Anyone willing to help me with a taper plan?

[Regulat0r10]

So I got carried away with diazepam and clonazepam (taken together) with 60mg methadone for about a month (MMT for 2 years)

I’d like to slowly taper from my Benzos.
I work 12 hours a day 5-6 shifts a week. So it would def be a slow taper. Do U guys reccomend I taper off one at a time or both at the same time?

on average 4mg clonazepam and 20-30mg valuim

I’m also prescribed adderall but I’ve been on tbar for a long time and don’t tend to take it often unless I get too sedated but noticed it causes my methadone dose to not hold as much as it should but lasts longer when I don’t take adderall. Also the UA’s have dropped my methadone metabolites and they are questioning my 27 take homes. One came positive for fent (which is bullshir because everything I have taken is real us pharma) I don’t mess with H or any other opiates. So I need to remove these meds out of my system which would probly take a month.

that said I have prepared a large stash for this moment. I have a unlimited supply of:
800mg gabapentin IR tablets
Clonidine
Hydroxyzine
Baclofen 10mg
etizolam
Bromazolam 5mg
ClonazOLAM (I have used once and rarely take unless I absolutely cannot sleeep and it would be maximum 1.2mg
Xanax
500mg prosoma

All pharma aside from the RC’s for they have been stashed for this very moment. I wasn’t completely sure weather the RC’s may be better to taper with or the Xanax. Obviously I’d neeed a benzo that is short acting so it’s out of my system by the next couple months for I’m running low on clean urine.

I’m aware of what my consequences were and am ready to face it. It was 100% worth it for me because I landed the best job I ever had and I legitimately have agoraphobia and panic attacks sometimes 2-3 a day. My clinic is totally fine with me being on Benzos if I can get a prescription. Now that I’m leaving Kaiser and have blue anthem PPO thru my company, I’ll simply provide them with the past 10 years of my rx medical record and my previous doc can write me a referral. I just don’t have the time due to work and the Ot opportunity.

i know I’m going to be fairly uncomfortable for a while. I have plenty of sick time but I’ve only worked for this company for 4 months.

should I switch to the Ashton manual and continue my current MMt dose?

only problem is it causes me to be too get sedated and I’d need to take some adderall to offside the effects.

I’m completely aware of the dangers but I’d really appreciate some advice minus the lectures. Thanks in advanced BL!

much love,

reg

 

[Regulat0r10]

Oh yeah as far as the Benzos if I didn’t write it in post, I have been using the Benzos for a solid 2-3 months. On off days and when we go back to nurse shift hours

 

[negrogesic]

Are you trying to get off benzos entirely? Or do you just want to reduce your average daily dose?

 

[Regulat0r10]

well I was orignionally required to be on Benzos due to panic attacks for quite some time and later down the road I tried those Purdue 80’s and from there H. But still needed the Benzos and took as perscribed. But the doc saw that as abuse and it’s been hard to get perscribed a normal dose for panic attacks. I’d like to basically TRY to stop taking Benzos for a while or Atleast taper to a lower dose before things get really really bad cus obviously I’m going down a bad path rigjt now. The job js spretty repetitive stressful and a lot of drama. It’s honestly the only thing that’s helped. I’ve been doing CBT breathing exercises and I just can’t have that happening during work for everything is fast pace. They even get mad for u for using the restroom esp if it’s after a 15min break.

aside from that my life has improved so much. I’m actually working a job that helps the public health (otc covid Kits) I know methadone is gonna be a bitch to get off of, unless of course I go very slowly but then the post acute wd screw me over. I’m doing this all on my own with no help and it’s painful just to get out of bed at 5am esp when it’s cold. Anyhow, my entire goal is to get off everything but I’m thinking maybe the benzos would be better to use durring post acute wd but at the same time I am capable of not taking it everyday. I would like to use them as a tool… maybe once or twice a week but I just feel stuck and my clinic is horrible. It gives me anxiety just going for a fill due to the people, and of course the wild card of workers and counselors leaving every month.

but idk what the best method would be for this current timing. Perhaps it’s best to just reduce my daily dose. Also is combining a small amount of clonazepam and diazepam a bad thing to do? Or are all Benzos binding to same receptors and in essence same wd effects? Of course im talking about scripts not the LAMS. I stay away from those I just got some stocked just in case. I will use some Etiz here and there tho

 

[Keif' Richards]

Hey @Regulat0r10

There are many people here who would be more than happy to help you out, myself included. First, it sounds like you're already pretty well-educated and informed about a lot of this stuff which is great. You metion the Ashton Manual, which is something we love to refer to here. I think any of us would be wrong in claiming that we could do it any better than Dr. Ashton. That doesn't mean we can't benefit from the subtle differences in each others' experiences, which is where you can get some benefit.

Next, it's great that you have access to all of those substances. That's really a lot of different shit, so you're starting from a much more advantageous point than about 99% of other people. I'm going to state the obvious: you don't want to end up more addicted than when you started or, addicted to other things for that matter.

Like I said, we will all totally help you out, but I actually think the best thing to do right now would be to test the waters. Don't make it super complicated yet. See if you can manage a dosage reduction. I think a big change should be in your philosophy. You should be thinking more about how you will integrate these changes into your actual life, as opposed to taking time off of work and biting the leather for a few short weeks. Real life is the test and the rehabilitation industry has made people forget that.

Too many people go to these 30-day programs or 90-day prorgams and think they can just end it all then and there. I think it's such a great idea and we all are in denial in so many ways, that we often fail to realize that very obvious fact. You can't fix such a totally complicated problem like anxiety, depression or substance abuse by going away to a program. I don't deny that these swift kicks in the ass can be benefical for folks in starting their recovery, but I think they are often far from the answer that they are portrayed to be, as in, the benefit from these programs actually comes from something that the program never even advertises.

I would try making some dosage adjustments. See what impact these adjustments have on your symptoms i.e. agoraphobia and such.

BTW if you're testing positive for Fentanyl, you more than likely have consumed Fentanyl. That's not your fault, but it's likely the case.

 

[Regulat0r10]

Hey @Regulat0r10

There are many people here who would be more than happy to help you out, myself included. First, it sounds like you're already pretty well-educated and informed about a lot of this stuff which is great. You metion the Ashton Manual, which is something we love to refer to here. I think any of us would be wrong in claiming that we could do it any better than Dr. Ashton. That doesn't mean we can't benefit from the subtle differences in each others' experiences, which is where you can get some benefit.

Next, it's great that you have access to all of those substances. That's really a lot of different shit, so you're starting from a much more advantageous point than about 99% of other people. I'm going to state the obvious: you don't want to end up more addicted than when you started or, addicted to other things for that matter.

Like I said, we will all totally help you out, but I actually think the best thing to do right now would be to test the waters. Don't make it super complicated yet. See if you can manage a dosage reduction. I think a big change should be in your philosophy. You should be thinking more about how you will integrate these changes into your actual life, as opposed to taking time off of work and biting the leather for a few short weeks. Real life is the test and the rehabilitation industry has made people forget that.

Too many people go to these 30-day programs or 90-day prorgams and think they can just end it all then and there. I think it's such a great idea and we all are in denial in so many ways, that we often fail to realize that very obvious fact. You can't fix such a totally complicated problem like anxiety, depression or substance abuse by going away to a program. I don't deny that these swift kicks in the ass can be benefical for folks in starting their recovery, but I think they are often far from the answer that they are portrayed to be, as in, the benefit from these programs actually comes from something that the program never even advertises.

I would try making some dosage adjustments. See what impact these adjustments have on your symptoms i.e. agoraphobia and such.

BTW if you're testing positive for Fentanyl, you more than likely have consumed Fentanyl. That's not your fault, but it's likely the case.

It’s so odd because everything I have had been tested to energy control as far as the RC’s that I never use. Same with blister packs and real pharmas. I think the clinic made another mistake. (Long story) but dsidbdue to the strict regulations they can only give me my take homes back in the quickest legal manner. I think after every month they r giving me 7 back but yes I agree with you, I do not want to start a new addiction or rather stop the use asap. I don’t understand why everyone tells me that adderall doesn’t affect methadone for every time I decide to take one as needed, my nose starts to get runny sooner, and I legit feel wd symptoms (same feeling u get when u feel ur dose isn’t holding all the way… when I DONT take it, it lasts much longer.. ppl say it’s a mental thing but I even did a supervised UA without taking adderall for a couple days before the test, and oddly enough, it showed or met the required amount of methadone metabolites in the UA. There has god to be some interaction no? I mean wouldn’t it make my body metabolize quicker? I mean the clinic dr does inform us that ppl that are doing hard labor tend to run they their dose faster compared to when they aren’t working, hence why I’m told most start their taper again durring winter for they aren’t sweating as much…

but back to the point, I’m not here to waste anyones time and I’d love it if u could help me out, u talked some sense into me before, also willing to take advice from others. That said, I find it better when I take half my dose in morning and other half durring lunch or around 1/2pm otherwise my dose runs out sooner.

so what ur saying is I should stop kpins, valuim, and stick with Etiz or Xanax due to shorter half life? The issue for me is kpins are the most helpful but like I said I need to clear it from my system. I have got off before using Ashton manual but honestly feel I am one that falls under really needing bzd to improve quality of my life.
Obviously it’s a drug that can’t be taken forever, it’s inevitable to my understanding unless ur someone on it for life taking Xanax 3mg xr’s and shit. Idk how all these people are my clinic are getting legit scripts and the clinic has no issue whatsoever. I even provided my doc how long I was on bzd but she’s a Kaiser doc and wouldn’t prescribe shit until I went out of network to get my adderall Back. The moment I told her she happily took over the prescription and now boosted it to 30mg but dont typically like uppers but it works when need it esp with like 2mg kpin… but I’d only take like 10mg with my dose and 10mg with my other half dose. even have some temazepam and zolpiderm stashed (not a fan of ambien tho) but as u can see i have got just about everything I’ve read ppl have used to help taper off. I’d like to remain on Benzos but not nearly as often yet alone anyqhere close to the doses I been using. but that said I truly get panic attacks and up to twice a day esp work related or when I’m tapering on methadone.

is there anyone out there that feels the methadone stigma with Benzos is fucked up for those who actually need it? Clearly it’s high abuse potential and many have ruined it for others but I legit have been diagnosed with agoraphobia and every anxiety disorder on the list. And clearly have a tolerance to be taking what I am with my dose. I need to nip this in the bud now that I landed the job and my leads r happy with my performance.

so I guess it’s as simple as lowering your dose daily but since I’m already using Benzos should I be using this to taper off the done quicker or should I just try to bring back my benzo tolerance down first? Also has anyone heard good things from b these ketamine clinics? Or coma induced opiate detoxes? And do u know anyone that successfully “reset” their brain with ibogaine?

 

[Regulat0r10]

Are you trying to get off benzos entirely? Or do you just want to reduce your average daily dose?

This for now, I’m thinking one substance at a time but feel I did it backwards but if it was able to get me out of the house for 2 years, get a reputable job, speak fluently and confidently (I.e words rolling off the tip of my tongue perfectly) can talk to females and i have my family supporting me and b everyone that has been in my life has all mentioned how impressed and proud of me for how well I have been doing and landing a job that I wouldn’t ever accomplish without Benzos. I am just completely aware of what wd are like, and I have had to detox from quite a bit of a daily dose to reset my tolerance and take another break.

i had to experience 2g H4 iv habit a day with xannax simply because i was prescribed it and obviously they synergies eachother but yeah I have my life back as far as self esteem, purpose, approval, and working 12 hour shifts. Little do they know that the Benzos is what got me here. I’d like to get to the point where I can use Benzos as needed and intended. To where id take maybe 1-3 times a week. All in all I want off eventually but clearly Benzos are something I actually need.

Also, what are the possibilities of obtaining methadone pills instead of going thru a clinic? I’ve seen ppl with pills but figured it’s for hospital use or cancer patients/chronic pain. For instance if I provided my UA record at clinic ect but it would make my life so much wasier because I can hardly make it to work on time wirh 6am to 6pm shifts not only that my clinic is a wild card… ALWAHS understsffed and have been stuck there for 1 hour straight due to do may counselors and dosers getting recycled because most workers leave once they get that certification. I don’t feel comfortable at the clinic and have send the same UA’s I provided for clinic the same day To a reputable one, along with a full panel dip stick and always showed nothing but what I’m prescribed. My counselor even admitted there have been many situations like this is esp when they claim they found fent or diluted

 

[negrogesic]

This for now, I’m thinking one substance at a time but feel I did it backwards but if it was able to get me out of the house for 2 years, get a reputable job, speak fluently and confidently (I.e words rolling off the tip of my tongue perfectly) can talk to females and i have my family supporting me and b everyone that has been in my life has all mentioned how impressed and proud of me for how well I have been doing and landing a job that I wouldn’t ever accomplish without Benzos. I am just completely aware of what wd are like, and I have had to detox from quite a bit of a daily dose to reset my tolerance and take another break.

i had to experience 2g H4 iv habit a day with xannax simply because i was prescribed it and obviously they synergies eachother but yeah I have my life back as far as self esteem, purpose, approval, and working 12 hour shifts. Little do they know that the Benzos is what got me here. I’d like to get to the point where I can use Benzos as needed and intended. To where id take maybe 1-3 times a week. All in all I want off eventually but clearly Benzos are something I actually need.

Also, what are the possibilities of obtaining methadone pills instead of going thru a clinic? I’ve seen ppl with pills but figured it’s for hospital use or cancer patients/chronic pain. For instance if I provided my UA record at clinic ect but it would make my life so much wasier because I can hardly make it to work on time wirh 6am to 6pm shifts not only that my clinic is a wild card… ALWAHS understsffed and have been stuck there for 1 hour straight due to do may counselors and dosers getting recycled because most workers leave once they get that certification. I don’t feel comfortable at the clinic and have send the same UA’s I provided for clinic the same day To a reputable one, along with a full panel dip stick and always showed nothing but what I’m prescribed. My counselor even admitted there have been many situations like this is esp when they claim they found fent or diluted

Methadone is somewhat rarely dispensed outside the context of clinics, and is generally used by more progressive pain management doctors.

I understand what you are saying about benzos, I also feel like I'm a better more effective version of myself, like a weight has been removed. But in the end they always spell disaster for me.