Anyone familiar with debt collection law?

[CloudyHazeD]

So, let's say I've had this debt. I got a computer from a big name company in 2001.

I paid on it for awhile.....but I was young and dumb. The high interest buried me and eventually the account was 'charged off'.

This account went to a collection agency. I paid on it for a while. Then I got stupid again and just quit paying. (about the year2002-2003)

The account has since been passed around through a good seven different collection agencies .

I ignored ALL of them.

Now, fast forward to 2008.

The debt was passed off to yet another collection firm. This one is a law office.

I ignored their first two letters.

Now three months after their initial letter I get a court summons. They are taking me to civil court for the debt.

Funny thing is, they state right on the summons they have no proof of this debt......that I have been sent the records pertaining to it over the course of several years and I should have them. (well if this goes to court, isn't that covered under not having to incriminate myself?.... IE: the people filing suit against me MUST prove the validity of this debt?)

I just mailed off a letter demanding proof of this debt. This should stop the civil suit and all collection activity until they are able to either send me proof or drop it all together.

So I guess I'm just wondering if I did the right thing. Seeing as I made absolutely NO contact with them up until today.....I still have my right to dispute?

Anyone have any experience with this sort of thing? Im in the States.....

 

[Missykins]

What you have done is known as a "cease and desist" letter. I do not think that it will make a difference here since you have a summons to appear. They are probably trying to go through small claims court (depending upon how much you owe--there is a limit) and get a court order for you to pay the remaining balance PLUS late fees PLUS interest charges PLUS court fees. They can get a court order to empty out your checking/savings account for the amount they say that you owe. They will have to demonstrate how much you owe in court.

These guys are experienced; they are not going to show up in court with no way of demonstrating how you owe them this money. I think the best thing that you can do is contact them or work out a payment plan, or charge it on your credit card, and apply for a balance transfer to pay it off over time.

What is the amount that you owe them?

 

[Johnny1]

Try to negotiate. See what is the lowest amount they will take.

 

[CloudyHazeD]

They have already tacked on $100 some dollars for the court filing fees.

The amount is around $1200.

Everything I read (even the FTC site) state that I have a right to dispute and by sending said 'cease and desist' dispute letter they must stop collection(civil suits included; ref; FTC.com) until they can provide some form of verification/proof from the original creditor that the debt is legit and outstanding.

If they could have done this it would have been included with my court summons.

So, I figure, why let them have this easy. I've more that paid for this computer twice over.

Also, the collection firm is from several states away from mine. If this actually goes to court I will make damn sure they have to send a legit representative from the original creditor (as according to state law IF/WHEN I cross examine the plaintiff....which is my federal right according to the constitution.) and chances are they are not going to spend more money flying someone in to make an appearance.

The burden of proof is on them.

Seeing as the only document mailed to me via certified mail (and thus provable) is the court summons they will have a hard time proving I even knew about the debt. (seeing as I NEVER answered any of their calls or any other agency calls or letters)

I guess if anything, I'm just buying time to save up the money. But this debt is so old and so convoluted.....they are going to have a hard time proving it valid.

 

[Missykins]

Try to negotiate. See what is the lowest amount they will take.

That would be my recommendation as well. You don't need a judgement against you fouling up your credit score.

 

[forgotten]

In which state is the civil suit being filed? Many states have a statute of limitations on debt, which may or may not be applicable in your situation.

 

[SA]

I am going to have to respectfully disagree with Johnny1 here. Especially on a debt that's been floating around in limbo for several years, I would not negotiate with the collection agency (you should only negotiate with the original creditor - the bank - while the debt is still there, which it is no longer; never negotiate with collections agency, because they lie, lie, lie and whatever it is you think you've negotiated is simply a ruse to get an immediate payment of any amount from you and they will immediately come after you for the rest). Any contact you have with the collection agency or their lawyers should be in writing only at this point, i.e. avoid all telephone contact. All correspondence should be very specifically formulated. For proper letter templates (validation, C&D, etc), please check out WHYCHAT. For exactly which form letter(s) to use when and in what succession, please consider spending some time reading up and then consulting some of the regulars on the credit forum at at creditboards. Forgotten is correct in that the statute of limitations may come into play here.

 

[Cyc]

Also gonna disagree with Johnny on this one from a common sense standpoint.

The minute you negotiate with them, you're admitting to the debt owing. Furthermore, you'll get saddled with whatever costs they feel entitled to for voluntarily taking on the collection as a 3rd (5th?) party. I'd say nothing unless legally compelled to.

Also.. what does a new computer go for these days.. $300? I'm sure you've more than paid for the stupid thing by now.

Again, I speak from a common sense standpoint, not a legal one.

 

[getreal]

That would be my recommendation as well. You don't need a judgement against you fouling up your credit score.

His credit score is already fouled up. Once you hit the 'creditor letter' level its pretty much trashed.

 

[Missykins]

His credit score is already fouled up. Once you hit the 'creditor letter' level its pretty much trashed.

Not necessarily. Yes, the OP is certainly entitled to writing a Cease and Desist letter. I have written one myself in response to a collection agency operating on the behalf of a doctor (so much for professional courtesy) that was already compensated by my health insurance. This was a simple one for me for me, all I needed was a copy of the benefits summary from my insurance company and it was resolved.

The collection agency is required to remove the debt from his credit history once a cease and desist letter has been received, and I would recommend that the OP check to see if this debt is affecting his credit report.

OP, I sadly expect that you will end up paying this debt in the end because I do believe that they will be able to demonstrate the debt. Having said that, the cease and desist demand that you have made will allow you to protect your credit score during this process. You were smart to write one. Always exert your rights as a consumer.

You may be pleasantly surprised to learn that collection agency will likely be open to negotiation--they are often willing to settle for a lesser amount. Keep your options open.

SOL is typically seven years if I am not mistaken.

 

[Cyc]

His credit score is already fouled up. Once you hit the 'creditor letter' level its pretty much trashed.

Right, and since it's already trashed, I'd be hesitant to acknowledge the debt.

 

[Facekhan]

Check the Debt statute of limitations for the type of debt and your state. The debt may be legally unenforceable. The date is usually the date of the last account activity, such as a payment or an agreement to pay. Its possible they are dragging you into court because the SOL is about to expire and this is their last shot.

http://www.fair-debt-collection.com/statue-limitations.html

 

[CloudyHazeD]

Statute for my state is 15 years.

I went ahead and mailed a cease and desist letter.

The letter outlines that I do not think I owe what they say I owe and then goes on to outline their two choices of action. Which are in laymen terms: 1rovide a notice stating the creditor has failed to provide verification of the debt and that the matter has been closed or 2: that they believe this debt is valid and are providing proof of my responsibility.

Also instructed them not to try and contact me by any other means beside mail.

 

[Cyc]

Statute for my state is 15 years.

I went ahead and mailed a cease and desist letter.

The letter outlines that I do not think I owe what they say I owe and then goes on to outline their two choices of action. Which are in laymen terms: 1rovide a notice stating the creditor has failed to provide verification of the debt and that the matter has been closed or 2: that they believe this debt is valid and are providing proof of my responsibility.

Also instructed them not to try and contact me by any other means beside mail.

Awesome. Let us know what happens.

 

[CloudyHazeD]

Haha...

They mailed me a letter back.

Their letter is only one sentence long. Simply says " Please call us so we can discuss how to best remedy this matter."

Ummm. No.

They are getting one last letter back from me simply reiterating the two options that they are afforded via current laws.

Get me proof or fuck off :D

 

[toa$t]

i find it amazing that no one seems to care that you essentially stole this computer. maybe you should just pay them what you legitimately owe them...

 

[Johnny1]

i find it amazing that no one seems to care that you essentially stole this computer. maybe you should just pay them what you legitimately owe them...

No one's mentioning it because it's irrelevant to this discussion. Legal Discussion prohibits judgmental posts in part because this discourages members from seeking help with their legal problems as they exist in the present. What's done is done. There's a great business mantra that's applicable here: "Ignore sunk costs." I.e., Deal with your situation as it stands, looking forward. That's what the OP is trying to do.

Also, there are many businesses, including large national chains, that extend instant financing, but with agreements that carry questionably-harsh penalty provisions for late payments. Sometimes a $1000 computer suddenly costs $2500 if the purchaser misses a single payment. We don't know the details of his contract, so it would be hard to pass moral judgment on it even if it were allowed here. Furthermore, we don't know whether the collection agencies' fees are legal themselves. So even though he may have agreed to pay for the computer, he may or may not have knowingly agreed to a very punitive missed-payment provision (which is a big profit center for the retailer) if such a provision was in his contract, and he might be being asked to pay unlawful collection company fees. But like I said, this issue is irrelevant to this forum and should be discussed elsewhere.

 

[purplefirefly]

i find it amazing that no one seems to care that you essentially stole this computer. maybe you should just pay them what you legitimately owe them...

I would like to direct you to this post, the bold is what is most important:

They have already tacked on $100 some dollars for the court filing fees.

The amount is around $1200.

Everything I read (even the FTC site) state that I have a right to dispute and by sending said 'cease and desist' dispute letter they must stop collection(civil suits included; ref; FTC.com) until they can provide some form of verification/proof from the original creditor that the debt is legit and outstanding.

If they could have done this it would have been included with my court summons.

So, I figure, why let them have this easy. I've more that paid for this computer twice over.

Also, the collection firm is from several states away from mine. If this actually goes to court I will make damn sure they have to send a legit representative from the original creditor (as according to state law IF/WHEN I cross examine the plaintiff....which is my federal right according to the constitution.) and chances are they are not going to spend more money flying someone in to make an appearance.

The burden of proof is on them.

Seeing as the only document mailed to me via certified mail (and thus provable) is the court summons they will have a hard time proving I even knew about the debt. (seeing as I NEVER answered any of their calls or any other agency calls or letters)

I guess if anything, I'm just buying time to save up the money. But this debt is so old and so convoluted.....they are going to have a hard time proving it valid.

 

[toa$t]

yeah, I saw that post. unfortunately, in the non-imaginary world people have to pay the price upon which they agree, not the price which they happen to think is fair. there is no difference between interest and any other good. in this case, the OP happened to make a poor choice.

johnny1: I see that now. will withhold judgment from now on

 

[Johnny1]

johnny1: I see that now. will withhold judgment from now on

Thanks -- as long as you don't withhold your participation.