dexmethylphenidate vs. methylphenidate

[professor bob]

about an hour and a half ago, i consumed 40mg xr focalin. I used to take methyphenidate(ritalin), and 40 mg would have me tweaked out but im not sure if the two substances are equally potent at the same dose.

IS methyphenidate just stronger than focalin, or am i not just feeling the full effects yet because it takes longer to peak when xr.

I would like to know this because if it is just as potent as ritalin, I def cant take another one or my parents will know somethings up.

 

[Geaux Tigers!]

You're just not feeling the full effects because the peak plasma concentration in your blood reaches its maximum after about 4 hours. You will have to remove the time release mechanism on the pill in order to achieve the same effects as IR methylphenidate.

Also, I wasn't aware Focalin came in the 40mg. XR form. I thought the highest milligram tablet prescribed was 30mg. You need to be aware that Focalin contains on the active dextrotatory form of methylphenidate, dexmethylphenidate. Therefore, 20mg. Focalin = 36mg. of Concerta, 30mg. Focalin = 54mg. Concerta, because it only contains the active part of methylphenidate. Concerta is time released IR Methylphenidate and you can tell the dosage difference between the two forms.

Due to it being a different form of methylphenidate, depending on your metabolism, it may not be as effective in managing your ADHD symptoms as the normal forms of methylphenidate. You should consult your physician to determine a methylphenidate therapy that is most appropriate for you.

Let me know if you have any additional questions.

 

[Warm n fuzzy]

Why focalin and concerta? Adderall and dexadrine are much better they bring you down from your high gradually rather than just crashing

 

[Cane2theLeft]

^its probably what's available to him.

Dexmethylphenidate is about 1.7x as strong as methylphenidate.

In the future, please direct dosing and comparison questions to basic drug discussion.




--->BDD

 

[Geaux Tigers!]

Dexmethylphenidate is about 1.7x as strong as methylphenidate.

Good job. I couldn't remember the exact figure for this.

Also, poster Warm n Fuzzy brings up a great point about alternative stimulants. You may prefer the effects of amphetamine over piperidines.

 

[K'd-OUT-in-AZ]

According to prescribing it is supposed to be twice as potent. For instance if you are currently prescribed 80mg of methylphenidate (the maximum daily dose) you would be switched onto 40mg of Focalin. This doesn't mean that it is twice as potent. What Cane said sounds more correct

 

[Geaux Tigers!]

Dexmethylphenidate is about 1.7x as strong as methylphenidate. ]

This sounds pretty accurate and reasonable, however, I'm curious-- how did you obtain this information? I remember saying you once played around with Concerta (which I'm prescribed) and I'm sure we both understand how the drug works better than laymen. However, I could not find a single source with the 1.7 figure, however I do not have access to any databases on my personal computer.

 

[Cane2theLeft]

for anyone interested-

Although four stereoisomers of methylphenidate (MPH) are possible, only the threo diastereoisomers are used in modern practice. There is a high eudysmic ratio between the SS and RR enantiomers of MPH. "Dexmethylphenidate" is a preparation of the RR enantiomer of MPH.[4][5] In theory, d-TMP can be anticipated to be twice the strength of the racemic product.[6] However, certain authors recommend that the ratio is ~70% increase in potency upon enantiopurification of the racemate.[1] (source)

 

[professor bob]

You're just not feeling the full effects because the peak plasma concentration in your blood reaches its maximum after about 4 hours. You will have to remove the time release mechanism on the pill in order to achieve the same effects as IR methylphenidate.

Also, I wasn't aware Focalin came in the 40mg. XR form. I thought the highest milligram tablet prescribed was 30mg. You need to be aware that Focalin contains on the active dextrotatory form of methylphenidate, dexmethylphenidate. Therefore, 20mg. Focalin = 36mg. of Concerta, 30mg. Focalin = 54mg. Concerta, because it only contains the active part of methylphenidate. Concerta is time released IR Methylphenidate and you can tell the dosage difference between the two forms.

Due to it being a different form of methylphenidate, depending on your metabolism, it may not be as effective in managing your ADHD symptoms as the normal forms of methylphenidate. You should consult your physician to determine a methylphenidate therapy that is most appropriate for you.

Let me know if you have any additional questions.

I took two 20mg xr. It kind of stimulated me, but the extended release mechanism must not allow the dexmethylphenidate to reach the levels i need for it to be useful. Do you think crushing up the little balls in the capsule would make it instant release

 

[professor bob]

Why focalin and concerta? Adderall and dexadrine are much better they bring you down from your high gradually rather than just crashing

A docter prescribed me xanex, after taking it for 3 months I lost a bottle, had horrible withdrawls, and eventually had a psychotic episode that landed me the psychward, then rehab.

Biw, the addiction psychiatrists im forced to see are not very liberal when it comes to controlled substance. SO far, its been a three month process for them to consider giving me back my vyvance

 

[Geaux Tigers!]

I've never had to deal with the removal of time release on Focalin XR, however, I imagine that crushing up all the beads would release the time release mechanism the same as it would for Adderall XR.

In terms of harm reduction, you're abusing the drug to achieve a high rather than relying on the therapeutic attributes of it. Titrate to a higher dose and use the XR mechanism to your advantage. I'm sure you'll feel more alert throughout the day rather than a rather subpar high and a really bad comedown, typical of a lot of methylphenidate experiences.

 

[K'd-OUT-in-AZ]

Yes, you can crush the beads to break the time release.

I found Focalin to be more smooth than Ritalin, not so much of a crash and lasted longer, yet more subtle. I do not find it to be twice as potent. I needed nearly just as much to provide relief of my symptoms. But just like methylphenidate I didn't find it to be effective. I need amphetamines for my ADD

 

[professor bob]

I agree completely

Yes, you can crush the beads to break the time release.

I found Focalin to be more smooth than Ritalin, not so much of a crash and lasted longer, yet more subtle. I do not find it to be twice as potent. I needed nearly just as much to provide relief of my symptoms. But just like methylphenidate I didn't find it to be effective. I need amphetamines for my ADD

Based on my first experience(in the last 24hrs) with focaalin xr, I would say that a focalin dose needs to be much higher than a ritalin dose to be equally effective.

I used to take 54 mg concerta (time release methylphenidat) and I would-what a consider-tweak out. tweaking out imo is charactized by euphoria, excessive energy, enhanced memory, heightened logical skills, excessive confidence. AND swaety pits, dry mouth, bad breath, compulsive behiors, and eventualy crash

TOday, however, i had acces to Focalin 20mg xr pills. At 10 am i took 3 of them, which had only a subtle effect,soat 5:30 i decided to open the other five 20mg pills, crush the beads(which hypothetically transforms them into instant release),

I know i might be going overboard, but its an experiment to see if the xr mechanism can be bypassed, if its as equally potent as ritalin, or if its a ritalin with no perepheril effects.

I hope that i can take such a large dose, get the positives of tweaking out without the negatives. Ill be able to answer all these question in the next few hours

 

[K'd-OUT-in-AZ]

Focalin is more potent than Ritalin but it just doesn't seem like it because it is smoother, doesn't have the edge Ritalin has. That's just from my experience.

Please update.

 

[Geaux Tigers!]

You may gain benefit from consuming IR dexmethylphenidate over the equivalent dose of IR methylphenidate. My hypothesis is that you will be only slightly less tweaked out. I take a 36mg. time released capsule of Methylphenidate (Concerta) and remove the time release and I noticed it isactually less speedy than a 40mg. of IR Methylphenidate. I'm pretty sure that the 4mg. difference isn't significant enough to impair my judgement of the effects. I am curious of your experience with the IR dexmethylphenidate!

Agreed, please update.

 

[professor bob]

Focalin is more potent than Ritalin but it just doesn't seem like it because it is smoother, doesn't have the edge Ritalin has. That's just from my experience.

Please update.

IMO Focalin is less powerful than ritalin. If i would have eaten100 mg instant release methylphenidate (ritalin), i believe it would have been between 2 to 4 times more potent than the100 mg Crushed dexmethylphenidate

I also observed that although dexmethylphenidate has comparitivly less "stimulant euphoria" than its isomer methylphenidate, its much smoother on your peripheral nervouse system. Hell, i could even eat a plate of food at the dinner table ( it would make the rents suspicous if i didnt)

 

[K'd-OUT-in-AZ]

IMO Focalin is less powerful than ritalin. If i would have eaten100 mg instant release methylphenidate (ritalin), i believe it would have been between 2 to 4 times more potent than the100 mg Crushed dexmethylphenidate

I also observed that although dexmethylphenidate has comparitivly less "stimulant euphoria" than its isomer methylphenidate, its much smoother on your peripheral nervouse system. Hell, i could even eat a plate of food at the dinner table ( it would make the rents suspicous if i didnt)

dexmethylphenidate is more potent because it is the d-isomer which produces more of the positive effects. It may actually be the peripheral effects which makes methylphenidate feel more potent. More tweaked out. It has more of an "up and down" feeling like cocaine while dexmethylphenidate is smoother.

 

[tomatalli]

^^ Everyone is different, maybe he needs a racemic mixture to get better effects opposed to just the d-isomer. Just like with amphetamines, some people get better effects with the racemic mixture adderall opposed to dexedrine witch of course is just d-amp.

 

[phatass]

with methylphenidat and d-methylphenidate being the only ADD meds on the market here (apart from modafinil),
i was also offered to swith to the dex version.
i have 40+10mg ER Ritalin to take in the morning... would 40mg Ritalin + 10mg dexmethylphenidate be more "advantageous" for therapeutic reasons? i presume so...
i asked for 40+20mg Ritalin last time and got 10 er instead of 20...

i'm not complaining, but might ask for 40mg methyl + 10mg d-methyl next time.... seems like the dex is a bit smoother on the come-down, less psychological want/desire to chase an IR "high" etc.

experiences, sources and opinions comparing the two are welcome!

Won y'all

 

[Ethan8]

Guys confused here ,what is focalin ,a XR ritalin.

Am I right in thinking Concerta is the original adderal xr?

Also the 80mg max dose mentioned above ,is that just a US guideline or pretty much worldwide where rit is available.

I love ritalin but its so short lived ,come down is no prob as I'm clona + the ritalin reacts with tramadol but I am growing fast from the gym so my 40mg ritalin a day is not cutting it.

Amphetamine of any kind are banned here in Thailand yet I was hospital offered genuine Concerta but no generic available hence my thinking concerta may not not be adderal now??