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Opioids Bali kratom (OG/PC) powder

J

JM357

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 4, 2013
Messages
308
This weekend I am making the transition from methadone to suboxone. They need me to not take subs for 72 hours before dosing methadone and then it will probably be a low dose. I am determined not to do heroin again and don't even really want to take anything not RX/illegal anymore- hit a rock bottom and have been posting in sober living. But I heard Bali kratom is good for opioid WDs.

I've never taken kratom other than headshop capsules twice which worked well. I did read the kratom encyclopedia though. Any advice?
 
if you're switching onto suboxone then you shouldn't be taking kratom, it is an opioid just like any other and will not do anything to help your tolerance etc, all it does is substitute in the same way methadone would except much weaker
 
Firstly, just to clarify; are you currently taking subs and wish to switch to methadone? Or you're currently taking methadone and wish to switch to subs? With the way your post was worded (not that it was worded badly) I'm sure it confused some people.
 
I'm switching from suboxone to methadone- I have to stop taking the suboxone 72 hours before the methadone, which will probably be inducted on Monday; switching to methadone due to a) back pain and that if I give six months of clean urines at the clinic my PCP will refer me to the pain management doctor in his practice b)it is free, medicaid pays for it and will have transportation pick me up every morning (usually at the same time- I'm thinking set it for 8 (dosing hours are 5:45-10:30am) because all the serious employed people come in early and all the people in pajama pants come near the end. If you go early but not too early there is a dead time at the clinic where you basically walk straight to dosing).

Part of it is I often shoot suboxone so that I can take other opiods later (shooting now (started today) so that kratom could possibly work and take away WDs)- the stated average half-life of injected bupe is like a few hours and I know in me it works and I start getting sick like 3-4hours later and have huge pupils by 6 hours and I can do other opioids to full effect (this is part of my problem). From tracking the kratom should come tomorrow. I have to take my last dose of bupe on friday morning but am just thinking of waking up and taking the kratom all friday. I do have meds prescribed by my PCP- gabapentin 600mgs 3x a day and clonidine 0.2 3x a day. He also said Immodium was good for GI problems.
 
Well kratom will work for withdrawals, but i wouldnt advise using it for an extended period of time as it will be another addiction. Although, if for some reason the kratom does better for your pain than the suboxone did, then you may be able to use kratom as a substitute for methadone whenever you feel like it. Im kinda doubting that it would help too much, but everyones different, so you never know.
 
Its coming today so I will definitely have it for the weekend. I actually could try some today probably, but what I'm hearing is it probably isn't as strong as suboxone.

I hate how "officially" the treatment team at the methadone clinic has to discuss my admission and set the appointment date and time. My counselor pretty much told me it would be next Monday but it just makes it hard for me to set up transportation (medicaid literally sends a cab everyday to bring patients to the methadone clinic thats how bad the opioid crisis has gotten). The only thing that at all goes against me is that I do technically have a pending charge- but it is a misdemeanor so they said it shouldn't matter (and actually the clinic is going to be part of my defense/plea bargaining or whatever).

How far should 8oz. (224gms) go- I've read the dosage tables and stuff on erowid and other site. The ones on erowid state they are probably no longer relevant. I'll admit the headshop kratom pills worked and I've heard those are of notoriously poor quality. It sounds like dosing would be at 3-6gms? Would starting with just using like a teaspoon or tablespoon full be a good idea (it says a high dose is 2-3 teaspoons online (equals 4.5-8 grams), I think my spoons in my house are tablespoons which should be like a few teaspoons; I could see if I could get my lab scale or the kratom measurements are so large I could probably just use a food scale)? What way should I take it? I've heard just tossing it in your mouth and swallowing it is best (using water after to wash it down and wash away the taste). I like the idea of tea but it is supposed to be a powder not leaves- I'm thinking I'd have to put it in something like a clean sock and put it in a pot. Could I theoretically put it in the coffee machine and run two cycles of water over it maybe (like put it in and run a couple cups and then pour that and a little more water back into the reservoir and run it again?)? Or would that be too hot?

How far should 8oz. go? My wife is here too and I think wants to try some, so I may end up with a second person wanting some (she is also suffering to some extent from opioid WDs but has been off suboxone maybe a couple weeks and sniffed dope it sounds like a couple times) but she doesn't seem to have the tolerance that I do for things and the effects last longer for some reason. I've heard you really feel the effects for like an hour or so (I remember feeling them for some amount of hours but I took an initial dose of pills then like one or two at a time (like there were 20 1/2 gram pills and I took 8 to start and then one or two every 45 minutes or so)) but that it may be more like 4-6 hours of WD stopping effect.

On monday morning I am supposed to be as sick as possible (dope sick)- what they told me at the clinic, they said I'll get the highest dose then. But it seems like they just start most people at 30 and my counselor pretty much agreed with that but isn't the doctor. How late should I take my last dose of kratom? I was just thinking maybe at like 10pm sunday night (probably about 10-12 hours before I see the doctor, if I end up with an earlier appt. I would move it earlier) same time I take the meds from my doctor (gabapentin and clonidine).

Thank you in advance for answers.
 
I also wasn't really talking about it breaking through suboxone when I said I could probably take it today, I meant not taking my dose of suboxone and waiting until I am in WD to take the kratom. Which WDs start for me sometimes at 3 hours, but usually more like 4 and my pupils are real big by 6 hours or so.
 
I was thinking more of the kratom as a supplement to the methadone at first- like they start at 30 and move up 5 every 3 days. With methadone dose build-up etc. I think I will feel ok once they hit 35 (the 30 a day will have had time to build up and then a little higher dose) and probably mostly by 40. Last time I kept using I think till I hit like 50 but I don't want to use this time. Also, I think the fact that I don't normally do dope (maybe it averaged once a week or so and then other stuff sometimes but not opioids) and you have to be at like 30-40mgs to switch to subs (the supposed ceiling effect of suboxone makes it equal to 40mgs of methadone and I shoot 1mg of bupe every 3-4 hours (usually 7mgs a day or so)- I think I could actually go higher and it would have some effect, I don't think I 100% hit the ceiling).

So I get the 30mg methadone dose and it starts to not hold at the end of the day so I take some kratom- that sort of thing.

I also have multiple containers of white grapefruit juice from concentrate.
 
Experience: took last shot of suboxone at 8:45 and levels were already low (fell asleep last night at like 10:30 (so probably hadn't dosed since 9) woke up at 4 really sick, toke dose at 4, woke up at 8:45 really sick)

Took two spoonfuls, level not heaping but made a nice mouthful of powder, washed down with water. That was 4 mins ago no effects except some tingling like something is about to start. Would have been sick when starting but have been taking gabapentin for a couple days as I tapered off benzos and the gaba is pretty good at keeping WDs away especially if you take a good dose (usually smaller doses more frequently- your body can only use so much at once). Been 48+ hours since I took subs sublingually and really only did for about a day and a morning (total 12mgs taken) so there isn't as much a build up as with others.

Now 7 minutes since dosing, will report effects, dose was on empty stomach

+7 mins: that sort of tingle that something is about to happen

+20 mins: took third level spoon- probably a bit, but am not concerned about OD due to high tolerance, and proabably still some sub hanging around. Definitely feeling an
effect, almost like a slow opioid creep up but stimulating as well (guessing will become more sedating as time goes on). Really want to eat something, why I redosed early.

+30 mins: ate and definitely could tell the gabapentin wasn't just covering up the WDs

+50 mins: wife woke up, said she was sick (stopped subs couple weeks ago and had a couple encounters with opioids the last few days) got her to take down two spoonfuls (well most of it she coughed a little of the second out- had a much harder time with it than me). I am definitely feeling it in my body etc. pretty stimulating at this point.

+65 mins: wife seems to be doing a little better, is starting to get up.

+69 mins: feel a little nauseated, going food shopping with my mother (she should be here to pick me up in 5-10 minutes) but am up to the task. Definitely feel effects but they are probably blunted a bit by sub still, will probably use a low dose tonight to sleep and try in the morning too (probably two spoonfuls again, tonight a small spoon). Eyes smaller than before but not pinned. Am still feeling effects building?

+190 mins: feel ok, wanted to smoke cigarettes more; wife says she doesn't want anymore- although she might feel better- says she took a clonidine which might be why she feels better. Preparation is a big part of it- toss and wash was

+200 minutes: took another spoonful toss and wash. Have some food on stomach so it will work as well/as fast but should actually be released slower. Figuring it could hold me till later and might take one more spoonful before bed. Then call in the morning and find out wither this is the weekend to stop suboxone or not.

Find out tomorrow if methadone clinic is taking me this Monday or the next. If it is the next will stop dosing kratom after morning dose (probably wait 12-16 hours and start with a small piece of sub under tongue (like .500mcgs) and will at least dose sublingually till I reach feeling good (as in no precipitated WDs) after 1.5 mgs (probably a half an hour between .500mcg doses- have never had bad precip. WDs with this method of taking very little first and dosing like each half hour so long as I don't feel worse and my pupils don't get bigger)
 
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Dosing again tonight- just one big spoonful (when looking at the 112g bag go down I feel like a heaping spoonful is probably a good amount, took more earlier but really that was with suboxone in the way)

Admittedly, because I'm not a liar, I took 2mg clonazepam (breaking benzo taper- but have only been on one month and taper is down to no or one drop (0.25-0.5 chloro-diazepam a day) and I have gabapentin now which I plan on using to get through getting on the clinic (thats prescribed then tapering) w/2 soma and 800mg gabapentin.

Stomach completely empty now and def starting to feel WDs (last dose of kratom was at 3 or so so over 7 hours) and it has now been over 12 hours since a shot of suboxone and over 60 since sublingual (which was one day b/c I fucked up and used and had sort of known it was coming and still fucked up anyways which is part of why I'm going on the clinic). I will call in the morning and if it is not this next monday I will save the kratom and just use gabapentin and a drop of choloro-diazepam when needed EOD for the next week. Gababapentin taper after.

+20/10 minutes- starting to feel incredible, either those benzos are not all they claim to be or the kratom is starting to kick in. I felt cold runny nose etc. Not only do I feel a heavy benzo feeling but now warmth is spreading through me and opioid WD is going away.
 
Thank you for the encouragement.

Also, I feel like, and this is working towards my favor, the bottle from the vendor of the RC benzos seem to only dispense half (they spoke of this problem). So I was probably taking the equivalent of 2.5 diazepam most days.
 
pupils were huge, was having withdrawal symptoms and on spoonful helped. Might be one of those things where more doesn't equal better.

And I feel the opioid WD symptoms going away.

Will switch back to subs to save my maybe 170gms for detox weekend if the clinic pushes me back a week. I have a feeling they will even though I called all the doctors, made sure my counselor had the right fax numbers (some she did not) and told her to put urgent on it. Only time will tell.
 
the 2mgs of klonopin (which I took first with the muscle relaxer but soma takes longer to hit) hitting me tells me that my taper has been mostly successful, at least up until this point. Will try a drop (of chloro-diazepam) a day for three days now then a drop EOD or half a drop a day for three days (maybe) then I'm out. I hope I get accepted for dosing next monday. If not it will be another rough week for me. I could probably go cold turkey off the benzos or maybe a couple days as a drop a day using the gabapentin.
 
ate a nice meal plus desert, which I wouldn't have done in withdrawal (50 minutes after dosing. Will probably lay down, watch a movie, go to sleep, set my alarm and call the clinic in the morning. If I really need a spoonful of kratom between now and then I will take it. but I doubt with the combination that I can't be alright while sleeping for like 9 hours.
 
I woke up a few times during the night. Took a very small amount of kratom at like 2 thinking it was why I couldn't sleep. Well still woke up every two hours. Now woke up sick, called the clinic and they don't have my records through yet so not the upcoming monday, next monday if they get the records. Took a small piece of suboxone about 20 minutes ago and will be putting away the kratom. It does seem to work to help with WDs quite a bit but seems to need to be dosed well every 6 hours. Will probably do that next friday-sunday; a spoonful every 6 hours and will probably skip the last one. I need to present as sick as possible at the clinic so I'll have to be careful about my last dosage of clonidine, etc. That Sunday night is going to be hell.

Part of me just wants to use the subs by injection but I guess I don't have 100% reassurances (although it does say the half life is a few hours on the injectable insert) but a lot of people here still think that it has the same half-life (I certainly don't from how it seems to effect me) or near it when injected (I've heard that opinion a lot here). Although the megathread lists it as having a fairly short half-life injected.
 
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Im a little confused by the thread tbh.

If kratom is keeping your withdrawals at bay (and sounds like youre even getting a buzz a bit), why even bother with the nightmare that is methadone? methadone withdrawals is arguably the worst opioid to wd from and a huge hassle/ball and chain. you can buy kilos of kratom online and withdrawals aren't fun but better than bupe or 'done. stick with the kratom for a month or two then cold turkey that shit.

whatever you do, keep your dose of methadone low. it doesn't sound like your tolerance is that bad. you could be free of this shiz all together in a month or so.

just so you know, gabapentin isn't harmless either. I used to think that, but im stuck on this shit for a long time now. its going to take me a long time to get off of this stuff and its no fun. pretty terrible withdrawal for me.
 
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