amphetamine effect on GABA and benzo tolerance

[g_dan1]

Hi everyone,

Disclaimer: I'm sorry if I misspell anything or sound illogical, I'm currently under the influence of xanax after a whole day of studying on adderall. I feel very slow and sleepy in a drunk way lol.



Anyway, I read a few posts and a scientific study that basically claim that amphetamines suppress GABA action in the brain, while releasing dopamine, norepinephrine, and some serotonin. All this results in its stimulating effect. The GABA suppression commonly results in anxiety while stimulated.

VERY INTERESTING Study about AMP effect on GABA: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4419710/

As far as I remember (im a bit slow rn... lol) the study also confirms that amphetamine abuse and high doses "impairs normal function of GABA in related regions." Does that mean that amphetamines have a negative long term effect on GABA and basically lead to long term anxiety problems? Does that apply to occasional use?

In contrast I read some other studies (can't find rn) and posts about Benzo's effect resulting in lower dopamine and serotonin.
This explain why both drugs takes together basically counteract each other and make you feel less of either effect. If any of you find this interesting and would like to answer my questions I would greatly appreciate it

1) Does the GABA suppression action of amphetamine affect benzo tolerance in any way? Would it stop or slow down the build up of benzo tolerance by basically having the opposite effect?

2) I also heard that nicotine has a similar effect on GABA, as well as the faster metabolism and elimination of benzos by inducing certain receptors. Would that also affect benzo tolerance in any way?

3) I take small-moderate doses of benzos as a tool (not recreational) 2-3 times a week with days in between. I also keep an organized journal of all my benzo doses to keep track and make sure I don't break any rules I set for myself. Usually I take moderate (rarely high) doses of amphetamines for studying and exams in between my benzo doses. I also vape nicotine juice every day and smoke cigs occasionally (only with kratom hehe). Would those 2 substances have any effect on benzo tolerance in regard to their suppression of GABA action? Would it reduce benzo tolerance in any way?

4) I know I made a few posts before... But I still wanna confirm to calm my constant paranoia lol. I'm taking low - moderate doses of benzos(1mg xanax average) 2 times a week (max 3) with days in between doses. Would that schedule let me enjoy benzos and not lose their 'magic' in long term? I am really scared of benzo dependence, gaining tolerance, and losing their pleasant relaxing and anxiety-killing effects. In summer I will take less, once a week max, to avoid tolerance even more.

5) UNRELATED QUESTION: Does Kratom affect GABA or dopamine in any way?

Thank you very much and sorry for the messy post

 

[Scrofula]

It's an interesting open review, I don't know why w ignored you.

Haven't finished, but I can say right away the review looks at "Amphetamine-Type Stimulants" that possess neurotoxicity. So not actual amphetamine. They're looking at the substituted ones like MDMA/MDA and meth.

Now from experience I can tell you that you will not experience GABAergic drugs like benzos and alcohol at the same level with these stims on board. Is that permanent? No. And it shouldn't effect development of benzo tolerance either (now from experience I can also say that gabapentin is doing something unusual when interacting with methamphetamine. So there is more going on).

Stims in general, including nicotine, and caffeine, will suppress the action of GABA and GABAergic drugs--to put it scientifically, you're fighting an upper with a downer.

The review so far is saying that chronic long-term use of these ATS's will cause long-term changes in GABA systems, but that's to be expected. I mean, if you were constantly wired on coffee, and tried to take a benzo to help you sleep, you'd expect to need more than a person who wasn't wired. If you were constantly taking club drugs, you have bigger worries than getting to sleep.

So for you personally, kudos for keeping the benzos under control. BUT as a former pack-a-day smoker and coffee drinker who ate whatever stims he could find, I needed a few drinks in the evening to even out. With the cigarette habit (nearly) gone, the feeling of "needing" a drink after a long day is mostly gone too. So you might really want to consider slowing down on the stimulants a bit, if you're worried about getting hooked on the legal drug. And yes, you will need higher doses of benzo to calm you to the level of a non-stimmed-out person; if you want to call that "tolerance" is up to you.

I think it's good to be scared of benzo dependence, almost as much as avoiding amph and nicotine dependence. I think Xanax is not a long half-life drug, so your schedule should be fine for that. I've never felt any "magic" in the damn things though, so I can't help you there.

I'd have to look up Kratom. But given the sheer number of posts and articles and hype around the stuff, I'd say the likelihood of affecting dopamine is very high. Probably hits the GABA pretty good, too, given a certain anxiety I sense around the forums. Never tried it, obv.

And consider if it isn't the amphetamines making you obsess a bit over the wrong drug. Potentially.