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Different Methods of Preparation Affecting the 'Cactus Spirit'?

Jabberwocky

Jabberwocky

Frumious Bandersnatch
Joined
Nov 3, 1999
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My question to all those experienced: Is there any difference in subjective effects by making the tea or doing an Acid/Base extraction to get a purer mescaline?

I have a friend who strongly suggests not doing the a/b tek on the san pedro cutting, since it violates the nature of the spirit that inhabits the cactus and producces a trip of lesser value. He suggests just freezing it and then smashing it up into a sludge and maybe reducing on low heat and drinking that.

What do you think?
 
I never noticed any difference except that if I didn't do an extraction of some sort (a simple a/b on cactus is 100X more of a pain in the ass than mimosa) I got violently ill for the majority of the experience if I could even manage to get all the slime down.

The best and easiest way to go about it is to get dried cactus, do 3 soaks in 91% IPA, evap then add citric acid H2O to the dried stuff and let that sit in the fridge for about a week. After that you'll see a nasty green layer on the bottom and a wonderful golden suspended juice which you should pour off and drink over the course of 15-30mins.
 
could anyone suggest an easy/effective way to prepare fresh cactus?
 
^^^ Check out the Big Mescaline thread...its got some good advice. Now back to whether or not the different methods of preparation affect the Mescaline Spirit God Plant Link (to another dimension) - or something like that.
 
"I was quite convinced that a spirit inhabited that cactus, and that it came through more clearly than other sessions because I had treated it properly. Desiccation or excessive boiling seem to kill part of its spirit. Freezing seems to be a good way to 'put it to rest'. On a more scientific level, I'm not sure why this cactus is so sensitive to the way it is consumed. Perhaps it is because it contains a special synergistic mixture of alkaloids and some are destroyed more easily than others. Also freezing would break down the cell walls while not degrading the compounds as boiling might." - Anonymous

freezing and juicing seems the way to go..
 
i don't think the cactus spirit would like to be ripped out of the ground, sold for a huge profit, frozen, chopped up, made into tea and all that shit.
I've only drank the tea, so I have no basis for comparison. but the tea of about a thick 6-8 inch cutting knocked me on my ass for 8 or so hours.

i think the way in which it's consumed and what you do after you consume it effect the trip the most. kinda like the obvious differences you'd have during a trip where you spend the whole time playing video games or when you spend the time meditating in nature. it's probably a combo between the way prepared and set and setting. but not completely one or another.
 
I thinkthis person encouraged growing your own cacti from a young age, ideally from cuttings from friends.

Thanks for the input though...I tend to lean toward doing an a/b extraction on it and plugging the alkaloids...since I fear nausea...

But, I respect this type of Plant God view...and am interested in hearing more thoughts on it..

peace and love
ss
 
My "Entheogen Community Politically Correct" answer is: Yeah, respect the spirit of the plant.

My real answer is : The "spirit of the plant" bit is wishful thinking that adds spice and magic to ones world view. I don't believe jesus loves me either.

That being said I don't doubt that extractions may miss goodies that contribute to the experience and this may be more of an issue with some species (bridgesii). However, since the "ghost in the plant" view seems very popular and somewhat pc in the entheo community it may be making a widespread contribution to "set" in the form of particular expectations.

I plan on extracting some of my cactus , eventually, and then seeing for myself.

BTW, based on how much effort is involved in harvesting, despining and drying these cactus, I don't think "huge profit" is all that fair. Especially considering that the people in peru who harvest this cactus aren't exactly cruising the town in bimmers. If people in the US were employed doing the same thing for such a niche market, the cactus would be alot more expensive.
 
IME, the cactus spirit is much more benevolent and therapeutic and loving if one makes a gently brewed cactus tea (this is for t. pachanoi and other cacti whose volume is too great to simply chew down, though I have just chomped down on san pedro before with great success and zero nausea) as opposed to an a/b extraction.

Well-brewed cactus tea may be made into a psychedelic margarita with a bit of refrigeration, salt, and lime. I feel this method is the easiest, least painful way to ingest cactus without violating the energies of the plant.
 
I believe the cactus spirit hates people to eat it's skin in either raw or tea form and this is why it ensures all who do suffer intense nausea.

After an acid/base extraction the nausea is eliminated. Surely the cactus spirit (i like to call him "Cactus Jack") is telling us a message by this :)
 
^^^ This 'cactus jack' - he sounds like an odd fellow!

Yes...I am leaning toward extracting it...but, we will see. I respect my friend as well as I respect the idea of a plant spirit (I have no first hand experience to back it up, on either DMT or mushrooms).
 
The first time my pet rattlesnake experienced Trichocereus pachanoi, he despined it, cored it and cooked it in a big pot for a whole day, cooking it down into a black tar, being careful not to burn the contents of the pot. Amount used was 14" x 3" cactus sections per person. Trip resulted in a very deep, calm, peaceful experience. Not much in the way of visuals, but very pleasant. Expecting a mushroom or DMT-like trip will result in disappointment, though.

The only thing that seems to be in violation of the cactus spirit is smoking tobacco. For some reason the cactus spirit, Mescalito, did not seem to approve.

Another time, boiling methanol was used to extract some cactus 'skins' of the peruvianus variety, that had previously been soaked in sulfuric acid(corrosive stuff!). The result was about 1-1/2" long needle-like brown crystals. Yummy. For some reason, mescaline seems for the yang, and some people see mescaline cacti as their root of being. Don't know, but can surely understand why that might be. Anyways, that's about all. :)

specialr
 
Mescalito was a name Carlos Castenada made up because he was confused by the mescal bean - none of the indians actually refer to peyote or san pedro as mescalito.

The indians refer to the cactus spirit as "Cactus Jack" ;)
 
...I am leaning toward extracting it...but, we will see. I respect my friend as well as I respect the idea of a plant spirit (I have no first hand experience to back it up, on either DMT or mushrooms)

I'd definately recomend an extraction once or twice just to give you a nausea free mescaline trip but it's such a pain in the arse extracting from thick cactus snot. I'd rather do a dozen DMT extractions than have to do one cactus snot extraction.
 
Ismene said:
Mescalito was a name Carlos Castenada made up because he was confused by the mescal bean - none of the indians actually refer to peyote or san pedro as mescalito.
Click to expand...

thank you.

lately i'd really been questioning the validity of his books... after all, he was an author, and authors write books. and books can be fictitious... and that isnt to say i dont think there is anything of value in them... the kind of ideas adressed in those books (if your into that sort of thing), are alot more deeply rooted than his stories, and there is alot of very extensive reading you could do, before (some people) would say you even began to grasp the idea of the concepts that he seems to throw around lightly.

take it with a grain of salt i guess is the expressioin that comes to mind.

i respect and like the idea of certain plants having their own spirit to them, but i think that the concept is more or less just something to associate with in your mind so your intentions are clear when you expirience something that (you hope) the drug will produce.

now days, modern science tells us what is that makes us trip, and it's more closely related to physiology and psychology than it is to what partucular spirit inhabits what plants... and with the times being the way they are, people are thinking more about getting fucked up than respecting a plant-spirit.

when people eat 'cid, no one is concerned with what spirit inhabits the chemical... it's all talk about set and setting, and what you may be psychologically prone to. why? because we know it is produced in a lab, as opposed to grown naturally, and dont associated it with the spirit of a living thing.

all that "spirit of the cactus" stuff came before we even knew how the drug technically worked with our brain, and IMO was more of a guideline to keep yourself attuned to some kind of possitive thought, in order to maintain that set, or setting, or psychological state or whatever. i'm not going to attest that i know or retain a whole lot of knowledge in southwestern shamanism, but it's pretty ellaborate and there is alot to cover that we can already explain in our own way befitting our own culture.
 
I like your comments, ski_wampas. Here are some somewhat disjointed comments of mine...

Just because we understand the physical base of someone's experience does not mean that exhausts all aspects of reality involving the mind of that individual. Neurophysiology is great at explaining things in one sense, but cannot capture everything psychology has to say about the mind, nor can it capture everything philosophy has to say about the mind (this is a common view of different explanatory levels).

But, I think you're right about the plant spirit stuff being a good device to cultivate a proper set/setting for the experience.

Although, I cannot help but continue to keep having these strong and overwhelming sensations of being graced with a powerful presence when I take strong psychedelics (DMT, mushrooms, and yes even LSD). I feel an entity presence that wants to manifest itself.

So, I believe our brains are hardwired to react like this...perhaps it is our way of making sense of the psychedelic state. It surprises me, because I have pretty strong physicalist tendencies (ie reality is nothing but physical). But, often things can be explained better by not appealing to the lower level explanatory fields (physics, biology, etc).

Anyways, thanks for your thoughts...peace...
 
i see it as both.
Things happen at so many levels. Spiritual, physical, psychological, etc...
Some things can only be known thru expierence though.

I think the spiritual realm is about expierence as it is in a non physical realm, so basically it is unprovable thru science, but only known thru expierence.
I dont think "natural" psychedelics have any more "spirits" attached to them (if any) than synthetic ones.
I have felt and seen strong sprits on both.

As to the OP-
I have only tried cactus by dried powder put into gel capsuls and eaten over a one hour period.
Erowid has a couple methods of making a tea.
As for an extraction, Eating cactus Vs. eating mescaline is different as the cactus contains more psychoactives than just mescaline alone.
 
Heh, when I prepared San Pedro, my GF wouldn't let me use anything plastic - just traditional stainless steel. Got to have a chat with the big bloke in any case.
 
Isn't expecting the cactus to provide you the entheogen in the perfect form most suitable for the human body a little extravagant tho? The plant has gone to the trouble of creating the entheogen, the least humans can do is a little work to get it into the form that causes you the least nausea.
 
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