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Bad reporting on the Electric Zoo

Diloadid said:
What defines a 'hit'? She took six hits of untested 'Molly'...
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Exactly my point...we don't know the dosage or composition of what she took. We also don't know if she was on medication such as SSRIs or MAOIs. The press is going crazy without knowing the full story.
It would be nice if these journalist would suggest that people who are going to use club drugs obtain a test kit.

Test kits would save the world.
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No...the press and the government are just going to act like they always do regarding drugs. Partnership for a Drug Free America and DARE will continue with their propaganda while they continue to receive donations from the Alcohol and Tobacco industies. Yet in the United States and New York City area there are so many deaths, injuries and chronic illnesses from these "legal" drugs.

Test kits and anything else besides, "just say no" are rarely discussed as education alternatives over here. Perhaps if those two victims knew about harm reduction they would still be alive today. It's really sad:(
 
You raise good points about DARE and the Partnership for a Drug Free America.

The way I figure, the people who want to use responsibly will find this website and heed the positive and mostly un-biased information we present. That's all we can hope for. :)
 
DARE is useless. Absolutely useless.
All it ever taught me was to be scared and to believe these wild exaggerated statistics and half truths.
now that I'm all grown up and using drugs anyways, I wouldn't have had a damn clue how to safely use if it weren't for my natural curiosity and the fact that I don't like putting things in my body without proper usage.
Kids who took DARE don't have a clue how bad of an idea it is to do GHB while you've already had 6 drinks.
They also don't get the importance of staying hydrated when doing mdma, and that they shouldn't try to redose to chase their high for 6 hours, nor do they know the importance of testing because they don't understand that just because their dealer says it's MDMA doesn't necessarily mean it is
God I could rant for hours on how flawed the current system of drug education is
 
Diloadid said:
You raise good points about DARE and the Partnership for a Drug Free America.

The way I figure, the people who want to use responsibly will find this website and heed the positive and mostly un-biased information we present. That's all we can hope for. :)
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Yes...despite the rhetoric...I am still hopeful for the future. I talk to a lot of people much younger then myself and find the vast majority have never been told about harm reduction. Then DARE and Partnership for a Drug Free America come to the schools with their drug "education" programs. I have heard some very erroneous information that the kids and young adults have been taught that have not been backed up by evidence. It is a failure of our education system.

I wonder how much harm reduction education the two that died and the four that were hospitalized at Electric Zoo received in school?

Here is an interesting commentary on Electric Zoo and EDM events.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kia-makarechi/electric-zoo-dance-music-drugs_b_3852961.html
 
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OGM said:
Yes...despite the rhetoric...I am still hopeful for the future. I talk to a lot of people much younger then myself and find the vast majority have never been told about harm reduction. Then DARE and Partnership for a Drug Free America come to the schools with their drug "education" programs. I have heard some very erroneous information that the kids and young adults have been taught that have not been backed up by evidence. It is a failure of our education system.

I wonder how much harm reduction education the two that died and the four that were hospitalized at Electric Zoo received in school?

Here is an interesting commentary on Electric Zoo and EDM events.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kia-makarechi/electric-zoo-dance-music-drugs_b_3852961.html
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I am very hopefull for the future as well. When I meet recreational drug users, I suggest they visit Bluelight. I really try to promote harm reduction in real life.

Sometimes the message is well received. Sometimes it isn't.

I do what I can.
 
Sunday I was at some house music events and there were a lot of people the would have been at the cancelled Electric Zoo. The subject of the deaths came up so I told scores of them about Bluelight. I saw some of them looking at the site on their smartphones as I pointed them to the Ecstasy section. So people are looking for the info.
 
If one were to compare the violence and overdoses (including alcohol) rates (per 1,000 attendees) from different types of festival/concerts I have the gut feeling EDM would not do to bad. Even back in the day I remember when there were issues at The Greatful Dead & many other concerts. Two deaths out of a festival of say 200,000 attendees vs. two deaths out of a concert of 20,000 would mean the smaller venue would has a much greater fatality rate.

There are many very large EDM venues that don't have a high casualty rate. Likewise there are many small concerts that are problematic. Think how many people die of alcohol related violence and accidents and venues. I have not seen evidence to suggest EDM is all that bad or worse than other venues.

In the case of Electric Zoo...it has been running for years without many problems. Divide the number of attendees for all years of the event by the total number of deaths, injuries and overdoses. I think the figures would look very good.
 
Diloadid said:
What defines a 'hit'? She took six hits of untested 'Molly'...

It would be nice if these journalist would suggest that people who are going to use club drugs obtain a test kit.

Test kits would save the world.
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Hit should typically be a standard dose. This is subjective but taking 6 doses of any drug seems pretty fucking stupid. Seriously what kind of idiot takes 6 doses to start? Fucking stupid. Especially for a GIRL!
 
squarerootof23 said:
To what extent is electronic music created and even at times performed under the influence of some drug(s)?
To what extent are electronic musicians assuming that their consumers are listening to their music under the influence of some drug(s)?
How often have you listened to electronic music sober, and then listened to it while under the influence of some drug(s), and said to yourself, *NOW* I really am in tune with the music and the musician, or something like that?
Unless our answers to these questions are something like, "almost never", then I would say, Yes, society is being pretty reasonable to "blame the event, the promoters, the music.....", etc.
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Electronic music has been pretty much mainstream for, what, at least 10 years now? So, a lot of electronic music events have shifted from "raves" held in some abandoned warehouse, to meatmarket clubs with state of the art sound and "dress to impress" type motifs. House music blares out of high fashion designer shops selling ultra expensive pieces of cloth to the rich. Trip hop / downtempo electronic music is the norm in the coffee shops. The hipster indie bars will be blaring indietronica for you to enjoy while you sip your craft brew. I've been to *plenty* of electronic music shows where the MDMA usage wasn't too high. (It depends on the event. Festivals often do have more people on something, yes... meh, who cares...)

Meanwhile, ecstasy, or "molly" as the kids started calling it for some reason, is everywhere. Hip hop talks about it. Stoner rockers talk about it. Fuckin' Madonna winks and nudges about it. Of course it's at the EDM events (but definitely not all of them, see above), but it's no longer just for the PLUR ravers anymore.

For some reason, to old media, nothing has changed, it's still 1997 ala when 20/20 first did their "expose" on the "dangers" of "raves" and "molly" is some new dangerous drug to kids like "ecstasy" was back then. But I've noticed that old media is stuck in the past these days, and as depressingly dumb as ever.
 
severely etarded said:
Hit should typically be a standard dose. This is subjective but taking 6 doses of any drug seems pretty fucking stupid. Seriously what kind of idiot takes 6 doses to start? Fucking stupid. Especially for a GIRL!
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I believe this was nothing but sensationalism on the part of the media... Somewhat disgusting, in my opinion a statement like that is publicized without any backing of actual fact.
 
squarerootof23 said:
To what extent is electronic music created and even at times performed under the influence of some drug(s)?

To what extent are electronic musicians assuming that their consumers are listening to their music under the influence of some drug(s)?

How often have you listened to electronic music sober, and then listened to it while under the influence of some drug(s), and said to yourself, *NOW* I really am in tune with the music and the musician, or something like that?

Unless our answers to these questions are something like, "almost never", then I would say, Yes, society is being pretty reasonable to "blame the event, the promoters, the music.....", etc.

Someone may say, Well, this isn't unique to electronic music. I agree, it is not. But, there is something unique to it that brings about this extra scrutiny:
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To what extent is all types of music created under the influence of drugs?
Psychoactives in general have been an influential part of all forms of art for an incredibly long time, and it would be ridiculous to say this is generally unique to electronic music.
Perhaps at events it is generally expected that the majority of users will be on drugs, but I addressed that already, however I listen to electronic music very regularly, I actually don't often listen to other genres much anymore, and when I search more new music, I am sober, and when I'm listening to electronic music, I'm sober 99% of the time.
And yes being on drugs certainly brings one more in tune with the music, but shit someone could throw on a cheesy ABBA record and I could feel very in tune with the music, it's just the effect drugs have, and it isn't limited to electronic music.
I would say the uniqueness that brings out this way of thinking regarding electronic music again has the do with the portrayal media and people around you have had on it all throughout your life, you may be an avid EDM fan, but these things I guarantee still have some sub conscious influence over your views on it.
These are things I notice in myself every day in all aspects of life. it's very hard to escape the conditioning we experienced all while growing up.

To be honest if people don't listen to EDM mostly when they're sober or only when they're going to shows, they are only there for the drugs or the party, and they can graciously remove themselves from the scene so shit like this doesn't happen so often
 
People listen to EDM when they are; relaxing, exercising, driving, etc. I would venture to guess that very people are taking drugs most of the time they are listening to EDM.
 
ShaunG said:
So the toxicology reports are in?
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i wouldn't believe the tox reports, do you think they are testing for exotic unknown RC's? no. The only find things that they test for. They aren't testing for 4-FA and things like that because they don't even konw they exist.



As for the news reporting false facts on xtc.....the news reports flawed facts on EVERYTHING, its because writers/journalists are trying to report on subjects that they are not experts on and have no understanding of, this happens with everything not just xtc articles.
 
LucidSDreamr said:
i wouldn't believe the tox reports, do you think they are testing for exotic unknown RC's? no.
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Although MDMA deaths are rarer than other drugs, it is not inconceivable for someone to die from MDMA (or even methylone, which I consider a relatively safer drug -- not that MDMA isn't decently safe if you "follow the rules"...).

MDMA gets way more press for any deaths than it should, of course. I'm glad they printed the cocaine and heroin OD statistics in that NY Post article, because yes they are much more numerous than MDMA. The number of MDMA users as I remember it is comparable or even higher compared to those two drugs, yet the fatality rate is way lower. Interesting, eh?

That's why I'm puzzled by the decision to shut down an entire festival over a couple ODs. That's not the right way to handle things IMHO.

Prescription drug abuse *by far* has the worst OD statistics, notably the opioids. The general scare media seems to have trouble with that fact, because it's "not illegal".
 
squarerootof23 said:
Understand, I'm not picking an arguement with you. I am no expert in these kinds of things. But, I have a problem with your approach to this.

If I can't believe the toxicology reports - which I have no reason to assume were not done by experts in this kind of stuff - who can I believe? To take it a little further, why should I believe anything said by some anonymous poster on Bluelight? No one on Bluelight that I know of has shared credentials that show him to be someone we ought to listen to.

I think the "don't-believe-anything-they-say" arguement - especially when no evidence is given for us to doubt these experts - is a dead end approach to knowledge and understanding.
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I second this... I like to remain skeptical of these articles, but simply dismissing them as false is indeed a dead end approach to knowledge and understanding.

The best thing to do is educate people so things like waterpoisoning and overheating don't happen.

@LucidSDreamr You mention things like 4FA, but this is also a relatively safe substance and one of the most known RC's together with 6APB



EDIT: I find this sentence strange though: ''Toxicology results showed Ms. Rotondo died from acute intoxication after taking pure MDMA''

How much mdma would you need to take at once for this to happen?! She was probably on other medication or MAOI for this to happen. I can't see how one dose of pure tested MDMA can kill someone when they aren't allergic or on other drugs
 
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