge we have of ourselves, and other people we've seen go through these things. Every single study is going to be biased, it's unavoidable, some will be less biased than others and that's the best we can go off of. But the truth is, no study is 100% foolproof, and no scientist is completely bias-free.

Also, I would definitely not agree with the statement that i would be better for people to abuse pure MDMA rather than weed or something.... I know people that have been smoking weed for years now, they can still function like normal human beings. Anyone who has abused MDMA too much is very noticeable, dependent of course on how much they abused. But I would definitely rather see someone smoke weed every day for years, rather than see someone who has rolled once a week for a year.
 
felix77 said:
Look at the link and read. THC causes psychosis.... I think 3 years of smoking has clouded your reasoning.

Here you go sparky, by England's top drug scientist. I didn't say cannabis should be illegal, I said it was more dangerous then MDMA.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2009/nov/02/david-nutt-dangerous-drug-list
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Maybe if you weren't so quick to dismiss actual evidence you would have actually read the article.

Previous research has suggested cannabis use increases the risk of being diagnosed with either psychosis or schizophrenia.

This latest study, led by Dr. Martin Frisher of Keele University, examined the records of 600,000 patients aged between 16 and 44, but failed to find a similar link.

"An important limitation of many studies is that they have failed to distinguish the direction of association between cannabis use and psychosis," the authors write in the September edition of the journal Schizophrenia Research.
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Notice that this was reported in September of this year. The list you provided was developed in 2007 before these new doubts were cast. Not to mention your link states that cannabis caused 19 deaths. Which is so off the wall and nutty it makes me question the credentials of this "top scientist" in the first place. What process could he have possibly gone through to conclude marijuana caused 19 deaths?! If this is the same process he used to rank each drugs dangers, I question the integrity of the entire list.
 
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The actual documentary that I watched reported no deaths due to weed. That is not why it was considered more dangerous then MDMA. Weed was up on the list, while still quite low, because of it's long term effects. Psychosis caused by high THC breeds lacking in cannabidiol.

As for experience, I can tell you , I can spot a heavy pot smoker, they think they are normal and fine but they are usually a bit hazy. MDMA, the next day I get hazy, due to heavy activity during the night but I feel good after. Like a sense of peace. Weed, while hash has been good to me, strong American green bud made me paranoid and gave me walking pneumonia.

While I think weed should be legal, I think the chemical content should be controlled. Weed's dangers are not death, unless by smoking and driving. They are by the psychotic effect some modern breeds cause. I'd say 44 so called ecstasy death, most likely from tainted ecstasy is a much lower danger then reactions to over the counter medication. Especially when we consider Australia claims to have half a million users a week.

For my long term health, I don't consider a few hits of a hash spliff a couple times a month any risk at all. Just like I don't consider two pills ever couple of months a risk. When it comes down to it though, I would like to see weed controlled like alcohol , while E I would like to see harm reduction and tolerance. I acknowledge that weed has more of a place in society then E. Full legality should be granted. I still think E is a less harmful drug when taken properly, but it has a higher chance of being badly abused.
 
dude felix... you are LOST just stop. Have you by the way seen the long term effects of MDMA. MDMA is neurotoxic and much more harmful on the brain and mind than weed in every way. Sure (HEAVY) stoners are noticeable by being hazy and such but still lead normal lives if they want to. Notice i said heavy because the people who smoke once a week and such have absolutely no differences in their life (i was one) but now i smoke everyday and have noticed a small decline in short term memory and sure i am a little bit hazy but that's pretty much it. With only 1 MDMA session (3 pills) I notice a huge decline in cognitive thinking , memory, thought process, concentration and more when i went back to school the day after. I have noticed a lot more negatives with my RESPONSIBLE spaced out mdma usage (1 yr.) than my pretty Heavy usage of pot for more than 3 years. Not only that.. but when you stop smoking for even a few days straight you notice that all the negative effects which aren't alot from pot disappear while with mdma people have struggled for years sometimes to battle what has happened.
 
felix you've obviously rotted your brain. you find one study that finds weed is more dangerous than MDMA and it's written in stone? why don't you try this lil experiment:

smoke 3 joints a day for a week, record how you feel.

then try takin 3 pills of ecstasy (avg dose of 100mg or so) a day for a week, then let me know how much better you feel :)
 
As long as this is in Legal Discussion, let's only focus on the legal aspect.

What are the constitutional challenges that can be raised against punishment for possession of MDMA?
 
None in my opinion. You can't overthrow a drugs schedule class just because you personally deem it safe. There is much more research done on marijuana PROVING it's medical benefits and look where it's at, schedule I. I think if this course of action was possible it would have happened with another drug long ago.
 
!_MDMA_! said:
felix you've obviously rotted your brain. you find one study that finds weed is more dangerous than MDMA and it's written in stone? why don't you try this lil experiment:

smoke 3 joints a day for a week, record how you feel.

then try takin 3 pills of ecstasy (avg dose of 100mg or so) a day for a week, then let me know how much better you feel :)
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A person who fills their argument with logical fallacies really has not place to insult. The issue was never daily use of ecstasy, it is responsible use.

What you people who would die to represent pot do not realize, this study was done by the whole team of top British drug scientists. Their results are back up by the German study, the first to contradict the danger of ecstasy. Two Swiss studies show no long term side effects when taken responsibly. Now, there is a new American study showing that ecstasy has great therapeutic benefits with no known long term side effects.

I have not smoked pot throughout my adult life, I have done ecstasy maybe 7 times in the late 90's and early 2000's. I am a 3.75 GPA student of web design, yeah it is just Axia but I doubt you can argue my brain is rotten. I'll try and avoid resorting to insults, but it is really hard when arguing with obvious pot heads.
 
kandytime said:
None in my opinion. You can't overthrow a drugs schedule class just because you personally deem it safe. There is much more research done on marijuana PROVING it's medical benefits and look where it's at, schedule I. I think if this course of action was possible it would have happened with another drug long ago.
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The whole premise of your augment is based on the fact that it is my opinion. Just as the head British scientist stated, there has been evidence out for years now that MDMA does not cause long term harm to the brain, heavy dosage causes temporary serotonin loss but all evidence indicates it is recovered over time, from a few weeks to a few months, depending on how much MDMA is used.

If multiple studies are presented as proof, along with the statements from the scientists who claimed brain damage recanting their evidence, a strong case can be made that a schedule one prosecution is unjustified, therefore unconstitutional in America.

There are currently no studies that stand that claim brain damage. The 1989 US study that showed the famous holes in the brain have been rejected by neurologists. The 40 times drop of serotonin is not physically possible. Also, the altered images shown to the public were out of context in the first place, it was supposed to show serotonin loss, not brain damage. Those dark parts would still be living brain tissue, but as the images were fake.

The Parkinson study in the US was disproved, the administrator claims that meth was given to the monkey by a mislabeled error from his supplier. The supplier claims he is a liar and intentionally caused a false positive for MDMA and brain damage.

So please, stop using false generalizations and claims about how you "feel". I "feel" like pot did a lot of harm to me. I "feel" like ecstasy didn't. I know how people who really want pot legal can quote "a study some where" but I'll link mine if you want to link yours....
 
If we can't get any discussion going on a solid legal topic, I'll have to move this thread. Any suggestions as to which forum it should go to?
 
I'm very cautious to believe the studies that concluded weed causes psychosis. Any study can be tweaked to show almost anything. It could be that patients who would have been psychotic anyways were more likely to smoke weed than the general population. Then scientists went through the records of psychotic patients, found that they were more likely to smoke weed and concluded that weed causes psychosis. Except it's the other way around. I'm very weary to believe any of these studies as they are mostly funded by the gov't which wants to keep drugs illegal.

Just like recently I read about this research that found that women who eat steak and hamburgers are 20% more likely to develop heart disease and stroke. OK. Big difference b/w eating steak and eating hamburgers. To get results that would interest me they would have to do two separate studies, one for steaks and one for hamburgers. Steaks are made of just meat, while who knows whats in hamburgers. So if u believed the results of the study u would say that its bad for women to eat steaks, while who knows whether it is, sine they were grouped with hamburgers which arfe very different things from steaks. That research must have had ulterior motive.

Just like the imaging studies done on brains of non drug users and E users. There has been recent studies saying that u can show anything by tweaking those images.

Just cuz something is in the form of a reserach papers doesn't mean it's true. That is even more so for statistical analysis of populations. Scientists can come in with some end result in mind and can show almost anything to be true.

Don't believe everything u read or hear.
 
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