Bupe Buprenorphine for depression?

[Manifespo]

Haha hurray im back to being a greenlighter!

 

[hamwaggle]

Not that I support this, but if you really want bupe it's very easy to fake an addiction...there is no real way for them to tell that you were an addict, especially if you say you have detoxed and want to get on bupe maintenance to avoid relapse. However my doctor started me on 16mg and if you have no tolerance and took 16mg you would literally be knocked out for days if not be dead. Be careful, why not see a shrink and let her evaluate her, you seem like someone who would respond better to an anti-depressant as well as benzodiazepines.

 

[cure.the.radio]

buprenorphine script given for depression

So I'm a recovering opiate addict. I've had some problems with pretty severe depression since my early teens. [I'm 21] Recently I started seeing a psychiatrist. I had to get on the call list so when they told me to come in out of nowhere, I was stoned and on neurotin, xanax, and vyvanse. I hadn't slept in like three days and probably smelled bad because I'd done nothing but walk around with my girlfriend in 100 degree weather at probably 95% humidity. Needless to say, he could tell I was fucked up. So he asked me to take a drug test after I gave him a very honest rundown of my drug history. Lets just say it was easier to tell him what I hadn't done. I took the drug test and went home agreeing to quit doing drugs so that he could prescribe some medication without killing me. So I did. I went back and took a clean drug test and we talked about the one thing I'd really ever been addicted to. Opiates. I used to bang. Mostly Roxy's but a fair amount of morphine too as well as the occasional opana [My fave so far]. I haven't used in at least 6 months and this guy, who comes off as pretty well read and intelligent, asks me if i'd consider buprenorphine therapy along with outpatient drug counseling. He explained it's partial activation of the mu receptor and its action on the kappa receptor and overall made a pretty convincing argument based on my somewhat limited knowledge of brain chemistry. [what little i do have is mostly pertinent to opiates]. He believes it would keep me off drugs and keep my from feeling depressed. If I did relapse and bang some opiates, it wouldn't matter cause they couldn't reach my brain. Seeing as I'm already clean, I'm not sure I want to face that hell again when it comes time to quit. But here I have a doctor telling me it will be okay to eat this incredibly potent opiate which is kind of what got me started to begin with. That being said it is also the only way I was able to quit. What should I do? He's my doctor and I have several friends that see him. They all trust his judgement, I have trusted it thus far, and he has a ton of school on me. Could it help? More harm than good? Is this even rational to consider given that I'm already clean and at half a year?

It is worth noting that this psych has a history of prescribing stuff off label. He's all about experimentation. I'm not sure I want to be his guinea pig but god damn... that is a hard offer to turn down. "Would you like some opiates kind sir?"

Yes. Fuck Yes, I would love some actually.

 

[martin33]

wish he was my psychiatrist

 

[tricomb]

Merging you with the megathread.

 

[cure.the.radio]

wish he was my psychiatrist

that's what I thought most people would say but the last thing I want is to end up addicted again really. But if it genuinely would lift this crushing weight off of me, I'd give it a shot. I just wanted some second opinons.

 

[Herbal~Jah]

What are the chances of finding a doctor to prescribe buprenorphine for mild-to-moderate depression with social anxiety/introversion and schizophrenia (the latter I think was schizoaffective and episodic induced by stress; the doctors I've seen think it's more long term)?

Also, has anyone tried buprenorphine as an antidepressant? Actually had it prescribed for this purpose?

Does anyone who'se tried it think it has greater antidepressant properties than other opioids due to being less sedating and especially due to it's being a kappa antagonist?

I for one think that Buprenorphine is one of the best "Anti-depressants" to every be discovered for people with severe diabilitating depression where the only thing to get a normal life would be a life-long buprenorphine "addiction." But i know there was some study at harvard in the late 90's proclaiming it to have remarkable 'anti-depressant' effects that were much better then any of the known/used anti-depressants like prozac and such.

 

[beengerman]

if you have been clean for 6 month just stick it out man.
sure some weeks are going to much harder than others,
but you've come so far, just do it.
Don't just go on it because you can finally get high from the doctor.

 

[XTCAKE]

I for one think that Buprenorphine is one of the best "Anti-depressants" to every be discovered for people with severe diabilitating depression where the only thing to get a normal life would be a life-long buprenorphine "addiction." But i know there was some study at harvard in the late 90's proclaiming it to have remarkable 'anti-depressant' effects that were much better then any of the known/used anti-depressants like prozac and such.

Yes, and I completely agree with you

I don't know how I feel about being on Suboxone for years, but as of now, I've been on it for 6 months (technically one year in the Suboxone program, but I took 6 months off to shoot dope and sell my subs during my relapse this summer). My doctor says he will basically keep prescribing it for "as long as needed, within reason". I have tried four to five different SSRI's and also a couple SSNRI's, and all they did was maximize my anxiety..I couldn't function due to the high levels of anxiety I experienced on these prescriptions, so I gave up.

I know that my depression has gotten so much worse because of my years of heroin use/abuse. So many people use the "what came first, the chicken or the egg" analogy when it comes to diagnosing a mental illness. Was the patient depressed BEFORE they began to use their drug of choice, or was their depression a result of their drug of choice use and abuse?

 

[Fender]

I'm sure you've received a lot of responses and I haven't read them all. But Buprenorphine is prescribed to those recovering from opiate/opioid addiction. It has not other uses except sometimes as a pain med IV for hospital patients already on it. Stay away from it if you don't need it for recovery. To the best of my knowledge, it has no antidepressive properties. I am pretty well informed on this subject as I have been prescribed this medicine for some time for its primary purpose. It's a mixed blessing. It certainly works as advertised, but you've effectively just traded one opioid addiction for another.

 

[XTCAKE]

I'm sure you've received a lot of responses and I haven't read them all. But Buprenorphine is prescribed to those recovering from opiate/opioid addiction. It has not other uses except sometimes as a pain med IV for hospital patients already on it. Stay away from it if you don't need it for recovery. To the best of my knowledge, it has no antidepressive properties. I am pretty well informed on this subject as I have been prescribed this medicine for some time for its primary purpose. It's a mixed blessing. It certainly works as advertised, but you've effectively just traded one opioid addiction for another.

Eh. Yeah, but for some it does have "antidepressive properties". I've also noted the added benefit of reducing my cravings of cigarettes. I know many that notice this, as well. I realize that the program itself is literally called "Opiate REPLACEMENT Therapy". I replaced my IV heroin habit with Suboxone (all legally obtained through my Suboxone doctor). I, personally, try to look past the fact that I am simply "replacing" my drug of choice with these orange rectangles. By taking Suboxone daily, I don't have to cop on some sketchy block. I don't have to pawn my stuff for a fix. I don't have to ruin my veins. It's such a safe thing, to me. I do not pay a co-pay for my Suboxone (thank you, BlueCross insurance + Suboxone discount card!), so I am really taking my sub program seriously. I don't for one second take this shit for granted!

 

[Ralphsixer]

My Experience So Far

What are the chances of finding a doctor to prescribe buprenorphine for mild-to-moderate depression with social anxiety/introversion and schizophrenia (the latter I think was schizoaffective and episodic induced by stress; the doctors I've seen think it's more long term)?

Also, has anyone tried buprenorphine as an antidepressant? Actually had it prescribed for this purpose?

Does anyone who'se tried it think it has greater antidepressant properties than other opioids due to being less sedating and especially due to it's being a kappa antagonist?

I have found a psychiatrist willing to accept the possibility of that which my own experience has convinced me completely of...suboxone is a wonder-drug for treating MY depression. After years of Paxil, Zoloft, Wellbutrin, Alcohol, Xanax, Marijuana, Oxy, Cocaine, and all the other prescribed and non-prescribed substances that I tried, one day I was given a tab of suboxone. All my Oxford House room-mates had been noticing my increasing despondence, isolation, absence of appetite, drawn shades, bedridden utterly depressed state. "We cant stand to see you like this anymore" one of them said "see if this helps at all." He gave me a 8mg tab and told me to stick it under my tongue. Within 5 minutes I started feeling better. 10 minutes and I was out of bed. 15 minutes and I was, to everyone's amazement, especially my own, a normal functioning human being again. I will spare you the many metaphors and simply say that I had risen back to the surface of the earth from a deep chasm of misery and despair.

Because it worked for me does not mean it will work for you. I have a theory why it worked for me. Based on research I have subsequently done regarding post acute withdrawal syndrome (I abused alcohol for 25+ years), early childhood migraines and panic attacks, the possibility of type-2 bipolar and endogenous opioid deficiency, I believe the naloxone is just as important as the buprenorphine in the overall success of this drug for treating my depression...particularly in address to contributing factors, such as drinking. The cross-addiction that relates certain opioid receptors to ethanol receptors www.thci.org/Opioid/nov08docs/chilcoat.pdf may play an important role, given my extensive alcohol use. If opioids can cause alcoholic craving, then why wouldnt opioid antagonists be able to reduce cravings? And while the short-term effects of alcohol ingestion quell my anxiety and lift my mood, the long-term effects are devastating. I have never combined suboxone with alcohol...I have absolutely no desire (or probably more accurate) need to drink when I am on it.

No responsible provider is going to assure you that an anti-depressant medication is going to work for you. The reality is that anti-depressive medication treatment is basically a process of intuitive guesswork, and unfortunately, sometimes just plain trial and error. Im sure it frustrates the medical profession just as much as the patient, although it is the patient who continues to suffer (and pay the medical bills).

The logic behind not prescribing addictive substances to treat disorders when the possibility of a non-habit forming alternative exists is sound. Addiction is a BITCH. However, acute depression and acute chronic pain are bitches in their own right. Some people say they would take 10 years dying of addiction dependency over 40 years of chronic agony. Is it better to burn out, or fade away? In 8 months of use I had not developed a tolerance. Then my wife and I moved to CA (leaving my contact behind) so I decided to try Zoloft and Wellbutrin again. I experienced no withdrawl symptoms stopping suboxone. I had not become addicted to suboxone. However, despite the sunshine (why I moved) and the SSRI's, my depression did return...but not any worse than it was in the past. I seems I can keep burning as long as I am fading, and that is why I consider suboxone a wonder-drug for me, and myself very lucky.

With my long history of attempted medications and testimony from my wife, I was recently able to get a legal prescription for suboxone. I have not yet discussed a treatment plan with my psychiatrist, but I do intend to attend intensive outpatient counseling to root out any emotional component(s). It was thought for the longest time that the brain was a hard-wired machine incapable of repair. We now know that in fact it is quite the opposite. An excellent book on the subject of neuroplasticity is "the brain that changes itself" by Norman Doidge, M.D. Highly effective, non-medication based treatments are being discovered for a variety of brain-related maladies, depression included. That being said, the suboxone has been paid for again (legally this time), my feet are back on the ground where I feel the sunshine, and as sometimes just happens-funny in life, I got carded while buying my final beer. Im 46.

You might find a doctor who will subscribe suboxone But please, please be honest. Drug-Seeking Behavior drives nails in the coffins of people like me who legitimately need medications like suboxone. If you have read this and can relate then you have my deepest sympathies, I hope you can find a forward-thinking physician too, they are out there...and increasing in number (maybe slowly but still...) Good luck, peace.

 

[drminaq]

I use Subs partially for their antidepressant effect but would never say this much to my doctor. t's not a Panacea and only marginally more effective than any antidepressant out there. It is better for than an SSRI, I think Tramadol has more potential but again would never suggest this to a doctor.

 

[StartedHydro]

The only time in life I've ever really dealt with depression was during withdrawals. Now, if that type of feeling, I felt as depression, is what others truly suffer with on a daily basis without regard to WD's then by all means use buprenorphine as an anti dep. no person should have to live like that if a substance is out there regardless of control status could alleviate that state of mind.

Buprenorphine is a perfect substance to use for mood. Just as long as whoever is receiving treatment understand the risk of dependence which could boil over into addiction.

I really surprised science has not shed light on the eventual fact that some people have genetically fault endorphin systems.

Also a focus on DRI's instead of SSRI SNRI. Even substances like nuvigil that don't cause a release of dopa, but block dopa reuptake rather slowly compared to typical drugs of abuse.

 

[opiatekrzy]

im on bupe, when i take it in the morning, it gives me that wake up that i need and helps me mood like im ready for anything (kind of like relying on coffee) helps me with mood at times at low doses..

 

[King J]

If you're looking for an opiate to combat depression, try out extremely weak low-dose opiates that affect your opioid receptors in the brain, especially the k-opioid receptor in combination with the u/mu-opioid receptors; I've found it to be extremely affective in treating depression.

With that all in mind, try out Kratom or check out other legal low-dose/weak opioids that won't get you hooked because once your body is dependent on it and you try going without opiates, you don't have to be an "addict" per-say mentally, but your body is all physical and you will be ridiculously depressed and sicker than you've ever been and will do pretty much anything just to get that feeling away, to get an opiate/opioid just in your system. It's a ridiculous cycle so if you're going to try out opiates/opioids, try out Kratom first or something weak, legal, cheap, and stable, IMHO.

 

[StartedHydro]

I'd venture to day to clear of opiates/opioids that act on K ligands more specifically than mu, or even delta. K receptors are associated with a lot more negative mood and or dysphoria, also some can cause intense "tripping" sensations such as Salvia D. I think the reason buprenorphine is so effective in treating depression is that its an K rec ANTagonist.

 

[dopemegently]

I've never really found it helpful for depression. Sure, it gives you that "get up and go", but that peaks and plateaus within 4 hours max (at least for me). An effective AD should IMO work constantly, and for myself SSRI's are the only AD's that really do that for me. Bupe is really more of a temporary mood lift as the (partial) opiate effects kick in.

 

[Topmid]

i use 8mgs of subs pretty much weekly. not for depression but because it pretty much feels like an upper to me without the cracked out feeling. i usually smoke a bag of tar once a week and then get very minor withdrawals for a day or two. i don't like to feel like shit at all so i take 2mg of subs 4 days in a row. i really like the effects that subs provide. helps me at my job since it gives me a lot of energy and makes me happy.

 

[dopemegently]

Yeah, I think any feel-good feeling from sub is pretty much a 0temporary side effect caused by it's partial agonist properties. This is not a dedicated anti-depressant we're talking about. I took it during my clinical depression years ago, and it gave me no more than a fleeting mood lift; it was ssri's that really helped in that regard. They're also a hell of a lot cheaper and easier to obtain.