Opioids Any hydrocodone tips?

[DeathIndustrial88]

Strangely, I searched but could not find much at all on here. Weird.

Does anyone know of any ways, over the counter, to extend the duration of hydrocodone or make it stronger?
I'm not talking about shit like "benadryl" or anything like that. Anything to inhibit any liver enzymes or anything?

I've had the pleasure to enjoy a few 10's currently. I've been on subs for about 5 years. Weirdly, I can feel 10-20mg of hydro over my subs. They actually feel similar, except I find buprenorphine is more "heavy & sedating", where as the hydro is more energizing and clear headed. But the issue is that within 4-6hrs (some times less) of taking hydro, I will start yawning and eyes will start watering (first signs of withdrawals coming on) and I end up having to take some subs anyways.

Am I shit out of luck or is there anything I can do to enjoy these longer?

Also I take gabapentin, but read it can hinder hydro's BA. So should it be skipped before & during the effects? Would taking a gabapentin a few hours in reduce the experience?

 

[Nurse Ratched]

I'm surprised and happy for you that you can even feel the hydro after being on sub maintainence for 5 years. That's a plus for ya. I have always heard that small dosage of gabs ( spaced an hour apart ) can actualy make the hydro feel a bit more euphoric. as opposed to hindering it. But that's just from the threads I read on here.

Not sure you can extend it's duration though. Once we metabolize and peak ( even if we potentiated with gabs ) it only lasts so long before we metabolize it and the effects diminish. I could only get 4 hours max out of the 30 and 40 mg. doses I used to take when I used no matter what I did. Just be thankful you can feel 20 mg.doses I guess. I know others that can't feel opies when they are on subs ( even in high doses ). Even though subs are partial and hydro's are full ( agonists ) I often wondered why the fulls weren't more effective ( like why didn't they override the partial ).

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

I'm surprised and happy for you that you can even feel the hydro after being on sub maintainence for 5 years. That's a plus for ya. I have always heard that small dosage of gabs ( spaced an hour apart ) can actualy make the hydro feel a bit more euphoric. as opposed to hindering it. But that's just from the threads I read on here.

Not sure you can extend it's duration though. Once we metabolize and peak ( even if we potentiated with gabs ) it only lasts so long before we metabolize it and the effects diminish. I could only get 4 hours max out of the 30 and 40 mg. doses I used to take when I used no matter what I did. Just be thankful you can feel 20 mg.doses I guess. I know others that can't feel opies when they are on subs ( even in high doses ). Even though subs are partial and hydro's are full ( agonists ) I often wondered why the fulls weren't more effective ( like why didn't they override the partial ).

Thank you!

Yes, I've been struggling with a major depressive episode for about a year now. To the point where I ache/hurt physically and emotionally every day, almost constantly.
Opioids always use to alleviate this for me (including suboxone to a degree, just never as good as a full agonist).

I've found that subs are actually very sedating, but not in a good way. More like lethargy-inducing. And I've been on them so long that they no longer give me any pain or depression relief. Some times I wonder if they're making it worse actually.

Where as the hydrocodone actually gave me wonderful relief from my depression, first time in over a year that any pill I've taken has done so. I couldn't believe it. No more body pain, no more wanting to burst out into tears every other hour. And even a tad more energy/motivation. It's strange that a partial agonist causes me more sedation than even the full agonists do. I do get sedation from full agonists too, but I always found it much easier to handle and always knew it would wear off eventually. I didn't get any euphoria or nodding, but I felt more "normal" on the hydro, than I do on bupe. If that makes sense. And feeling normal, made me feel joyful and I'll take that.

So it was wonderful to finally feel free from the grasp of my depression for a bit.
Unfortunately it's just too short acting & within 4 hours, I start the yawning/lacrimation and end up having to take my subs anyway.

That's unfortunate that it can't be extended, but you are right. I am grateful for even just 4 hours if it means feeling like I'm alive again. Amazing that 10-20mg of hydro is doing more for my depression right now than ANY dose of buprenorphine.

I appreciate the kind response Pumpkin! Thank you so much & Merry Christmas to you and yours! Cheers to a good one!

EDIT : Made a ton of spelling errors. Holy shit. My apologies!

 

[Snafu in the Void]

Does anyone know of any ways, over the counter, to extend the duration of hydrocodone or make it stronger?
I'm not talking about shit like "benadryl" or anything like that. Anything to inhibit any liver enzymes or anything?

to my knowledge hydrocodone is metabolized by both cyp2d6 and 3a4.

you can inhibit 3a4 with fresh squeezed white grapefruit juice which will slow down it's metabolism into norhydrocodone.

how much this will actually help I am not sure, I've only looked at potentiating oxycontin/oxymorphone and other opioids

this doesn't potentiate it as much as it just increases the duration and peak plasma levels a bit

drink the juice at least 4hours prior to dosing, and even preferably, drink it a few times a day for a few days before the dose you plan on, takes a bit to build up in the body

and double check you aren't already taking a medication which hits your enzymes, various medications such as certain antibiotics will do the same thing and can lead to an OD, please be careful, you can cause a fatal overdose by messing with your liver enzymes on a dose that would normally not hurt you, people die of codeine doing this method.

P.S. it must be FRESH SQUEEZED grapefruit. No premade juice!!

 

[Nurse Ratched]

Hydros were my favorite depression and anxiety med. I self medicated with them for almost 30 years.

The subs MAY be causing the worsening fatigue and depression. Sometimes the meds we take to get us well and stable start doing the opposite if we are on them too long.

And a very Merry Christmas to you as well and it was my pleasure to reply to your post.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

to my knowledge hydrocodone is metabolized by both cyp2d6 and 3a4.

you can inhibit 3a4 with fresh squeezed white grapefruit juice which will slow down it's metabolism into norhydrocodone.

how much this will actually help I am not sure, I've only looked at potentiating oxycontin/oxymorphone and other opioids

this doesn't potentiate it as much as it just increases the duration and peak plasma levels a bit

drink the juice at least 4hours prior to dosing, and even preferably, drink it a few times a day for a few days before the dose you plan on, takes a bit to build up in the body

and double check you aren't already taking a medication which hits your enzymes, various medications such as certain antibiotics will do the same thing and can lead to an OD, please be careful, you can cause a fatal overdose by messing with your liver enzymes on a dose that would normally not hurt you, people die of codeine doing this method.

P.S. it must be FRESH SQUEEZED grapefruit. No premade juice!!

I can't remember off hand but does tagamet affect the same enzymes as the grapefruit juice?

I did take 200mg of cimitedine yesterday before taking 20mg of hydrocodone. I can't say for sure if it did anything though. Honestly, I wanna say, I felt it less yesterday when I took the tagamet & more so today having not taken any cimitedine.

But I also took two 300mg gabapentin yesterday but they were about 8 hours before I took the hydro and then one after the effects had warn off.


I appreciate your concern friend. You are right that the overdose risk exists. I've used grapefruit juice and tagamet to potentiate in the past and I use to do heroin & various other opioids. I was also smart and tried to learn as much as I could about drugs & stuff when I was younger so that I could avoid ODing and in my 12-13 years of opioid use, I've never once overdosed, thankfully. (Thanks to Bluelight!!!) I learned a lot that I would have otherwise not known about drugs when I was in my 20s, thanks to this site

And I actually also took clonazepam with it yesterday. But I have a tolerance to clonazepam. And gabapentin. And Suboxone gives you a slightly already raised baseline tolerance. So I should be alright.

When I checked though for hydrocodone potentiation on here, I was surprised at the lack of results though. Same with "hydrocodone & gabapentin". Almost no hits on google.

 

[Snafu in the Void]

Hydros were my favorite depression and anxiety med.

one of my favorites, too, actually

I actually kinda like it more than oxy

I can't remember off hand but does tagamet affect the same enzymes as the grapefruit juice?

I did take 200mg of cimitedine yesterday before taking 20mg of hydrocodone. I can't say for sure if it did anything though. Honestly, I wanna say, I felt it less yesterday when I took the tagamet & more so today having not taken any cimitedine.

Cimetidine is a potent inhibitor of certain cytochrome P450 (CYP) enzymes, including CYP1A2, CYP2C9, CYP2C19, CYP2D6, CYP2E1, and CYP3A4. The drug appears to primarily inhibit CYP1A2, CYP2D6, and CYP3A4, of which it is described as a moderate inhibitor.

wow yeah I guess it does, I've never used it or looked into it tho

Honestly, I wanna say, I felt it less yesterday when I took the tagamet & more so today having not taken any cimitedine.

I've never had any stellar results from potentiating opioids via inhibition.

From what I've read, even if you do it correctly, it's really only like a 10-20% gain in duration, which probably is hard to even notice sometimes, especially in lower doses.

I appreciate your concern friend. You are right that the overdose risk exists.

I'm sure you'll be fine. I can just recall several accidental ODs. Like one guy who was taking about 1000mg of codeine per day, was addicted and had high tolerance, but then he took some antibiotics which inhibited cyp3a4 and he died from his usual dose (inhibiting codeine turns more of it into morphine so he ended up getting like 600mg morphine) - stuff like that.

merry christmas man, have a nod for me

 

[Nurse Ratched]

I preferred oxy but those pesky friends of mine were stingy with them but always had the hydros. I remember my first 10 mg. hydro ( late 80's ). I knew I was screwed. It slowly went up to 20, then 30 and finally 40 mgs to achieve the high I wanted. It's still the only pill I can still crave and have drug dreams about. I only really liked the oxy more as there was no acetiminophen in the 30 mg blues. Thank goodness I have no liver damage ( miracle really ) as I swallowed a boatload of tylenol with the hydros I took. Exceeded the 4000 mg daily allowance pretty often. I really did luck out ( physically ) from my abuse. My brain is another matter. I think I am still healing.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

one of my favorites, too, actually

I actually kinda like it more than oxy


Cimetidine is a potent inhibitor of certain cytochrome P450 (CYP) enzymes, including CYP1A2, CYP2C9, CYP2C19, CYP2D6, CYP2E1, and CYP3A4. The drug appears to primarily inhibit CYP1A2, CYP2D6, and CYP3A4, of which it is described as a moderate inhibitor.

wow yeah I guess it does, I've never used it or looked into it tho


I've never had any stellar results from potentiating opioids via inhibition.

From what I've read, even if you do it correctly, it's really only like a 10-20% gain in duration, which probably is hard to even notice sometimes, especially in lower doses.


I'm sure you'll be fine. I can just recall several accidental ODs. Like one guy who was taking about 1000mg of codeine per day, was addicted and had high tolerance, but then he took some antibiotics which inhibited cyp3a4 and he died from his usual dose (inhibiting codeine turns more of it into morphine so he ended up getting like 600mg morphine) - stuff like that.

merry christmas man, have a nod for me

Merry Christmas to you and yours Negentropic!

I wonder if not taking the tagamet helps more of it metabolize into hydromorphone? I've read it only actually metabolizes a little into hydromorphone either way though anyway.


Strangely, before my heroin & bupe days, I use to prefer tramadol over hydro/oxy in the 300-400mg range (stacked every 15 mins). It was longer lasting (stuck with me atleast 8-12hrs) and was just as, if not more, stimulating, while also inducing heroin-esque nods about 3hrs into the experience. It was almost like a light MDMA experience combined with some moderate opioid activity. I was able to keep that magic going with trams for damn near 10 years (with withdrawals in between binges of course), but after doing heroin & buprenorphine for a few years, even with low tolerance, tramadol has just never been the same since.

I use to pop my tramadol and put my headphones on and then go for 5 hour walks around town just totally engulfed in the music and not feeling an ache or pain in my body. Wish buprenorphine was like that. lol There's no way I could do that now (and enjoy it) on bupe. I use to get decent euphoria, self confidence, empathy, itching, nods (but ones that I could snap out of easily if I wanted to). Tramadol was the perfect medicine for me back then. Heroin also gave me energy and empathy and self confidence. Bupe however, blows in those departments.

I've tried Effexor twice, which is structurally related to tramadol, but they feel nothing alike though.

 

[acman]

Merry Christmas to you and yours Negentropic!

I wonder if not taking the tagamet helps more of it metabolize into hydromorphone? I've read it only actually metabolizes a little into hydromorphone either way though anyway.


Strangely, before my heroin & bupe days, I use to prefer tramadol over hydro/oxy in the 300-400mg range (stacked every 15 mins). It was longer lasting (stuck with me atleast 8-12hrs) and was just as, if not more, stimulating, while also inducing heroin-esque nods about 3hrs into the experience. It was almost like a light MDMA experience combined with some moderate opioid activity. I was able to keep that magic going with trams for damn near 10 years (with withdrawals in between binges of course), but after doing heroin & buprenorphine for a few years, even with low tolerance, tramadol has just never been the same since.

I use to pop my tramadol and put my headphones on and then go for 5 hour walks around town just totally engulfed in the music and not feeling an ache or pain in my body. Wish buprenorphine was like that. lol There's no way I could do that now (and enjoy it) on bupe. I use to get decent euphoria, self confidence, empathy, itching, nods (but ones that I could snap out of easily if I wanted to). Tramadol was the perfect medicine for me back then. Heroin also gave me energy and empathy and self confidence. Bupe however, blows in those departments.

I've tried Effexor twice, which is structurally related to tramadol, but they feel nothing alike though.

I’ve been on Oxycodone for so long that I barely can feel it and eventually got myself in trouble with my tolerance shooting off the charts.
Looking for something to help after trying several things I went out and bought myself a carton of delicious Grapefruit Juice thinking… heck give it a try.
The difference was stunning ! Couldn’t and still can’t believe how much it increased the effects for me. That’s my experience , but am not sure if it would be the same with Hydrocodone..? It worth a try .
Best of luck my friend !

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

I’ve been on Oxycodone for so long that I barely can feel it and eventually got myself in trouble with my tolerance shooting off the charts.
Looking for something to help after trying several things I went out and bought myself a carton of delicious Grapefruit Juice thinking… heck give it a try.
The difference was stunning ! Couldn’t and still can’t believe how much it increased the effects for me. That’s my experience , but am not sure if it would be the same with Hydrocodone..? It worth a try .
Best of luck my friend !

I've had some luck in the past using tagamet (affects the same enzymes as grapefruit juice) in the past with various other opioids. Some times it worked, some times it didn't or actually felt like it dulled the effects. Maybe I can give it another try.

Thanks acman! Hope you had a great Christmas friend! Cheers!

 

[-FromonetOanotheR-]

I know this post is from last year lol (not in a old way), so sorry for the lateish repy. Anyways, you can try Tonic Water as another option to grapefruit juice.

Thats what I have done in the past (for Oxy, so it maybe a lil different for hydro), and has worked wonders. I used to drink 8-12 ounces 30-45 mins prior to dosing. It definately lengthened and pontentiated the original dose quite considerably, atleast for me it did. Tonic water contains Quinine which blocks CYP2D6 and induces CYP3A4. So the result is less Norhydrocone & Norhydromorphone and Increased amounts of Hydromorphone.

Tonic water is pretty cheap too if you get the store brand. Though I will warn you right off the bat that it does have bitter taste to it because of Quinine. Its not unbearable, though it may be an acquired taste for some over time. Also tonic water does have a bit sugar added to it, though not as bad soda pop, keep that in mind if you diabetes or blood sugar problem at hand. I WOULD NOT Suggest diet Tonic Water as substitute. It taste horrible and makes it that much unbearable to drink, so do even bother lol.

If your really into pontentiating with tonic water, and want to be more economical about it, you can always just buy Cinchona Bark powder which has quinine and dozens of others alkaloids related to quinine. Then put the powder into capsules with a capsule making machine (There is alot more to it than what I said, I just kept it short and simplified. One would atleast need a scale in the 1000ths of a milligram scale out doses when finding proper dose and so on). That way you can consume it without having to worry about ingesting ounces of fluid, and you will get health benifits from the tree bark with all alkoloids in it.

I would to like lay down a Stern DISCLAIMER with making your own capsules of quinine, unless your willing have dedication, patience, intune with yourself and how you feel, i would NOT Recommend this for most people because if calculated wrong you can OD and possibly DIE from it. But if done right its a game changer along with health benifits.

Hope That Helps OP

 

[vnessa]

I know it’s not the best option but when I snort Vicodin and then pop a couple it gets me the perfect high, hits hard and lasts if you just steadily increase the amount every hour or so. Also not eating for at least 5-10 hours prior.

I’m a noob here so I’m sorry if I’m not much help lol

 

[-FromonetOanotheR-]

I know it’s not the best option but when I snort Vicodin and then pop a couple it gets me the perfect high, hits hard and lasts if you just steadily increase the amount every hour or so. Also not eating for at least 5-10 hours prior.

I’m a noob here so I’m sorry if I’m not much help lol

Hello there, Welcome to Bluelight!

Please DONT snort Vicoden. The tylenol in it is very toxic and damaging to your nose and it clogs it as you probably have experienced. And not eating anything although seems like it helps the "high hit harder", eating a small fatty snack will help and improve the positive effects quite notably. Not eating a snack or meal for some people may actually increase stomach discomfort and side effects at the expense of Subjective Better high.

Im sorry if what im saying comes off strong, only trying to look for you and also clarify for others that may lurking and only readying on this forum.

 

[TheOriginalChair]

Hey Clonidine ( like .1 ) potentiates it but don't go crazy its a blood pressure med but off script for anxiety too or insomnia, also someone correct me if im wrong does Grapefruit potentiate the effects?

 

[vnessa]

Hello there, Welcome to Bluelight!

Please DONT snort Vicoden. The tylenol in it is very toxic and damaging to your nose and it clogs it as you probably have experienced. And not eating anything although seems like it helps the "high hit harder", eating a small fatty snack will help and improve the positive effects quite notably. Not eating a snack or meal for some people may actually increase stomach discomfort and side effects at the expense of Subjective Better high.

Im sorry if what im saying comes off strong, only trying to look for you and also clarify for others that may lurking and only readying on this forum.

Damn I didn’t know it was dangerous to snort Vicodin so thanks for clearing that up… I’m sorry I suggested that and will do more research

 

[-FromonetOanotheR-]

Hey Clonidine ( like .1 ) potentiates it but don't go crazy its a blood pressure med but off script for anxiety too or insomnia, also someone correct me if im wrong does Grapefruit potentiate the effects?

Grapefruit juice does potentiate it as stated earlier, more specifically the actual fruit. The juice version you buy at the grocery may not have the same effect. However Extreme caution should be taken as you can OD.

1/3 to 1/2 of your normal dose with grapefruit is good starting point.

 

[-FromonetOanotheR-]

Damn I didn’t know it was dangerous to snort Vicodin so thanks for clearing that up… I’m sorry I suggested that and will do more research

Its fine, no worries I've done worse things, due to own my ignorance lol. If you eat something fatty like pizza, French Fries, Donut 20-30mins before your dose, along with some benadryl as well, that will get you where you wanna be and make up for not snorting.

 

[vnessa]

Wow the one day we actually have grapefruit in the fridge I see this, just ate a bit so I’ll see how it works

 

[-FromonetOanotheR-]

Wow the one day we actually have grapefruit in the fridge I see this, just ate a bit so I’ll see how it works

Lol lucky you. Though I dont want rain on your parade, I believe you have to eat it quite few hours before the Vics. Some stated this earlier. May want to research a bit further to verify, to make full use of it.

Off topic, are you nocturnal? I would imagine its early morning if your in the states.