Canadian Marijuana legalization legislation at 12:05 pm EST tmrw - LINK

[Thomas Davie]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/marijuana-legalization-legislation-live-1.3197938

Thursday, April 13th, 2017

It should be interesting to see whether my optimism pans out....or not.

Very basically;

13 or so different models of distribution/retail sales, different tax rates, hours of purchase, age of access and
limits on public consumption. You'll have some provinces where there is likely going to be 'state' distribution while others will allow private stores.

I'm also going to assume an arbitrary amount of 1 ounce for legal possession/consumption (I've heard 30 g), the right to consume on private property and the right to cultivate 4 plants in your residence.

I'll update this post/thread with some information tomorrow


The link is currently active, but with no live content

Tom

 

[Yourbaker]

This is the blissful moment of imagination, thoughts of a better world dancing through our heads, pot-topia until..... they post the real rules and we can get back to wishing we lived in Amsterdam.

I am overly optimistic this time though, the politicians are getting older and nothing beats up old age like weed.

 

[Thomas Davie]

Very quick summary

Federally set minimum age of 18, although provinces can raise it higher. Considering that one of the stated goals is to reduce/eliminate the black market, I don't see any province raising the minimum age above 19.

Government did not set price or tax rates, leaving that up to the provinces. Tax could possibly be based on weight or potency. Little if anything mentioned about $ at all. Similarly, distribution and retail sales are also left up to the provinces.

It is an offense punishable by up to 14 years in prison for providing, selling or giving Marijuana to someone under the age of 18. Same thing if you get an 'under 18 involved in a Marijuana crime'.

Possible ban on driving and up to $2,000 fine for driving within 2 hours of having registered over a 2-5 ng/ml THC limit in the bloodstream. Being actually within that limit will net a 24 hour driver's license suspension.

But, up to 30g legal, as is the choice to process it into another form as long as flammable substances are not used in said processing.

Also, up to 4 plants per private residence/dwelling. Not per person, but per residence. 100 cm/40 inches in height. No specific mention, but I'm assuming you're allowed to keep the output of these 4 plants even if it exceeds the legal limit.

I say up to 30 g and 4 plants, because each province could theoretically reduce it to a ridiculous 0.5g/age 55+ and 1 plant. This won't happen since the stated goals are 'protect the children and reduce the black market.

My take? Lot of charter of rights challenges gonna happen, specifically with possession limits (in my opinion).

Oh yeah, July 1rst - but it's illegal until 11:59 pm 59 seconds on June 30, 2018. Stores should be open at that date, sooner in BC (opinion).

Tom

 

[iksaxophone]

I was listening to an interview on CBC where a Windsor cannabis activist and lounge owner was talking about the effect on business.
More specifically, about how restrictive zoning of consumption and purchasing zones could result in a flood of Americans from Michigan, Ohio, and Illinois congregating in a tiny area of Windsor.

 

[Thomas Davie]

I was listening to an interview on CBC where a Windsor cannabis activist and lounge owner was talking about the effect on business.
More specifically, about how restrictive zoning of consumption and purchasing zones could result in a flood of Americans from Michigan, Ohio, and Illinois congregating in a tiny area of Windsor.

It's not just Windsor that could face traffic or congestion; it's people who live in the approach routes to our major cities (which are mostly less than an hours drive from the Canada/US border). I'm going to every city council meeting/MP/MLA meeting that has to do with Cannabis and press for very loose restrictions. There is absolutely no reason to continue to shove pot users into a corner.

Tom

 

[thujone]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opin...lth-oriented-cannabis-system/article34719764/

Dr. Benedikt Fischer is a senior scientist, Institute for Mental Health Policy Research, CAMH and psychiatry professor at the University of Toronto

...

There are several options for a public health-oriented cannabis distribution system in Ontario. We believe that the LCBO – the publicly run provincial monopoly for alcohol distribution – should be at its core. This is for several reasons. The LCBO has an existing province-wide infrastructure of outlets; it is an operation designed for and experienced in the handling of a psychoactive substance (alcohol); and it operates under a social responsibility mandate. Hence, it is a ready-to-go system well designed for the safe and sensible distribution of cannabis products.

...

Which brings us to the fourth element proposed for cannabis “distribution”: home growing. Federal legislation tabled allows for the growing of up to four cannabis plants in people’s homes for “self-supply.” We believe that this option is at categorical odds with public-health principles, and ought to be swiftly abandoned. The reasons? Just as we would not allow people to assemble fireworks or compound pharmaceuticals at home – cannabis-plant growing in homes brings environmental hazards, escapes the reach of any product safety or quality regulations, and brings ready risks for diversion that are virtually uncontrollable.

I'm just posting this to lay bare the ignorance of this person, who believes that a PhD is a license to spout complete shit about a topic he clearly knows absolutely fuck-all about. Please help fight this ignorance in whatever way you can; in eviscerating the credibility of the 'old guard' that still persists in hiding their folly behind credentials. For a better future there must be no tolerance for this kind of bullshit.

 

[Thomas Davie]

A couple of others things I've picked out of the legislation.

We are allowed to possess 30g of dried Cannabis or 150 g fresh Cannabis. Under the legislation, 5g fresh is equivalent to 1g dry. Further, we are allowed to possess up to 7.5g of concentrates (0.25 g concentrate is legally equivalent to 1 g dried Cannabis) and to make these concentrates as long as organic solvents are not involved; so you can make your own ice water hash, rosin or C02 oil legally.

Tom

 

[Egzoset]

Salutations ThujOne,
Salutations Thomas Davie,

...a PhD is a license to spout complete shit...

Welcome to Québec's new "transparent" reality, but i'm afraid you're sort of late as the horror show started last fall, close to halloween i think...

Among the 80 "scientifics" invited in Montréal there was:

...and:

And the party went on while it appears no credible counter-part was even invited, or ever seen on late TV news in any case...

...one of the stated goals is to reduce/eliminate the black market...

Good luck with that, i've recently evaluated the cost of prohibition to range around 99900 % net/clear, all expenses paid from the farmer to my table, using canola as my reference.

Do the math yourselves:

• Canola oil = 2.16 $ per litre
• CBD oil = 129 $ CAD for 60 ml

IMO taking such inflationi$t deci$ions while having access to this countries best ressources and intelligence (theoreticallly...) only spells "organized crime" again, laced with Hydrogen Cyanide from (BANNED!) pesticides, assorted with irresponsible voluntary blindness from Health Canada turned contemplative relatively to such LPs collusion, etc...

Globe & Mail: Canadians not told about banned pesticide found in medical pot supply (2016-Dec-29)

« Myclobutanil... ...found in product recently recalled by Mettrum Ltd... »
« ...known to emit hydrogen cyanide when heated. »

Their twisted logic was that smokers generate Hydrogen Cyanide anyway, so the consumption method would mask their tracks - ain't that clever?!!



Evidently Trudeau's self-serving political motive always was that they intended to tax it too, on top of their so-called "strategy"! Plain & simple...

...up to 14 years in prison for providing, selling or giving Marijuana to someone under the age of 18. Same thing if you get an 'under 18 involved in a Marijuana crime'.

Far from being a libertarian advocate promoting cannabic access for everyone including minors i predict this actually announces "legaleezed" kidnappings (and more), since it's obvious our Canuck constitution no longer suffices to protect the concept of a traditional/sacred family core.

Parents being parented themselves by the state is synonymous of war casualties at worse, invasive at best, Cultural Genocide one way or another. The do¢tors/therapi$ts making a dime out of "stoner"/"droÿé" 3rd-party inflicted misery must be salivating, drooling with anticipation!

Euh... M'well, i mean, so far those who don't just prefered to remain low profile, to say the least. In a very similar fashion to good cops protecting "bad apples", etc., etc.

Ain't it somewhat peculiar when "science" conveniently proves to allow abuse with zero liability??

As a matter of fact the Canuck land is home to all sort of cheats, on planet Itnoc...

Only 1 % THC, hey?...

8)

...a 2-5 ng/ml THC limit...

My guess is the deadly-armed para-military police forces also needed "stoner"/"droÿé" detectors... All there was to do is ask!

...up to 4 plants per private residence/dwelling. Not per person...

M'yeah, i'm quite ready to bet that's only because of the way "intelligent" (logging) power electric meters are distributed in our Canuck environment. No big surprize there: 1 meter per address!

Finally, does the law promissed at UNGASS 2016 happen to contain any progressist and/or pro-cannabic feature(s) assimilable to love instead of hate-speech?... Imagine, if only genuine love (vs "tough love") could be traded on speculative markets!...

Good day, have fun!!

 

[poledriver]

Why Critics Are Saying Justin Trudeau’s Weed Bill Is a Continuation of the War on Drugs

“It’s really a continuation of the overcriminalization of young black men.”

Prior to being elected, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said his government's approach to marijuana would be evidence-based—a contrast to Stephen Harper's tough-on-crime agenda, which included two-year mandatory minimum jail sentences for drug trafficking crimes.

However, when the Cannabis Act and additional legislation to overhaul impaired driving laws were unrolled last week, the government made it clear that it would be taking an aggressive approach to penalties for breaking the new laws.

For example: selling cannabis to a person under the age of 18 could result in up to 14 years of jail time (selling liquor to minors generally results in fines). And police will now be able to demand a breathalyzer sample from any driver, regardless of whether or not there is evidence to suggest the person is impaired. Currently, cops can only demand a breathalyzer if there's "reasonable suspicion" the driver is under the influence.


Critics say the laws treat weed as if it's worse than booze—an ideology that stems from the war on drugs—and that people of colour will be disproportionately targeted.

"This kind of approach isn't going to take down drug empires," said Toronto-based defense lawyer Annamaria Enenajor. "It will essentially penalize low level distributors who are barely out of youth themselves… who still have great potential to rehabilitate and become productive members of society."

During Thursday's rollout, Liberal MP and former Toronto police chief Bill Blair said someone illegally selling weed to kids is usually a "gangster in a stairwell." The reality, Enenajor said, is it's often black men in their early 20s who are from poor, racialized communities that start selling weed to their high school networks as a way of making ends meet.

"It's really a continuation of the overcriminalization of young black men who are involved in low level drug distribution."

Enenajor said being young is normally a mitigating factor for judges to consider during sentencing, but with these new proposed offences and penalty ranges, the government has created an overriding aggregating factor, under the guise of "protecting kids."

"It's based on fear which stems from this culture of the war on drugs," she said.


"I think there should have been some kind of language that takes into consideration more directly the systemic social, economic, and racial factors that perpetuate drug use and drug distribution in certain Canadian communities."

Ottawa-based attorney Michael Spratt told VICE the impaired driving bill presents its own set of red flags.

"A police officer can pull you over and detain you, not provide you a right to counsel, remove you from your vehicle and demand a sample of your breath for no reason whatsoever," he said. "We'd be fools not to think in a number of years we won 't see data showing that visible minorities are disproportionately affected."

Cont -

https://www.vice.com/en_ca/article/...k2017?utm_source=vicefbca&utm_campaign=Global

 

[thujone]

ughh Egzoset, those faces make me want to punch my monitor i feel like we're going to get screwed first by federal rules and then by provincial rules. i'm getting really sick of all this legalization circus, the medical benefits have been pushed to the margins and now everyone is just focused on taxation and the evils of "getting high". this situation makes me feel utterly disgusted.

 

[Thomas Davie]

ughh Egzoset, those faces make me want to punch my monitor i feel like we're going to get screwed first by federal rules and then by provincial rules. i'm getting really sick of all this legalization circus, the medical benefits have been pushed to the margins and now everyone is just focused on taxation and the evils of "getting high". this situation makes me feel utterly disgusted.

Not to mention the complete lack of clarity surrounding these new rules. F'r instance

I'm prescribed 3g/day. Am I allowed my 30g recreational on top of my 90 g?
I'm allowed to produce 15 plants indoor (5/g/day) medically, but 4 recreationally. Am I allowed to grow 19 plants? (with my 4 recreational plants being restricted to 100 cm in height or less)?
I'm allowed to travel anywhere within Canada with my prescription; including having it on the front seat of my car while driving. If I'm also carrying my recreational 30 g. does that have to stay in the trunk of the car?
My 15 medical plants would be subject to inspection; what happens to my recreational plants?
My medical plants wouldn't need a license; will my recreational plants?

It is a demoralizing, disheartening situation.

Tom

(But I'm still going to be first in line when the stores open - and the first bong rip of legal recreational weed will taste pretty good)

 

[thujone]

I would assume your MMPR allowances take precedent, either way it's a clusterfuck and understandably everyone is talking about how government here has once again taken a steaming shit into the business by prioritizing nanny-statism, which is something *nobody* wants.

Oh, nobody except the crony capitalists that stand to profit. A redditor has been good enough to provide us with a list of our contemporary robber barons abusing the system to suppress competition ahead of "legalization".

 

[Egzoset]

Salutations ThujOne,

ughh Egzoset, those faces make me want to punch my monitor...

MouHa! Ha! Ha! Thanks for the suggestion: Our Punch-Bag Corner, quite some highly motivating idea for a new mamoth/dedicated thread!...

...we're going to get screwed first by federal rules and then by provincial rules.

M'yeah, and if we focus on it too much, too long and too often that can only destroy our own quality of life for next to no good purpose. Not to mention it's just like a locomotive which never really stopped between the 2 regimes:

...
, the medical benefits have been pushed to the margins and now everyone is just focused on taxation and the evils of "getting high".

Indeed, that way the discussion can be polarized further while no critics call for the proper answers, with traditional journalists contemplative (including many more profe$$ionals), etc. Yet there can be no durable solution without us and our "intelligence" in cannabic matters, too bad we've been treated like some deadly epidemic plague (and the plant with it!)... It does hurt badly when having a growing sense of abandon & betrayal for about one half of the Canuck population while the other half would rather prefer to look at a mirage from elsewhere.

8)

Last of all, the lost statistically-ellusive children of planet Itnoc, serving as a screen-of-smoke decoy for zero good purpose. And so on, etc. So at this point IMO it's all meant to feed the court system for a couple decades to come, hence my favourite "legaleezation" expression for it, euh... Better keep calm and patient, like a stone!

Good day, have fun!!

 

[Egzoset]

Salutations Thomas Davie,

It is a demoralizing, disheartening situation.

Hummm... There could be even worse on my mind, just because these days it seems this is a world of extremes out there!



Lets see. Assume/imagine a virtual company develops 2 GMO Bio-Tracking Markers, 1 called "Evil" which is designed to contaminate outdoors "criminal" cultivations with defective hybridized pollen. The second one being named something like "Cap'tain Canuck", whatever, and it's for authorized "mari-caca" ONLY. As a complement only a few official strains can be marked, the rest being "illegal" or even a threath to the nation, humanity, etc., whatever it takes. The lie can never seem big enough, etc.

M'well, after a few human generations anything deemed "illegal" bears the "Evil" mark while none of what's sold via mail orders is without the "Cap'tain Canuck" genetic stamp... Anything in between being declared underground and utterly "criminal", etc., etc.

Maybe it's wild sci-fi at the moment but i still want garantees this can never happen.

Now the "elite" already tested their luck with Hydrogen Cyanide, euh... So, who can afford not to become increasingly worried about which sort of Pandora box MiniHarper's "legaleezation" might "accidentally" open - or what true socio-toxic devil this could unleash, exactly?!?

After all, Hilary Geller's contribution was less than "transparent" IMO, and she wasn't even really hiding, simply low-profile until needed. Mow many more like that is there, installed across our public institutions??

And no it's not Halloween.

Good day, have fun!!

 

[Thomas Davie]

Hi Egzoset -

The GMO aspect does have me worried a bit. That does play into only being allowed seeds/clone plants from an 'approved' source, which of course limits anyone's choice and freedom. I wonder if the plant inspection police (I'm assuming some provinces will license home cultivation and charge $) would take clippings and fine/punish you if it was not approved genetic stock.

I can also predict the inspectors will use rulers to ensure 100 cm height compliance. In that case, I will use LST to limit the height of my plants.

Tom

 

[Egzoset]

Salutations Thomas Davie,

...limits anyone's choice and freedom.

Listening at the traditional medias i'm under the persistent impression it doesn't really matter at all what "stoners"/"droÿés" might want. So, in addition i'd like to reverse the roles asking what's this obscure "science" which allows bigot anti-cannabic prohibitionists to take over our public institutions once installed as gurus?

...

Not to mention this particular Hilary Geller individual (previously mentioned) wrongfully considers smoking substitutes as e-Cigs and vaporizers are just equivalent (!), unable to differenciate aspects like the mercantile planetary-scale plague initiated in 1880 (cigarette/joint consumption method), the heavily-taxed socio-toxic industrial product which her own government still finds politically convenient as it is today: kaching!! $$$ Euh...

An coming brand-new "piss" industry, etc., etc...

...the plant inspection police...

It doesn't need to turn gross right away. It can proceed brick by brick as that's how the bigots are used to build their twisted "legal" contraption(s), for example starting with the 1885 "Loi de Pharmacie" (in Québec) declaring "Indian Hemp" on its "Poison" list: a blaunt undisputed lie supported by our "elite" of the time if you ask me... Followed by yet another Canuck lie in 1923, nation-wide this time. Then 1925 at the League of Nations, etc... So why would 2017 be any different?...

It works so well any self-serving profe$ional can continue to perpetuate the lies while denying real evidence on plain TV, doctor$/therapi$ts being protected by "medical" association(s), deadly-armed "justice" officers (those are syndicated...), etc., etc.

IMO our "drug" laws gone socio-toxic is only a hint how bad a few Comonwealth flag-holders have become, Trudeau included: it's a systemic issue that i like to call the "hate-of-love"/"love-of-hate" syndrome and this infection shows up everywhere besides a peculiar frenzy for extremes. Just like when nobody reacted in good time when Trudeau started broadcasting his mother's "science", because of false hopes.

Now who wants to grow their cannabis in some anti-nuclear bunker anyway??

...

Good day, have fun!!