Back to where i started

Ask yourself: do you derive as much enjoyment from sobriety as you do from insobriety? If not, then why bother being sober?

This sounds great in theory, but the sad fact is, even if you LIKE using hard drugs, eventually it catches up with you and being fucked up is no longer the fun it was once cracked up to be. Even if you have unlimited financial resources, the havoc cocaine can wreak one one's mental health, family, employment capabilities, and medical care will eventually surpass any benefit the drug once gave you. Take it from one who has been there and who doesn't give a fuck about what societal norms are or what people think, cocaine and heroin are not sustainable addictions to have.

It's like the idea of utopia: looks great on paper, but isn't really feasible in the real world.
 
Ask yourself: do you derive as much enjoyment from sobriety as you do from insobriety? If not, then why bother being sober?

Many reasons, if you can't imagine any yourself you're probably not very intelligent or a sociopath. This is kind of moot anyway because most people with hard drug addictions don't enjoy them in the slightest.
 
As far as num de plum goes...I don't hate drugs because society tells me to...I hate them because they steal all my money, are killing me, and suck every ounce of joy out of my life unless I'm high

I'm hopeful that you'll consider and think over my argument, here. However, you have the liberty to dismiss, reject, deny, and/or ignore it if you don't really care for any real advice, but instead just want some pacifying reassurance of your own foregone conclusions thoughtlessly spoon-fed to you with a superficial veneer of advice.

1.) Money is itself a social construct. Therefore, a life lived addicted to money is a life lived addicted to society.

2.) The absence of money is undesirable to the individual because society regards the abundance of money as a virtue.

3.) The repercussions of not having an abundance of money only exist because society creates them by appending a price tag on everything, down to the most essential of necessities such as food or water or liberty.

4.) Getting rid of the heroin to have more money is no different than getting rid of money to have more heroin. You're simply shuffling the addiction from heroin to money. Now then, instead of living life happily devoted to the consumption of heroin you're living life miserably devoted to the accumulation of cash. That is utterly preposterous.

5.) What is the purpose of having money if not to spend it, anyway? Dead men can't carry gold to their graves, nor would they have any real use for it if they could. Hoarding money is as much a pathological obsession as is abusing heroin. Moreover, spending money by being a shopaholic is not dissimilar to spending money by being an alcoholic, so to say as an example.

6.) Since you see nothing wrong in being addicted to extending your life expectancy or increasing your supply of money, one can logically deduce that it is not addiction in general that bothers you, but rather socially-unapproved addictions that bother you. Thus, the individual's addiction is, you tacitly suggest, supposedly justified if and only if it is endorsed, supported, and shared by society at large.


7.) Heroin kills, but so does everything else. You're going to die from something anyway. All of life is a wager and every life ends in death and decay. What does it matter to oneself if they get hit by a bus or get cancer or overdose on some drug, outside of personal preference? Besides, a drug-induced death is comparatively a much milder way of dying than almost every other way I can imagine. Moreover, how many people are as lucky as addicts to die doing what they love or to die for something they'd really die for such as dope?

8.) You claim the absence of heroin diminishes your life's joy. How sensible would it be then to prolong the absence of heroin by overcoming the addiction, rather than, say, using more heroin more often? For example, humans feel less joy when deprived of air to breathe, but it never occurs to them that the air, as opposed to the absence thereof, is problematic and needs to be removed.

In summary, you—like all people—have established a set of extraordinarily strange, exceptionally irrational, and immensely convoluted notions with which to both justify and deny your addiction to social acceptability and dependence upon normative social influence.

This is the essence of psychological sublimation in action.
 
Many reasons, if you can't imagine any yourself you're probably not very intelligent or a sociopath. This is kind of moot anyway because most people with hard drug addictions don't enjoy them in the slightest.

Drug addiction was never even discussed at length or seen in a negative perspective until very recently. It is not by coincidence that we witnessed in history the Industrial Revolution (which gave rise to the popularity of productivism and further strengthened and emboldened the ideology of capitalism) alongside the demonization of drug use.

People that make money or have high productivity are valuable and necessary in any productivist, capitalist society. Drug addicts, in general, don't make money (other than to fuel their addictions) and aren't very productive (outside procuring their drugs), and what is unproductive or doesn't make money either doesn't matter or is a dangerous scourge to be done away with.

Moreover, how viable would capitalism be if nobody could crawl themselves out the dope house to toil in some factory or waste away in a cubicle?

Nobody seems to bother asking why there are so many institutions and resources devoted to curing drug addiction while nothing exists for curing addictions to money. Why is there no workaholics anonymous?

And this money addiction never ends; one never reaches a comfortable level of wealth. Even billionaires can't stop wet-dreaming about more money.
 
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Dude...this is a ridiculous argument. I don't have an addiction to money, unfortunately I do need it to live. Let me make this more clear for you. I don't like being addicted because it's a living hell. I grew up with an addicted father and mentally ill mother and that was horrible.. I have children that I don't want to experience what I had to live through.the end. This isn't a philosophical debate so fuck off
 
I'm hopeful that you'll consider and think over my argument, here. However, you have the liberty to dismiss, reject, deny, and/or ignore it if you don't really care for any real advice, but instead just want some pacifying reassurance of your own foregone conclusions thoughtlessly spoon-fed to you with a superficial veneer of advice.

Nom, you are welcome to express your views but you are treading on some thin ice here in a thread started by someone that wants to end her dependence on a substance and is finding it difficult. These are the Recovery forums, not Drug Culture, not Philosophy and Spirituality, not even Second Opinion. People come to these forums specifically to get support. This is no place for your abstract argument against the whole concept of sobriety in general. It doesn't matter whether anyone else agrees with it or not--this person is asking for real support for what she is trying to do--not a general discussion on the societal roots of addiction/recovery/sobriety. If you have some support to give, great, continue posting. But if you are hell-bent on shaming the OP into your advice to continue using, your posts will be unapproved. I posted this here to stop any further derailing of the thread but if you want to argue with me about this please feel free to PM me.
 
Dude...this is a ridiculous argument. I don't have an addiction to money, unfortunately I do need it to live. Let me make this more clear for you. I don't like being addicted because it's a living hell. I grew up with an addicted father and mentally ill mother and that was horrible.. I have children that I don't want to experience what I had to live through.the end. This isn't a philosophical debate so fuck off

All of those are indirect consequences of the drug, arising from the drug addiction existing in a social context. Other than the possibility of overdose, some health effects, and death (which is only a possibility for some drugs), there are no direct consequences or detriments from any drug addiction. Moreover, death and poor health come naturally—the drug only quickens it.

And of course this isn't a philosophical debate; philosophizing is not necessary to see what's obvious, and the obvious is not debatable.

I was providing insight into something I thought was unseen. But apparently, there is nothing unseen here at all. There is instead an obstinate and blatant refusal to acknowledge the obvious.

Therefore, I will gladly fuck off. I certainly wouldn't want to take a shit on your pitiably pathetic parade of learned helplessness.
 
Sorry, I didn't see your post until after I had submitted my last comment, herbavore. I will leave the thread, alright.
 
Dude...this is a ridiculous argument. I don't have an addiction to money, unfortunately I do need it to live. Let me make this more clear for you. I don't like being addicted because it's a living hell. I grew up with an addicted father and mentally ill mother and that was horrible.. I have children that I don't want to experience what I had to live through.the end. This isn't a philosophical debate so fuck off

I'm very sorry to hear about your situation.

There's an unfortunate circumstance that when we live with addicted or mentally ill people, we develop maladjustments to cope with our traumatic surroundings.

Even for people who don't start using drugs, they can develop a "social dependency" known as co-dependency, on other people (often their own children and/or significant other).

We also have an inherent capacity for reflecting the behavior of others by emulating others. It seems almost automatic at times.

<3 hang in there
 
I was providing insight into something I thought was unseen. But apparently, there is nothing unseen here at all. There is instead an obstinate and blatant refusal to acknowledge the obvious.

No it's just that we're talking about how to help someone get some relief from the pain they are suffering and you are rambling on about something completely different and coming across like a schoolkid who has just got their hands on philosophy for dummies.
 
Man this might be stupid but I don't have insurance and I can't firgure out how to get it! I don't know if it's like everything else in that I get overwhelmed and just give up before I start or what but I have no money so I don't know if I can even get it.
 
Man this might be stupid but I don't have insurance and I can't firgure out how to get it! I don't know if it's like everything else in that I get overwhelmed and just give up before I start or what but I have no money so I don't know if I can even get it.

Apply for Obama care

What state do you live in?
 
Gypsie, like Captain Heroin said, apply for Obama Care. I have it, and it's pretty easy. There should be a web resource on your state government website and you can call and get the process started. You just have to prove your income, or lack thereof. it's really not that grueling of a process, at least it wasn't for me in Colorado.

Once you are on that you'll find that there are actually a lot of resources for mental illness and drug dependency that are actually covered. I was pleasantly surprised. I work my ass off but I am self employed so i do not have private healthcare, but on the Obama Care plan I have been pleased with my health care especially surrounding my addiction.

It can be overwhelming but you do sound like a perfect candidate for maintenance. My situation was similar and I really think Subs could help you a lot - they truly saved my life.

Whatever you choose, I hope things open up for you soon. Remember that just when we feel like there are no options, a door can open! Stay positive!
 
Ok thanks guys! I'm in Kansas, and I'm sure it's fairly easy to get insurance but I just need someone around to tell me what to do all the time haha. That's why I was so successful in rehab! Anyway I got suboxone from a friend today and I'm always so shocked at how effective it is! Definitely going to try and get this legitimately.
 
Ok thanks guys! I'm in Kansas, and I'm sure it's fairly easy to get insurance but I just need someone around to tell me what to do all the time haha. That's why I was so successful in rehab! Anyway I got suboxone from a friend today and I'm always so shocked at how effective it is! Definitely going to try and get this legitimately.

Go to your local social services building. They can help you apply for Obama care.
You might be able to apply online-not sure.
 
I too, was in the same boat. I went to rehab and even and managed 2 years of sobriety. Everything changed for the better. I got the job, the girl, the whole shabang! One day, stress and overall unhappiness led me to drink and the nightmare began. I managed to sober up after a few detox visits and narrowly escaping legal issues but, I lost the job, the girl and the life.

Fast forward to the past month: I sobered up from booze, got the girl back and because she was ill from lack of methadone, I got her some pills. Silly me thought how much fun it would be to IV with my girlfriend. I can honestly say that right now, I feel like shit physically and emotionally, she is back on methadone feeling well (grr) and we are on the edge of breaking up, I'm not working enough to bring in financial support....my world literally crashed.

I hope you are getting things under control and find a manageable balance of happiness and content. Hell, I'm only nearing 3 days sober and I'm starting to see the sun shine a bit. It could always be worse! Best of luck.
 
How are you doing recently, gypsiejunkie?

I'm not asking whether or not you're still using, that's secondary. We don't have to talk about that if you don't want to. I just want to make sure you're hangin' in there alright.

I'm going to check out the song you posted as soon as I get home and can wear headphones. Looking forward to it.
 
How are you doing recently, gypsiejunkie?

I'm not asking whether or not you're still using, that's secondary. We don't have to talk about that if you don't want to. I just want to make sure you're hangin' in there alright.

I'm going to check out the song you posted as soon as I get home and can wear headphones. Looking forward to it.

That's the nicest thing I've heard all day, thank you! Can't really respond at the moment, but I needed it! I'll respond more tomorrow ❤
 
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