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DMT "aztec" feeling

its just odd that it has that ancient feeling to it, tribal, old, teaching, with those patterns, very loving mother nature feminine feeling, and i saw this budda type guy, i didnt hardly know about any ancient stuff like that until the blast off experiences
 
Why we see the particular patterns we do when we are tripping I have no idea about, but all tryptamines and phenethylamines (5HT2 agonists?) can cause visuals that are "aztec" or "maya" in style. A particular style of Jagged geometry. You actually see some of it in most south and mesoamerican art of native origin.

I really don't see the mystery here, we know these people did use mushrooms, peyote, morning glory seeds, ayahuasca, the list goes on.

Occam's razor (lol 8)), indian eats mushroom, see's closed eye visual pattern, get's inspired and incorporates it in his painting, building, weaving etc depending on his craft.
 
Fagott said:
I really don't see the mystery here, we know these people did use mushrooms, peyote, morning glory seeds, ayahuasca, the list goes on.

Occam's razor (lol 8)), indian eats mushroom, see's closed eye visual pattern, get's inspired and incorporates it in his painting, building, weaving etc depending on his craft.
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But how come hindu art looks just as psychedelic as south american? I think any art that uses colour is going to look sort of psychedelic.

I'm not convinced the use of psychedelics was as widespread in these tribes as we tend to think. We all think that they must've all sat round and tripped together - that's not what the evidence shows. Mostly one guy in the tribe was viewed as a "witchdoctor" and he was the only guy who tripped.
 
Ismene said:
But how come hindu art looks just as psychedelic as south american?
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Funny, last time with 4-aco-mipt, my room was filled with floating hindu deities of all kinds, more or less friendly looking. It was all the more surprising since i'm in no way obsessed with hinduism, and at that time had been far removed from any kind of hindu art for a long time. It lasted the whole trip, with lots of tantric images too.

OEV's on low dose vaped DMT are very "azteky" for me, especially if i look at wooden poles/beams. Also surprising since there's absolutely no internal reason i would have more aztec inspired vision than say celtic or egyptian ones.

Speaking of which, i once K holed all the way to the Great Pyramids and the Sphinx. Cosmic energy was FLOWING to the pyramids, and when it hit them it shot upwards in a spiral. The Sphinx, with his long front paws, was holding on for dear life! Turns out he is actually facing east, facing the rotation of the Earth, holding on to keep up with the mighty movement. K usually gives me very scifi-ish visions, also buildings and streets with people.

Kratom usually has me facing walls of flowing leaves...

No rational way to explain this as far as i see, but extremely interesting nonetheless!
 
if i had no knowledge of aztec, mayan, patterns, symbols, whatever, im certain the trips would still be the same. yeah same K gives me some very scifi sorta stuff. incredible
 
There is some research that's been done that when you stimulate nerves in the brain with certain electrical impulses you create "psychedelic" images. It might just be what that particular impulse in the brain creates.

I'm certainly aware of the feeling that it's aztec but I've never really seen any ancient aztec art that looks too similar. There's certainly paintings by people who've taken ayahuasca that's similar - but that isn't ancient art, that's stuff that was done 20 years ago. I often see arabian jewel type shapes more than anything aztec.
 
Ahh fair enough man

its all so fast and hard to comprehend, no idea what i see half the time

I remember being guided through something very similar to this though, check this out at 2:15 onwards

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4_pQI8MmAc

that was after all the fast geometric stuff
 
You tried Al-lad yet colt? That's been giving me very similar "aztec" like visuals too! Surprised at how similar to oral DMT it was visually, more similar to DMT than LSD a lot of the time.
 
Nah but been hearing some good stuff about it, sounds awesome, might have to give it a try. is a very friendly and loving?
 
interplanetary said:
absolutely fascinating; fractal geometry that is.
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if it hasn't been said, i obviously recommend listening to some terrence mckenna ramblings on the subject of language and cultural development through the use of psychedelics.
 
Hm, interesting thread, Dan!

On one hand, there was a study that showed that weed/psychedelic use makes people spot patterns and coincidences more easily, hence conspiracy theories being popular in the scene. On the other hand, I've had CEVs that look a lot like artwork I've seen on mayan temples etc.
 
I've never tried DMT but I have something similar when I've had 2C-I.
Each time I would see ancient Egyptian symbols and feel like I was part of a computer programme.
I felt like it was like being part of something akin to the Matrix films.
Strange, but very interesting feelings indeed.
 
i have always seen more indian style patterns and hindu gods/godesses than anything native american on dmt. expectation and personal preferences can play a huge role.
 
always felt that the whole thing is the same for everyone.

i say tomaytoe, you say tomahtoe.....

Is it any surprise that we all see the SAME thing but describe it in a DIFFERENT way!?

Really people...be it chemical confusion or subjective inference, just appreciate the fact that we all just tripped our balls off and reported the same sparkly cool looking patterns. IMO its just a chemical reaction that leads to a predictable end: red + yellow = orange

Then some-how, we think these patterns speak to us in a way that makes us feel as though our ancestors are sitting right next to us laughing their asses off too.

It is too easy to get caught up in the self-indulgence of wishful thinking that we are all one and that this is all happening right now. Fact is, there is a past, present and future which remain intangible....best you can do is make the best with what you were dealt. And on that note, I conclude my nightly trippy rant.

What are you doing right now (besides reading BL forum posts)?
 
has anyone had 'mesoamerican' visuals without a psychedelic? I blasted off on nitrous and K and coke and saw my "self" or ancestor as a shaman in a tribe a thousand years ago and felt like a "psychic intermediate"
..the whole thing felt south american.
 
Ismene said:
But how come hindu art looks just as psychedelic as south american? I think any art that uses colour is going to look sort of psychedelic.
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I don't think ancient indian art is very psychedelic, honestly. Not in the way that native american is anyway. I think it's just because hindu imagery/symbolism is used a lot in modern psychedelic art. third eye and yantra's, and all that stuff. so it's something we associate with each other. hippie, hindu, psychedelic....

As "Black" is saying, he is getting hindu style visuals when he smokes DMT, and even seeing hindu deities. I totally agree that our expectations, or maybe it's rather our interpretation, that create what we "see" when tripping. Sure.

But I don't see why that is mutualy exclusive of the native americans being inspired in their art work by their use of entheogens (because say what you will, it's a hard fact that they did use psychedelics)

Actually for me it's been the other way around than Coltdan. When I had my one break through experience on DMT I didn't think it was particularly "aztec", but this winter I went to Mexico, the Yucatan peninsula, home land of the maya civilisation (they still live there, by the way, people think they're extinct or something, well they're not!)

Anyway, I went to see the ruins Xichen itza and Ek'balam (last one was the best by far) and all the ornamentations really stroke me as eerily DMT'esq.

On the other hand, 2CI particularly always gave me extremely "sun wheel" aztec style closed eye visuals.


Ismene said:
I'm not convinced the use of psychedelics was as widespread in these tribes as we tend to think. We all think that they must've all sat round and tripped together - that's not what the evidence shows. Mostly one guy in the tribe was viewed as a "witchdoctor" and he was the only guy who tripped.
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You are partly right, For sure it was mostly the priest and noble classes mostly who would indulge. Their use of entheogens was diffinitely more ritualised than ours is today, were it's either mostly recreational or for personal spiritual purposes (or both).

I do think you underestimate how big a role entheogens played in their society though.

It's all here in this article:Aztec use of entheogens

Sure, wiki might not always be factual, but I think that the evidence is in place. How about a first hand account for instance?
Both Fray Bernardino de Sahagún and Fray Toribio de Benavente Motolinia describe the use of the mushrooms. The Aztecs would drink chocolate and eat the mushrooms with honey. Those partaking in the mushroom ceremonies would fast before ingesting the sacrament. The act of taking mushrooms is known as monanacahuia, meaning to "mushroom oneself".

"At the very first, mushrooms had been served...They ate no more food; they only drank chocolate during the night. And they ate the mushrooms with honey. When the mushrooms took effect on them, then they danced, then they wept. But some, while still in command of their senses, entered and sat there by the house on their seats; they did no more, but only sat there nodding."
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Or how about XOCHIPILLI? Aztec god of entheogens.

xochipilli.jpg
 
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Do you trust those "interpretations" of old aztec artifacts tho fagott? I remember I always believed that famous "mushroom man" image that Mckenna always shows. A few years later I found out that's actually an impression, drawn by Mckennas wife, and when you look at the actual thing she was drawing it's nothing like a mushroom man.
 
:) I don't know anything about that MCkenna dude, he never interested me for some reason.

but sure, I trust the Mushrooms effegies that archeologists have found in digs. And as I said, I trust first hand accounts written down by the conquistadors (or the monks who came with them rather)
 
Fagott said:
You are partly right, For sure it was mostly the priest and noble classes mostly who would indulge. Their use of entheogens was diffinitely more ritualised than ours is today, were it's either mostly recreational or for personal spiritual purposes (or both).

I do think you underestimate how big a role entheogens played in their society though.
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True - mushrooms may have played a bigger part in the past but I was really struck when I read a book about Maria Sabina - she was literally the only person in the entire village who ever took mushrooms. And she only took them to diagnose illness like some kind of witchdoctor. So whatever tradition there was had died out by the time Wasson got there.
 
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