Anything about kava and liver safety?

[George1012]

I've been drinking kava for a while. I didn't really think anything of the possibility of liver or kidney damage because all my friends had been drinking it for awhile too when I started. They said themselves they guarantee that its perfectly safe. They told me as long as I 'wean into it' and drink as much as I'm comfortable drinking its fine. I started with a few cups a day, then up to 1-2 brews. A brew usually contains 3-5 cups. Lately I've been drinking 3-5 brews a day but I quit two days ago. I'm trying to decide if I want to go back to it or not. Does anyone here know anything about kava's safety?

Reading various stories about liver and kidney failure from other users scared me away. I'd like to resume drinking kava but not at the cost of my liver.

The worst side effects I've had from prolonged use are dry skin and bags under eyes. I've lost weight, too but that was intentional so I don't count that as a 'side effect.'

I've felt nauseous a lot from drinking it when I first started and barfed a few times from overdoing it, when I wasn't used to it. Now I know the point I can get to comfortably without getting too plowed and ending up sick.

I also take kratom, another herb, which I've heard is fine to take with kava. I don't take any other drugs or drink either.

Any other kava lovers out there?

 

[trogere]

It sounds like a lot of Kava! I was taking a cup at a time and skipped days when I was taking kava.

 

[JackARoe]

My wife gave up drinking 5 years ago. But took up sipping (yes I said sipping) kava throughout the day and has done that for a few years now. Her health is excellent and her blood work normal. She takes milk thistle on and off as a precaution for the liver. Now I can do kava once in a while, I have to chug that muddy brew quickly for a strong effect. But my wife sips it out of one of those mugs with the straws so it doesn't spill.

Some different types have given her rashes. They go away with a few days off or a different strain. But no other harmful effects we can see and I have my eye on it. She was a hard core alcoholic who has her life completely together now except for the daily kava. But I think that is ok considering the obstacles that have been overcome. I think kava can be used with minimal harmful effects if it is watched and someone pays attention to their body. I know it is drunk everyday in the Pacific Islands so there's that too.

 

[T. Calderone]

Although it's not super common, kava has been linked to instances of acute liver injury. As an anxiolytic, it's something that interests me but since I already have liver damage from hepatitis c and years of alcohol abuse, I can't use kava. I always check the NIH's liver tox page when trying new medications. This is a long read but you may find it helpful: https://livertox.nlm.nih.gov//KavaKava.htm

 

[Pickledlemons]

There was a study looking at the link between kava and liver damage, it wasn't conclusive but it suggested that the damage is actually caused from the stem/leaves. The root is the psychoactive part, but its suspected that modern suppliers were ripping out and grinding down the entire plant. Please note that liver poisoning from kava is not present in its natives regions ( like hawaii). Its also possible they have a gene mutation we do not... Anyway, make sure you are only consuming root.

 

[JackARoe]

^ I remember those studies back at about 2002. Kava causing liver damage was all over the news. I think a few people from Germany died from liver issues and kava was blamed. A closer look showed other meds involved too in those deaths. Then it came out that the stems and leaves had some toxins but the roots didn't. I do remember that and the outcry by kava users that the Pacific Islanders used it for years and have no liver issues.

 

[MDPV_Psychosis]

I've been drinking kava for a while. I didn't really think anything of the possibility of liver or kidney damage because all my friends had been drinking it for awhile too when I started. They said themselves they guarantee that its perfectly safe. They told me as long as I 'wean into it' and drink as much as I'm comfortable drinking its fine. I started with a few cups a day, then up to 1-2 brews. A brew usually contains 3-5 cups. Lately I've been drinking 3-5 brews a day but I quit two days ago. I'm trying to decide if I want to go back to it or not. Does anyone here know anything about kava's safety?

Reading various stories about liver and kidney failure from other users scared me away. I'd like to resume drinking kava but not at the cost of my liver.

The worst side effects I've had from prolonged use are dry skin and bags under eyes. I've lost weight, too but that was intentional so I don't count that as a 'side effect.'

I've felt nauseous a lot from drinking it when I first started and barfed a few times from overdoing it, when I wasn't used to it. Now I know the point I can get to comfortably without getting too plowed and ending up sick.

I also take kratom, another herb, which I've heard is fine to take with kava. I don't take any other drugs or drink either.

Any other kava lovers out there?

Hey George, how did you feel after quitting suddenly? Just wondering if you felt any discontinuation symptoms?

 

[Volsam]

I like some occasional Kava. Intensifies cannabis too!

I read in some research paper that alcohol extracts are suspected to be more toxic than water extracts. Most of the Kava sold is ethanol extracted but there are few brands out there that specifically do water ones, just gotta ask the seller about it.

Sorry for hijacking the thread but anybody tried 95% CO2 extracts of Kava for dabbing, are they any good?

 

[JackARoe]

Hey Volsam I have never got any type of kava extract to work for me. I have not tried in a while though. But usually only the ground root made into a muddy brew and slammed down works for me.

Kava and cannabis, big thumbs up. Kava has a little magical component to itself that does come out when I mix cannabis with it.

 

[Keif' Richards]

Sadly, Kava (Kavalactones) and Kratom (Mitragynine) lack truly significant research, as they don't have an official place in the pharmacopoeia of Western Medicine. We only have very limited knowledge into the possible harmful effects of either of these drugs, but we will focus on Kava for now, as this seems to be your primary concern.

There are several articles that I have read in passing regarding Kava and liver damage that, at the very, very least, seem to imply that the drug in question does indeed have the potential to cause liver damage. The issue here, is that we don't have anything concrete for you. It's my opinion that the best advice we can give you is to not use Kava, as it can be hepatotoxic. Are you in the mood for an analogy?

Let's look at a commonly used drug, namely, Methadone. Millions of people take it and have taken it, although it is an unfortunate fact that it can have a negative impact on heart rhythm that can actually lead to death. The medical "establishment" is well-aware of this fact, as are the majority of patients who read their onboarding paperwork. Still, the patients and docs both make the decision that the medication is ultimately worth the risk when considering the potential benefits of treatment. The negative impact on the heart's QT interval is decidedly rare, but it can happen and it can kill when it does.

Ask yourself the same question. Is this worth the risk to you? I'm not patronizing you. This is totally serious. If it's a life-changing anxiolytic or something, I can see your rationale. If you're just catching a nice buzz, perhaps consider a better-studied or less harmful drug.

 

[George1012]

Hey George, how did you feel after quitting suddenly? Just wondering if you felt any discontinuation symptoms?

I drank a little last night. The stuff I buy is known and promised to be noble root only. I've drank nastier dirtier kavas from local stores and non reputable sites and got rashes. I've never had any issues with this noble stuff. I think instead of drinking it every day now I'll cut back to 5 days a week and see how that goes.

 

[George1012]

JackARoe, I agree with what you said about combining kava and cannabis. I started with drinking kava by itself but lately for the most part I drink all my kava right before or after using cannabis and the two of them together put you in a blissful trippy paradise. I've come to realize for myself that after combining the two, either one is incomplete without the other.

 

[George1012]

Keif Richards, I've come to the conclusion that unlike any other drug, kava has a protective way about it. Your body tells you when you've been drinking too much and it manifests itself in rash, extreme nausea, or vomiting. If any of the following have occurred I take 2-3 days break and then resume and there are no problems. Other then that the only thing to worry about is that I smoke cigarettes occasionally. I eat healthy whole foods for the most part and exercise every day and have pretty decent endurance. So finally, I think my body would warn me far before any real damage should occur. This is why I only drink the highly reputable noble kavas from the good quality vendors and to drink plenty of water and take vitamins daily, as its a diuretic. I don't even mess with the iffy kavas anymore. Thanks for your reply.