Misc Barbiturates... What's with all the hype?

[Hecticus]

Just to clarify, I realize that Methaqualone is not a Barbiturate but being that it's effects profile is so similar, they can practically be compared apples to apples.

You could also say Alcohol is similar to Alpazolam it's all subjective, are they the same thing? No.

Lol at the wolf of wallstreet reference. These were just the available sedatives back then vs now and how stories become legend, i don't think we're missing much.

 

[FnX]

Another possible reason is that they are gone and old-timers talk on and on about how great they were and how all of the stuff we get these days is shit etc. Take note of the massive "cult-following" of Methaqualone in present day, people who "love" Quaaludes often haven't even tried them, they just muse upon how great the effects must be. Yes, I do believe that Barbiturates have a much greater recreational value than Benzodiazepines, but neither are anything to write home about. Opioids will always be king in my book.

This is a big part of all the hype in my belief too. For many drug users, consumption of hard to achieve or rare drugs is considered like an achievement that they can brag about to elevate their status among other drug users. Even if said drugs were nothing that special when it comes to their effects. You can witness behaviour like this on many drug forums in threads like 'what drugs have you tried?' for example.

 

[Soulgasm]

Benzodiazepines and Barbiturates are lightyears apart in my opinion. The only thing they truly have in common is that they are both CNS depressants...

You get most of the same effects [with Barbiturates] that you might get from a Benzodiazepine but with an extra "kick". I would liken the feeling, as a matter of fact, to consuming Benzodiazepines with alcohol.

Wut?

 

[adder]

Barbiturates, on the other hand, are what I can only describe as ethanol in pill form. You get most of the same effects that you might get from a Benzodiazepine but with an extra "kick". I would liken the feeling, as a matter of fact, to consuming Benzodiazepines with alcohol. Barbiturates also have a much more narrow therapeutic index than Benzodiazepines i.e. the medically accepted dosage of any given Barbiturate is not far from the dosage which could cause overdose or even death. Barbiturates are great because they can actually produce euphoria on their own. I'm an opioid addict so I always crave opioids, especially after drinking/consuming benzos, but when I used secobarbital, I was content to just relax and enjoy the experience. This is one reason for Barbiturates receiving the present-day hype that they do.

I wouldn't really agree with this. Alcohol has such a wide spectrum of effects that it'll always feel much different from both benzodiazepines and barbiturates, and above all it feels dirty, no benzodiazepine or barbiturate ever felt that way for me, perhaps one could say that lorazepam feels a bit dirty with its supposedly serotonergic effects of some sort, yet it's completely different from ethanol. The most recreational barbiturates are secobarbital and pentobarbital (and also thiopental I suppose although I haven't taken it myself) in my opinion, and it is so mostly due to the rapid effects. I would compare this to a difference between triazolobenzodiazepines and classic benzodiazepines, yet some members from the latter group may be seen as recreational on their own. On the other hand, there are barbiturates like phenobarbital or benzobarbital which are generally just very long-acting sedatives/anticonvulsants with first noticeable effects appearing even 2 hours after ingestion, the come-up is so slow that it's easy not to feel anything at all unless you take too much. It was the same for me with clonazepam when I was already highly tolerant to it, I felt terrible if I didn't take it but I didn't feel anything after taking it anyway, it was hardly anxiolytic any more for me. I used phenobarbital for a couple of weeks after I ran out of clonazepam and I honestly didn't notice much difference at an equipotent dose, perhaps it was longer-lasting.

I can't speak of methaqualone and its analogues, but I think that GABAergics are the shittiest drugs to be dependent on, even way worse than stimulants, because once you become physically dependent, you can no longer get much from them and yet you can't live without them.

 

[Keif' Richards]

Alcohol is far more toxic and harmful to the body than any of these pharmaceuticals are. I think this fact could account for the "dirty" feelings people are describing. If you were to take all of the negative, physical effects of alcohol out of the equation, I think you might find alcohol and barbiturate intoxication to be very similar. Drinking alcohol produces euphoria in a lot of people including myself. A euphoria that most benzodiazepines just don't. Barbiturates, on the other hand produce a lot of the same effects as benzodiazepines but with the addition of euphoria. That's the comparison that I was trying to draw. That would also explain my analogy of benzodiazepines + ethanol = ~barbiturates. I'll say again that this is an oversimplification, but probably a good place to start when trying to explain the effects of these substances to those who are "naive".

It's difficult to describe an experience as subjective as drug use. My thoughts and opinions might not and probably won't mesh with everyone else's experience. Luckily, they are just opinions, so you don't have to agree.

 

[simco]

Isn't it also the case that some of the OD risk with barbs comes from bad interactions with alcohol? When I was first RX'd clonazepam I asked the doc "should I not drink when I take these?" To my surprise, he kind of scratched his chin and said I should "use my discretion" (he knew I wasn't a big drinker). The way he put it was, "the interaction between alcohol and Klonopin is roughly additive, while the older drugs [I assume he meant barbs] have a multiplicative interaction with alcohol." Maybe he was full of shit. But that stuck with me.

Edit: also, I'm excited... this was my first post with my newly anointed bluelighter status! No more greenlight for me.

 

[Keif' Richards]

^Combining alcohol with barbiturates is dangerous for sure. The same goes for combining most different CNS depressants. It you do a little bit of a light search, you'll be surprised how many famous people have died from barbiturate OD (including barb-like drugs; quaalude, placydal, milton etc).

I always felt that mixing benzodiazepines with alcohol or other depressants did increase the effects of each greater than just the sum of the parts.

 

[keeping]

barba streisand made them very popular in the 80's, reportedly.

 

[Keif' Richards]

As you guys have probably realized, I made a mistake in one of my posts. I began speaking about the effects of Benzodiazepines then confused this statement with Barbiturates. I'm sorry for the mistake. I'm sure that was probably confusing. If anyone wants/needs ,me to clarify, let me know and I'll get to it!

 

[brokedownpalace10]

Phenobarbital sucks. It's the Methadone of barbituates. Mostly just makes you feel tired for a couple days.
Methaqualone feels different than Barbituates feels different than Doriden feels different than Placidyl. They are all very similar, however, and feel different than Benzos (which also feel similar).

Keif' Richards saying that barbs are "ethanol in a pill" is kinda close. But they don't feel as dizzy or toxic. Kinda that "hammer to the head" in a good way. Their strong potentiation of alcohol is a good thing for crazy downer heads, if they're very fucking careful.

Benzos used to be called "minor tranquilizers" and Thorazine, Haldol, and the like were called "major tranquilizers". That says something. Valium will commonly settle you the fuck down whereas a barb could put you on a whiskey drunk fighting bender.
Benzos make you more relaxed and numb (not sure barbs have much muscle relaxant properties). A lot of people who loved Quualudes used to not like Valium saying they just "put them to sleep".

None of it should be "awesome" or "legendary", however. Ya, they were somewhat nicer than benzos, but you couldn't mail order a large selection of benzos, find DMT commonly on the street, or have access to any Psilocybes other than cubensis. GHB is lot's of fun, too. These are the good old days.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Methaqualone smoked is much more euphoric/different than a highest dose of Alprazolam. But pharmacological (or MOA) speaking there isn't much of a difference other then Barbiturates being more toxic, and if I recall correctly. Benzodiazpines increase the frequency of the channel opening at GABA(a) and Barbiturates make those channels open longer.

With Etaqualone too the Methyl sustituation made it better right, while the Ethyl was allready nice. When done correct your not smoking it but vaporizes. It vapored before the bed of Weed it was on litted up. Barb's seem a bit to dangerous to my liking.

Euphoria wise most downer's are not even close. From the Benzo's only Temazepam is slightly euphoric. GHB way better, but totally different.

Etaqualone vaped felt like a warm blacking out, I went flat while sitting outside on the ground. To bad its shortlived, my best guess about minutes. And with a high dose needed for an oral experience max 500 mg, the tablets were 325 mg, is needed. So very unprofitable for me.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

I’ll be honest with you. The first time I was going thru alcohol withdrawal and they came out with two syringes full of phenobarbital. Hit me at the same time one in each arm and I was high asf.

That said after the honey moon phase yeah they suck. And also keep in mind I have zero benzo tolerance and I was faking alcohol withdrawal. I am not a gaba guy. I don’t usually like gabergics.

I like being up but I guess you all know that about me. That’s why I don’t like methadone verses subs. Methadone makes me sleep. Subs make me up. The Theabaine derivatives seem to be more stimulating than methadone type drugs.

 

[fairnymph]

I've never taken barbiturates. The only one I can get hold of is phenobarbital but that doesn't interest me. I want Seconal or Nembutal.

That said, I have had carisoprodol and GHB, which are much closer to barbiturates than benzodiazepines in their pharmacology. The effects are noticeably different.
Benzos feel a lot more subtle and less 'messy'. It's mostly just a feeling of complete mental and physical relaxation.

Carisoprodol and GHB feel a lot more intoxicating. The feeling is very similar to alcohol, but cleaner and more euphoric.

Diazepam and carisoprodol are my two favorite sedatives. I can't say I prefer one over the other - they are both very euphoric but in different ways.

I don’t enjoy any downers, but I’ve tried literally everything I’ve been able to get my hands on, legal and otherwise, for my extreme muscle tension and spasticity. Only diazepam and one carisoprodol help significantly. Unfortunately, I cannot get the latter here in Europe. Interesting that those two are similar in that regard and you also find them to be euphoric.

My late husband made some methaqualone, but used it all before I got the chance to try any! I was really mad. To be fair, he wasn’t able to make it very much, but still!

Phenobarbital was just sedating imo. Butalbital in Fiorinal w/codeine does seem to have a synergistic effect (caffeine & aspirin in it too), beyond straight codeine or codeine with caffeine + aspirin.

 

[fairnymph]

I’ll be honest with you. The first time I was going thru alcohol withdrawal and they came out with two syringes full of phenobarbital. Hit me at the same time one in each arm and I was high asf.

That said after the honey moon phase yeah they suck. And also keep in mind I have zero benzo tolerance and I was faking alcohol withdrawal. I am not a gaba guy. I don’t usually like gabergics.

I like being up but I guess you all know that about me. That’s why I don’t like methadone verses subs. Methadone makes me sleep. Subs make me up. The Theabaine derivatives seem to be more stimulating than methadone type drugs.

Wtf! Bupe is sooo sedating (& overall awful) for me & methadone is one of the least sedating opioid ime.

 

[fairnymph]

My methadone counselor calls barbs the OLD SCHOOL BENZOS.

He told me they made Benzos due to the fact that barbs were causing too many OD's, and are real shitty drugs. He told me that from experience to barbs.

When I showed him my RX for 1mg Clonazepam, he told me you're really lucky to have a RX for Clonazepam, its the all around best benzo for everything, including anxiety, depression, panic attacks, muscle relaxation, long half life, etc.

I currently have 4 different kinds of benzos on hand today, including all the common ones, Diazepam, Alprazolam, Lorazepam, and my RX of Clonazepam.

In all honesty, I do like my RX of clonazepam better than all those I listed. IME, its a mixture of all 3, the strength of alprazolam, the long half life/muscle relaxation properties of Diazepam, and the overall relaxation of Lorazepam.

So im REALLY blessed to have a RX for Klonopin/Clonazepam. LOVE IT.

Clonazepam is the only benzo other than diazepam with any effect on my muscle tension, but it’s very minor vs diazepam, at least for me. And it’s not anxiolytic & leaves me groggy all day.

 

[Burnt Offerings]

Phenobarbital sucks.

Yeah that’s always been my understanding too. It seems to be in wider use than most of the others at this point, I know they use it sometimes to wean off severe alcoholics

A lot of the fetishization of these old gabaergics just has to do with the fact that they ain’t around anymore, for the most part. As I’ve said in the past, if the government suddenly decided to ban Xanax & scrub every tablet from the face of the earth, before long you’d have people waxing poetic about how Xanax bars would make you feel like you’re floating on clouds or something

With that being said, I would be curious to try some of the older ones like secobarbital or pentobarbital, if I was ever offered them randomly

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Wtf! Bupe is sooo sedating (& overall awful) for me & methadone is one of the least sedating opioid ime.

Yeah it’s so wierd how they affect us different. I had someone else who told me the same thing but I don’t have a normal brain either. I have abnormalities.

 

[fairnymph]

Yeah it’s so wierd how they affect us different. I had someone else who told me the same thing but I don’t have a normal brain either. I have abnormalities.

My brain is definitely far from normal as well.

 

[MedicinalUser247]

Well, I guess you've never tried Sodium Thiopental. It will knock your socks off !

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Wonder what will happen if your barefooted?