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[Combo Subthread] Psychedelics & Amphetamines

swayne said:
hey man, not doubting you at all, but how come erowid hasn't recognized this myth yet, it seems they may still be fueling it:

Note: the fuzzy coating on the outside contains cyanogenic glycosides
which can make you really sick if you eat enough (same kind of stuff in
apple seeds).

this can be found here : http://www.erowid.org/plants/hbw/hbw_info1.shtml

so assuming this is in fact a myth, perhaps erowid should be made aware of this by someone with authority so they can edit it and spread no more misinformation.
Click to expand...

Erowid is a data base of information. Some of the information may be incorrect. Erowid makes no claims of a "poisonous fuzzy layer." In fact, and I quote...Erowid says of the seeds, "Many experience nausea, which may be caused by the layer of fuzz on the seeds, though this is disputed."

There is no evidence that the coating on baby woodrose seed is what causes the nausea. Considering that this fuzzy layer weighs a few milligrams (I scraped 8 seeds once a weighed the coating), there is no molecule potent enough to be present in it to cause the sickness.

Morning glory seeds have no fuzzy coating and they make me just as sick as the woodrose seeds do.
 
So I have 16 hwbr seeds here, I'm thinking of maybe today eat them with a good friend of mine.
How long should I trip with 8 seeds , first time doing it ?
I'm presuming 6 hours,is that correct?
 
BHWR and amphetamines are freaking horrible, the 'phets override any desirable psychedelic effects yet leave you with the lethargic nausea... yuk, would never repeat it. (mind you I ate them at an outdoor party in tempratures of 45C and more, not a nice setting, believe me!)
 
Why the hell would you wanna mix a hal with a stimulant anyway? Hal's are beautiful enough by themselves, who the hell would need to add anything to that?

And besides ... amphetamines? Yuck.
To me that's like having a joint's worth of some beautiful Bubblegum buds and spinning that with some dark tobacco to get 2 joints out of it ...
Save the speed for another day.
 
I don't understand it either, apparently we went to a college party the night of the day he wanted to try the HBW's and wanted to work it the whole night through with drinken alot of beer and chillin'out on the LSA's. But as he said. He didn't do them anyway. Great party though ! :)
 
morninggloryseed said:
Erowid is a data base of information. Some of the information may be incorrect. Erowid makes no claims of a "poisonous fuzzy layer." In fact, and I quote...Erowid says of the seeds, "Many experience nausea, which may be caused by the layer of fuzz on the seeds, though this is disputed."

There is no evidence that the coating on baby woodrose seed is what causes the nausea. Considering that this fuzzy layer weighs a few milligrams (I scraped 8 seeds once a weighed the coating), there is no molecule potent enough to be present in it to cause the sickness.

Morning glory seeds have no fuzzy coating and they make me just as sick as the woodrose seeds do.
Click to expand...

sorry man if i sounded like an ass, its just that you are the only person i know that has somewhat direct contact with the people at erowid, and they seem really great at editing misinformation from what I have seen. I don't know where the original author came up with this stuff, but at first when I read it there and didn't know it was a myth, I though it was true and Im sure many other people have too.
 
swayne said:
sorry man if i sounded like an ass
Click to expand...

I didn't suggest you sounded like an ass, but I just wanted to make it clear that Erowid assembles its information from a variety of sources. It is a database. Yes, the Erowid staff does do a great deal of writing, but they are not responsible for what is on links they find and place in the database. They are not responsible for what others say.

Kinda off the subject, but I am in the process of writing FAQs on the "fuzzy layer myth" of baby woodrose seeds, as well as a bit of info on adrenochrome (which is active, though the book Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas in not a good reference for what it actually does.) I will present both of course when they are ready and they will include proper citations of relevant data.
 
Last edited:
http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=7110

argyreia nervosa seeds- or hawaiin baby woodrose- those are what we've eaten to trip... this may be why they are bad. the bark on the outside of the seeds contains cyanogenic glycosides- which even if peeled can leach into the seed during the soaking process or can exist within the seed itself naturally. i really suggest not taking these and if you do, be sure to boil them in hot water and peel them while they are still moist( this can kill the enzyme that initiates the poison- but not always entirely successful in doing this) get ALL OF THE BARK AND HAIRY STUFF OFF!! I still don't suggest trying this. i don't know why they websites that tell you how great they are don't warn you about this kind of thing:
Click to expand...

from a trip report on erowid. this says that the chemical (cyanogenic glycosides) mainly is active in the bark or coating. it also says that it may exist in the seed naturally. now what i would like to see in that faq is that the whole seed contains this product and not only the coating and fuzzy layer. also, if it is possible, the rough estimates of 1 mg cyanogenic glycoside per 1 g of argyreia nervosa seeds so we can calculate our own ld50. ;)

btw, adrenochrome faq huh, i like the sound of that, hurry that one up morningglory !!:)
 
I will present my findings when ready, but I have searched a LARGE variety of journals on this subject and there is simply not one that is about cyanogenic glycosides being found in the seed bark. They all find it in the seed itself.

This subject was specifically addressed in the Journal of Psychedelic Drugs (now the Journal of Psychoactive Drugs) in an article on the seeds in 1977, and it came to the same conclusion that I have...there is no proof that the seed bark is anything but inert and that scraping the seeds is a waste of time. What makes you sick is the soap-like glycosides found inside the seeds.

Indeed from my own personal experimentation, I have conducted many sessions with seeds I scraped and seeds I didn't. There was no difference in the amount of nausea produced. Others with me have agreed.

As for that report Blowmonkey, he provided no citations for where he came about this information, that the bark is the source of the glycosides. Anyone can say what they want, but it needs to be backed up by fact. He did not back it up by fact and if that author is reading this, I would love for them to contact me.

There are glycosides in both baby woodrose seeds and morning glory, but they are inside the seeds. They are not water soluble, so one can remove them by performing a simple water extract. But I find the nature of the trip different, and not as desirable.
 
can you do something about that, putting in an edit of somekind saying this only were his beliefs and not actual facts. it is only misleading and confusing. it would be great if you finish that faq, really is the one thing missing in the lsa vault.

about the water extraction, i thought the glucosides also were extracted, good thing you mentioned it, i will conduct a little experiment myself when i finally get around trying the seeds again. " the nature of the trip is different ".. that just sounds like you're talking about mescaline and cacti, gotta see for myself.;)
 
BTW, when I say I've done research I don't mean I sat at my computer and typed "baby woodrose seeds" into google. I mean I have visited multiple libraries in multiple cities in multiple states (yes I go to the library on vacation :) ) and looked at their microfiche archieves as well as their hard copy journal archieves referencing both Argyreia nervosa as well as the known glycosides found in them. Nothing ever comes up that finds anything in the seed coating. The seed coating isn't even mentioned in most except when describing what the seeds look like.

If their was some study done that found glycosides in the seed coating, it is VERY obscure and safe to say few who study entheogens have ever seen or heard about it.
 
Blowmonkey said:
can you do something about that, putting in an edit of somekind saying this only were his beliefs and not actual facts. it is only misleading and confusing.
Click to expand...

I can't say it's not a fact, I can only say I ( and no anyone I know of that studies in this field) can find any study to show glycosides in the seed coating. I can however make an edit saying this can not be verified. I will bring this up to the powers that be.
 
HELLLOOOO, I did the HBWR seeds at 2pm, and planned to take the amphetamines at midnight or something. Damn, some people just don`t read the entire posts or something. blablabla don`t do hbwr and amph TOGETHER, I wasn`t planning on taking them to feel both of their effecs. I planned on taking amph. AFTER I was not feeling the LSA anymore. geez
 
Mushrooms + (Meth)-Amphetamines?

I've got an interesting question for you guys: have anyone tried this mix before? =D

I searched on erowid but could not find experience reports for this combination.

We're going to a psychedelic rave this weekend and I'm wondering if a reasonable amount of speed (1 pill) would mix well with a reasonable amount of shrooms (1 - 2g?). I'm really talking about a mild to medium mush trip here, nothing too wild/deep/visual ( because I think that a deep mush trip and speed would be hell)

Speed + pot works wonders, but for Speed -> Mushies at 1-2 hours interval I'm wondering if that would be too rough on the stomach, or if the effects would be too conflicting.

Any opinions / experiences on this? 8o

Thanks %)
 
try it Mushies -> Speed, it works better. ive tried this combo and its alright. the mindfuck is pretty wierd tho.
 
It gave me a wicked body buzz when I did that combo with some adderall.. Give it a try, but keep the amphetamine dosage low.
 
^ Yea i've done shrooms + adderral before.

Right before my peak i parachuted 60mg of adderral. It made the buzz so nice and i was very social with non-trippers, it was nice.

The visuals get massively downgraded with any amphetamine though. I found coke, meth, adderrall, and ritalin to downgrade visuals with all sorts of psychadelics.
 
I've tried a couple low doses of each before. Always with good results.

I'd deffinately stick to low doses though.
 
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