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Ayahuasca - plant medicine to heal your soul

toby1985

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Joined
Dec 1, 2013
Messages
10
Hi

i am a 28 year old male living in perth wa.

I have been reading and watching videos online about ayahuasca an it sounds amazing.

I would really like to try it. I have social anxiety and depressive thoughts and i really think this will help me alot.

I'd love to hear from anyone who has information or is interested.


Cheers:d
 
You have probably seen the docos (vice did one I think?) about people travelling over to Peru or wherever it is for the main purpose of using Ayahuasca? I think someone died over there or something and they tried to cover it up..

There was also something I read about a place in NSW called Mullumbimby and the guy from there was saying there is a huge fan base there with hundreds of people who are into it, i'm not sure if they use it there or they just all talk about it and go overseas to use it, but the place has alot of hippies and drug users, is it even available to use here at all? I wouldn't know, and from some of the vids/docos I saw of people using it, it seems pretty intense and even scary, not sure I'd really wont to do it personally.
 
You have probably seen the docos (vice did one I think?) about people travelling over to Peru or wherever it is for the main purpose of using Ayahuasca? I think someone died over there or something and they tried to cover it up..

There was also something I read about a place in NSW called Mullumbimby and the guy from there was saying there is a huge fan base there with hundreds of people who are into it, i'm not sure if they use it there or they just all talk about it and go overseas to use it, but the place has alot of hippies and drug users, is it even available to use here at all? I wouldn't know, and from some of the vids/docos I saw of people using it, it seems pretty intense and even scary, not sure I'd really wont to do it personally.

or do it the easy way with dmt crystal and a certain RIMA! it's got some arsed name like chemhuasca
 
There are a heap of foods to avoid in combination with a MAOI. Find out what they are. At the least it will save you excessive nausea and in the worst case an MAOI combined with the wrong foods etc can be lethal. Fasting as outlined above is essential or at least consume foods that do not interact with MAOI's. Even tryptamine present in meat can interact with a high dose of MAOI. Caffeine could be fatal, red wine etc... You can get the MAOI and DMT from plant material, some of it native to this lovely country.

BTW you will purge till it feels your asshole has come out of your mouth.

Poledriver your 100% they use it down there... big time. Some nurseries actually carry the plants as some are used as garden ornaments. There are often Ayahuasca "circles" in that area...
 
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Yeah lovepsychadelics, I know of one nursery I've been told about a fair few times now, it apparently does a fair bit of 'alternate' stuff.

The whole town is pretty out there, loads of trippers and stuff. I have family there and have been going there for roughly 20 years, but havent really spent extended times there, always less than a week or so, and have never chatted to anyone there directly about ayahuasca. Acid and weed and pills I have though. And cactus.

This was the article I saw that mentioned mullum -

"I live in Mullumbimby and I would know (many) people who have gone and about 10 per cent of the town have either been or are connected to the ayahuasca community."
Razam says about half of those who try ayahuasca experience negative side effects.
"People have negative experiences frequently. That's part of the point of the medicine," he said.
"You have to do the work in the psychic atmosphere the medicine helps generate. That may mean that you have a terrifying experience where you face your childhood abuse and that gets exteriorised.
"You may feel that you're losing your mind because you're actually losing your ego."
"There are pros and cons."

http://www.news.com.au/travel/austr...al-awakening8217/story-e6frfq7r-1226667235924

Toby might wont to read the article, it also has a heap of comments -

jonathan b of act
Posted at 2:20 PM June 21, 2013

To Guy (Posted at 12:28 PM Today Comment 49 of 54) Well duh, of course I haven't taken this dangerous substance. I live a drug free lifestyle and as some others here have said, if you take care of yourself and not use drugs like these and other illegal drugs to get a high, you don't need to use them! People, any people who try these drugs to get a high or some false spiritual journey are, and again, I say, VERY stupid.

lol.
 
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Personally I would feel safer trying it in a place that is specifically set up for that kind of thing and has a long standing reputation like one of the retreats in Peru than here with people who may be new to it or worse still making it your self.
Mind you its much cheaper to get to northern nsw and I'm sure there are people there who know what they are doing. Probably the kind of thing you would have to be invited to through friends I would guess rather than a commercial operation.

My friend that went over to Peru said he had to go on a very strict diet in the week leading up to the ceremonies, I guess that is for the reasons mentioned above re MAOI's
 
I am toally fine with eating a strict diet for however long before drinking ayahuasca. Ideally I'd love to go to Peru and try it there in a proper ceremony and hopfully I will next year. In the meantime I'd like to find an experienced person here in Australia that performs ceremonies.

Will all ayahuasca in Australia be a chemical form or is it possible to make the plant version as used in Peru?


Cheers
 
I'm pretty sure you can grow the two plants required here so I don't see why not. The main issue is that I think making, drinking and sharing the ayahuasca could be considered illegal. I think you would have to gain someones trust before you would get someone to even mention they are involved in that kind of thing.
 
There are a heap of foods to avoid in combination with a MAOI. Find out what they are. At the least it will save you excessive nausea and in the worst case an MAOI combined with the wrong foods etc can be lethal. Fasting as outlined above is essential or at least consume foods that do not interact with MAOI's. Even tryptamine present in meat can interact with a high dose of MAOI. Caffeine could be fatal, red wine etc... You can get the MAOI and DMT from plant material, some of it native to this lovely country.
..

Not really true RIMA (reversible inhibitor monoamine oxidase A) aren't dangerous with any food, hell I've been mixing RIMAS with recreational drug for years with outstanding success

Also, all plants or seeds are available today on the net - just gotta keep looking
 
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Personally I would feel safer trying it in a place that is specifically set up for that kind of thing and has a long standing reputation like one of the retreats in Peru than here with people who may be new to it or worse still making it your self.
Mind you its much cheaper to get to northern nsw and I'm sure there are people there who know what they are doing. Probably the kind of thing you would have to be invited to through friends I would guess rather than a commercial operation.

My friend that went over to Peru said he had to go on a very strict diet in the week leading up to the ceremonies, I guess that is for the reasons mentioned above re MAOI's

Just walk down the street, chat to some random and you'll probably get invited lol. I'm surprised you have not come into contact with it Poledriver. Not commercial in any way unlike the Peruvian resorts/retreats. The MAOI component is the dangerous part. God the purging is awful, truly awful, you spew so fucking much. Not even San Pedro makes me spew like Yaje/ayahuasca. RIMA's are not part of a traditional brew of plant material, most often a certain vine which has both RIMA and MAOI components, but yes they are safer.

Harmala Alkaloids found in say Syrian Rue are considered RIMA's but I'd be very cautious as I've known people to get quite ill using Syrian Rue. The Banisteriopsis Caapi vine, one of the traditional ingredients used and the common ingredient of Ozzie Ayahuasca brews, contains both Harmala alkaloids AND MAOI's. I'd use a pharmaceutical like Moclobemide (Aurorix, Manerix) and you need a script. The plant material is all easily available on the net but I've copped flack for talking about that kind of thing before so to OP keep looking ;).

Know what the plant is if your preparing yourself ie the vine (MAOI) vs Syrian Rue (RIMA to some extent) or Moclobemide (RIMA). The "traditional" (imported to OZ and most common among the ayahuasca resorts) method involves a MAOI containing vine and a DMT containing plant.

DMT snuff is an excellent alternative and does not require the more dangerous MAOI component. Just a basic extraction and preparation of resulting plant material extract into a fine powder. Do some research it's a basic tek if people living in the middle of the amazon jungle with limited resources can make it anyone can. The traditional people's of certain parts of the Amazon use this method over the MAOI/DMT combo.

Some tribes simply use the MAOI containing vine. Some use coca leaf and DMT or MAOI or all three (i'd seriously consider a RIMA for this combo as it could be VERY DANGEROUS but the traditional three way combo usually involves the MAOI vine). Some have other admixtures of various plants but the central theme is the DMT and or MAOI containing plant species. There are all kinds of different variations of this theme and it often varies between individual tribal groups even if they have adjacent territories.
 
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It's in todays SMH -

The drug that's a tourist attraction

This drink will make you sick. It will make you throw up, in huge, violent bursts, and you'll probably need to crawl to the toilet at some point as well.
Then the hallucinations will start. Maybe they'll be pleasant and life-affirming. But the chances are they'll be nightmarish, full of ghouls and demons that will appear from within. You'll feel weak, maybe like your heart is slowly stopping, or like the world around you is shrinking, escaping from your grasp.

Eventually, however, it will wear off, and you'll find yourself back in the South American jungle, deep in the forest – but you may never be the same again.
The drink I'm talking about is ayahuasca, a hallucinogenic, medicinal shaman brew of the Amazon that has long been used in the indigenous cultures of Colombia and Peru, but is also experiencing a surge in popularity as a tourism attraction for Westerners seeking something different.

The tourists want in. They've heard about this spiritual brew, an infusion of plants containing dimethyltryptamine (DMT), that – depending on your point of view – either heals its users and allows them all new spiritual understanding, or just gets them wasted on hallucinogens.

It's a business. Go to Iquitos in Peru, the nerve centre of ayahuasca tourism, and you'll see signs of the practice all over the place, and will be offered an experience within minutes. Some of the ayahuasca is brewed and distributed in controlled environments, providing tourists the safest experience possible – while some of it is doled out by shoddy shamans keen to make a tourist buck.

Greg Carter is the director of Chimu Adventures, an Australian tour operator specialising in Latin American adventures. His company has seen a rise in interest in ayahuasca tourism, which he puts down to travellers looking for that "authentic" experience.
"Originally ayahuasca had a bit of a cult status on the backpacker scene," Greg says. "Backpackers went to Peru, and with the lure of a natural, legal hallucinogenic drug, people obviously tried it.

I suppose in the last few years with the growth in cultural tourism, and experiential tourism, people have moved on to this kind of thing to enhance their experience, become more ingrained in a local culture. People want to do what locals do."

Greg stresses that while it might be popular, ayahuasca is not exactly 100 per cent safe. "It's something we don't generally sell. There's a lot of danger around it, and a lot of people do die every year. Quite often that goes unreported. There are some places in Peru that are recommended, or who do have a good reputation – places like Rainforest Expeditions – but there's a lot of random shamans in places like Cusco that if you walk off the street and give them 20 bucks, you can get ayahuasca done without any preparation. There needs to be a fasting and cleansing period leading up to it. I would say to people, be very, very careful."

I haven't tried ayahuasca. I'm interested in it, but I'm also scared of it. It sounds like a massive risk. An Australian friend of mine, Chrisy Long, however, has spent the last month at an ayahuasca retreat in Peru called The Way Inn. The experience has had such a huge effect on her life that she's quit her job back home and decided to stay and work at the retreat.

"Ayahuasca is an incredible medicine," Chrisy says. "While I don't think the majority of people will suddenly leave their jobs, for me, it just feels right. I've had my spiritual awakening and now the universe is really pushing me in that direction."
Right. So what's the big appeal? "You can talk to as many people about their experience and they will all be different. Everyone is on their own personal journey. Everyone has different experiences.

"It's really difficult to put non-linear experiences into linear words. Aya just works so differently with everyone. You either get amazing fractal geometric visions and an acknowledgement of outer space, or you get experiences that are more family- or relationship-based, working with childhood or past-life experiences.

"You go through different family members, as many as seven generations before and ahead, all the emotions you went though and all the sad and happy memories, and you begin to understand your purpose as well as their purpose in life. It's like having 20 years of therapy."

Sounds... weird. Rather than focus on the one crazed hallucinogenic experience, The Way Inn does nine-day ayahuasca sessions with its clients. "We're focused on clearing those lifelong blockages, helping to undo lifelong patterns which you can take back with you into the Western world," Chrisy says. "We find the majority of clients transform in some way for the positive by the end of the retreat."

Like I said, I'm interested in ayahuasca, but I'm also scared of it. Our Western view, the one that's hammered into us from school age, is that "drugs are bad, mmkay", but who's to say that's true in this case? What if the shamans have got it all figured out? What if ayahuasca is a path to spiritual nirvana?

Or, on the other hand, what if it's just a night of petrifying hallucinations and soiling yourself? I doubt I'll ever have the guts to find out.
Have you ever tried ayahuasca? Would you? Have you had an experience overseas that could match ayahuasca? Are you surprised that this has become a tourist attraction? Have you engaged in risky behaviour while travelling? What was your experience like?

With comments -

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/travel/blogs/...-attraction-20131203-2ynjl.html#ixzz2mZSNW5jU
 
Thank's again Poledriver your article's are always interesting. DMT by itself is fine in terms of safety. God knows I've smoked a fair bit of plant extracted DMT freebase and NN-DMT. I've quit all forms of smoking though now days so it'll never happen again. Can be fucking intense shit. Yage is like that but longer lasting with puking etc because of the MAOI. Not once did I puke smoking DMT extract/ NN-DMT crystal shit (need to vapor the crystal BTW). Extracted DMT freebase you just soak some plant material in the goo, dry it and your good to go.

I think the article does not to clarify the difference between MAOI+DMT but otherwise a very objective piece of journalism. Quite rare indeed. It also mentions the dangers of back street fake shamans. That is also a good reason not to take the locals up on the offer of a Ayahuasca circle if your down Northern NSW as you do need to prepare for the experience, unless Syrian Rue is used (may the case) but even then be fucking careful.
 
My understanding is that another of the dangers in partaking in "ayahuasca tourism" is the inclusion, by some shaman (etc) of datura to the mix.
IIRC this has caused several deaths in recent times.
It seems the mythology of ayahuasca has only grown in the last decade or so...not sure how i feel about that.

Tryptamines are pretty magical, but can they "heal your soul"?
 
Yeah Datura or more specifically Brugmansia is often added in some tribal groups. Didn't see it in Peru but who knows? I partook of it twice as part of a tour thing in the lowland/jungles so I don't have much experience with the whole Ayahuasca tourism thing aside from that, much rather chew coca leaf. Fuck man that would be a serious mind fuck with lethal results, obviously. Thanks space junk! BTW I don't think Yage/Ayashasca is going to heal your soul or anything, especially if Brugmansia is added.

Ok so a 20 second search of the net yielded this:

Economic Botany
1 Winter 2004, Volume 58, Issue 1 Supplement, pp S221-S229
The ritual use of Brugmansia species in traditional Andean medicine in Northern Peru
Vincenzo De Feo
 
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You have done some amazing travelling man. Lucky you, sounds like you have had many great experiences.
 
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Not really. I don't consider laying on a raised wooden platform (the jungle is crawling with all kinds of nasties BTW) in some South American village puking into a cheap plastic bucket while fucked of my head a great +. Interesting but not life altering. It's more like I'm a transient. Kind of like a classy homeless person in a way. Work to play is my motto though. I guess I have been pretty lucky in some regards but I don't have kids which is a shame.

Going to post this here basically it's my theory of true ego loss. Ego loss is nothing more than looking at your actions and realizing your not special. Looking at your life and realizing that your up your own ass so far it hurts. I realize even posting on BL I come across as self absorbed. You don't need massive doses of drugs that endanger your life to achieve this. To be humbled and reflect upon oneself is the essence of ego loss in my opinion. Loss of the self absorbed asshole basically even if it's transient. Anyway that's what I think true ego loss is about.

To anyone reading this please be careful with recreational substance use and don't buy into the bullshit that drugs somehow change your outlook on life. Indeed drug abuse is often a symptom of being a self absorbed prick in the first place. I feel this should have it's own thread in psychedelic forum as some kind of HR. Way to many people buy into the bullshit about Freudian ego loss on psychedelic drugs and other ideals expounded by the drug culture as a whole. Just my thoughts as I'm no one special, just had a bit of luck I guess and no kids.

I never met the machine elves or whatever the fuck other people talk about, it's probably because I don't get all that delusional on substances. Got some amazing visuals, felt my heart beat way to fast and was a bit scared I was going home in a coffin. Had a bit of an ordeal and was not even sure where I was anymore. Puked so much it hurt real bad. Got bitten by all kinds of biting flying things while covered in a river of sweat.

I guess everyone's experience differs but is it worth the plane trip, cost of staying in a cheap hotel and booking a random travel agent to experience this... not really IMO when you could do it in the comfort of your own home. I did not go there to experience aya/yage I went there to see what that part of the world is like. It had always interested me as a child. Fuck I'd love to go back again though. Bitten by the travel bug. I've abused to many friendships/relationships and always put me first above everyone else, even my own family, pretty fucking sad really.

I'm a self loathing hipster. There it is the true essence of ego loss.
 
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I never met the machine elves or whatever the fuck other people talk about, it's probably because I don't get all that delusional on substances. Got some amazing visuals, felt my heart beat way to fast and was a bit scared I was going home in a coffin.
Sounds like you didnt "break through" - its not really a "delusional" space at all.

As for drugs not changing your outlook on life, I don't think that is Freudian bullshit at all.
Not by a long shot!
Maybe you just don't "love psychadelics(sic)" as much as your handle suggests?
 
I've drank at five different ceremonies in the Colombian amazon, drinking two times in four of them, and three in one. Predominantly, I drank with a renowned Cofán shaman and his apprentice who is a great friend of mine (and also professor of philosophy at one of Colombia's top universities), but I was also lucky enough to drink at a toma that involved the major shamans of the Cofán people. At this ceremony, we drank D. cabrerana (which is preferred in Colombia and Ecuador over P. viridis) + B. caapi + B. Grandiflora here.

Yagé is the both the most beautiful and deepest experience I've had. I would argue that realising how far your head is up your arse is indeed a spiritual experience. I would also suggest that if it's approached with respect you'll get a lot more out of it. I found myself in completely different worlds that contained no referents to this reality where everything was completely alien. I also found myself in world's that resembled this one that seemed to tell narratives which held great meaning for me.

I certainly learnt a lot about myself from my experiences and the only advice I would give is to approach the experience with a light heart. And be prepared to totally let go. If you can let go of everything while accepting whatever comes up, you'll be in for something truly beautiful.

Approaching it like a drug is like going to a Buddhist monastery convinced that you'll attain enlightenment in a minute.

Oh, and expect to shit as well as puke ;)
 
I would be hesitant to recommend someone suffering from mental illness to try ayahuasca. You may find it cleans your mind but you are just as likely open up a sizable can of worms, doing it in an experienced setting like yagecera sounds better. Historically in South America it was used by the shaman, not the everyday man. These guys were selected because of their mental capabilities, not just because they were born into it. A bit like those disclaimers at the end of stunt shows, they are train professionals. I'm not surprised that western tourists lose their shit going there with no real understanding or appreciation if it's use.

There is a BLer called the Wood who is a crazy martial artist/ zen practiser who has written some cool experiences on his trips to Peru. Well worth tracking down if they still exist.

A mate who is an avid botanist has a nice collection of imported exotic plants, one being a vine from South America. He went away for work and came back three months later and this thing had exploded out of its pot and literally overgrown the garage, his fence and half the neighbours yard. I have never been too keen to partake after that, it's like that plant has some mystical super powers lurking deep within its skin. Fucking freaky vibe, and I'm not one to be spooked by hocus pocus.
 
Oh I broke through all right but it wasn't machine elves more like inner demons and stuff from my life that I was not proud of coming and hitting me full force. The "wasn't sure were I was" indeed seemed like I was some other place/time in my own mind but more of people, places and a stern "lecture" going on about all the negatives I'd done in my life leading me to believe that basically I was a self centered prick. Hits hard and leaves you a dribbling, sweaty, puky mess.The purge can come from both ends BTW and I'm sure I stained my boxers. Get a weird after glow the next day almost like your healed to some degree as you come to terms with all the negative elements of your life and are able to accept them as something you did and your able to move on.

If you get Machine elves or other entities good for you but I suspect it is a delusional thought process, kind of like the light at the end of the tunnel when we die. Your body is not quite sure if your dying or not. Don't know if that makes much sense but that is what I experience. I could easily understand other people having different experiences and as I said this was just my experience. BTW I've smoked crap loads of "Changga" blend and NN DMT. Again nothing like meeting extraterrestrial beings more like being one with the earth our mother. That and the whole light at the end of the tunnel type deal. That is my belief system so it's obvious that is what I'd experience.

Freud has been discredited a long time ago so anything that basis it's ideology on his teachings will be a little flawed as well. Popular up until the 70's. Freud believed woman were Hysterical and needed to have a hysterectomy to correct this imbalance...

I love psychedelics off all kinds 4 aco dmt/mipt/met 4ho MET/Mipt/DMT etc, all the 2cx's, NB, Dox, LSD, ALD 52 etc. Yage is something unique I feel to each user and there was a shaman conducting the ceremony. Once you ingest it many different perceptions appear. 1 cup of that Yage was enough to blow my mind for hours. Second evening I participated in a second ceremony and had a similar experience to the first. I won't lie and say it's a beautiful one way ticket to the machine elves, it is an intense experience that leaves you feeling wrecked and certainly causes you to confront certain elements of your life that have been simmering away underneath that you have pushed to the back of your subconscious mind. If that is not a break through what is?

Also yage is something that needs respect and we fasted for 3 days prior to the experiences and went through a whole lot of ritualistic preparation under the guidance of the village shaman (who could only speak his native language and a little spainsh lol).
 
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