• N&PD Moderators: Skorpio | thegreenhand

  • Neuroscience & Pharmacology Discussion Welcome Guest
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules
    Recent Journal Articles Chemistry Mega-Thread
    FREE Chemistry Databases! Self-Education Guide

Affects of nicotine with MAOIs

N

Neuroprotection

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 18, 2015
Messages
1,083
How would nicotine affect those on an antidepressant such as phenylzine, Tranylcypromine or isocarboxazid. I'm particularly interested in how users of these antidepressants would be affected by nicotine patches or gum/ lozenges and even electronic cigarettes.
Also what about other MAOIs, four example harmaline, how would they interact with nicotine.
Does anyone have any experience with these combinations, you can include experiences of smoking tobacco whilst on this class of substances, but those where cannabis is not included will be particularly valuable as The impact of MAOIs on nicotine psycho activity can be easily identified and more clearly measured.
I would not advise anyone to go and try this combination without their doctors advice, but I imagine nicotine is far safer than amphetamine and related drugs as it causes relatively low dopamine, Norepinephrine, and serotonin release.
 
WSH said:
Because tobacco contains both harmalas and nicotine, this has been studied quite a bit:

Human monoamine oxidase is inhibited by tobacco smoke: beta-carboline alkaloids act as potent and reversible inhibitors

Monoamine Oxidase Inhibition Dramatically Increases the Motivation to Self-Administer Nicotine in Rats
Click to expand...

What about the combination of nicotine with strong irreversible inhibitors four example antidepressants phenylzine or selegyline, A selective MAOB inhibitor.
Do you think it could produce some type of exaggerated nicotine buz or even amphetamine like high/uforia
 
Neuroprotection said:
What about the combination of nicotine with strong irreversible inhibitors four example antidepressants phenylzine or selegyline, A selective MAOB inhibitor.
Do you think it could produce some type of exaggerated nicotine buz or even amphetamine like high/uforia
Click to expand...

They used tranylcypromine (unselective and irreversible) in this study and they found that the combo causes major serotonergic and noradrenergic effects (they didn't check dopamine, but it's likely the same with it).

Serotonin and noradrenaline release were both increased to ~8-15x (with dopamine most likely being similar).

But I don't think your theory about it being like amphetamine is right, the serotonin release of this combo will make it more similar to a balanced releaser (like MDMA or, even closer, MDA).

Inhibition of monoamine oxidases desensitizes 5-HT1A autoreceptors and allows nicotine to induce a neurochemical and behavioral sensitization
 
WSH said:
They used tranylcypromine (unselective and irreversible) in this study and they found that the combo causes major serotonergic and noradrenergic effects (they didn't check dopamine, but it's likely the same with it).

Serotonin and noradrenaline release were both increased to ~8-15x (with dopamine most likely being similar).

But I don't think your theory about it being like amphetamine is right, the serotonin release of this combo will make it more similar to a balanced releaser (like MDMA or, even closer, MDA).

Inhibition of monoamine oxidases desensitizes 5-HT1A autoreceptors and allows nicotine to induce a neurochemical and behavioral sensitization
Click to expand...

What do you imagine this would mean for me, A non-smoker, if I was to take an active dose of tranylcypromine daily until a significant proportion of MAOA and B had been inhibited, followed by intake of nicotine from a clean (tobacco free) source such as electronic cigarettes or patches. I have tried electronic cigarette and the nicotine inhaler cartridge, but never experienced tobacco in any form, yet I found the experience relatively enjoyable, and in some cases rather uforic. I can only imagine how adding tranylcypromine would enhance The pleasurable affects of nicotine
 
Neuroprotection said:
What do you imagine this would mean for me, A non-smoker, if I was to take an active dose of tranylcypromine daily until a significant proportion of MAOA and B had been inhibited, followed by intake of nicotine from a clean (tobacco free) source such as electronic cigarettes or patches. I have tried electronic cigarette and the nicotine inhaler cartridge, but never experienced tobacco in any form, yet I found the experience relatively enjoyable, and in some cases rather uforic. I can only imagine how adding tranylcypromine would enhance The pleasurable affects of nicotine
Click to expand...

You wouldn't even have to take the MAOI for days, the last study shows that it only takes 2 hours for the 5-HT1A autoreceptors to desensitize.

The problem is the translation of the doses from mice to humans, it could be anywhere from the equivalent of 1 cigarette to the equivalent of 10 cigarettes (depending on wether you use allometric scaling or not).
 
All I know about MAOIs is that EVERYTHING interacts with them and never in a good way...Stay careful! Why not an SSRI or an SNRI? Were those not working for you?
 
Nicotine without an MAOI is pretty much non-addictive in my experience with it. Nor is it in the same way satisfying as when coadministered with a reversible MAOI (tobacco or with beta-carbolines). Never tried it with a MAO-a suicide inhibitor, but then again the reason for choosing the beta-carbolines was precisely that they ARE reversible and there is less of a need for dietary caution and more forgiving, whilst not as specifically dangerous with many drugs as are the irreversible MAO(a)Is they are still potentially dangerous in large doses with certain drugs, although they are more forgiving than the irreversible kind.
 
bipolar-sunshine said:
How do you have access to MAOIs but not other anti depressants?
Click to expand...

Sorry it's my fault you're confused, I don't have access to any kind of antidepressant I don't have access to any kind of antidepressants including MAOIs.
The reason I am specifically interested in MAOIs is because they should theoretically amplify The psycho active affects of nicotine Rather than altering or adding to them as most other classes of antidepressants woulds
 
You do have access to some RIMAs. Harmala alkaloids, those beta-carbolines, harmaline, tetrahydroharmine, harmine are found in Banisteriopsis caapi vine, and harmine+harmaline although not tetrahydroharmine are found in the seed of syrian rue, else named esfand, Peganum harmala.

Coincidentally these alkaloids are present at low levels in tobacco, and without them, nicotine alone, is not all that reinforcing. I've had both pure nicotine, transdermally, bucally, vaporized and intranasally. As well as using an E-fag. Ever used one? the e-liquids that contain only nicotine as the active substance are just not even remotely as satisfying either alone or as an adjunct to opioids.

Injected nicotine sulfate does not substitute for smoking tobacco for example and its not even close to the same, nor is it anything like as good without the MAOI when taken by any route in combination with opiates. When I have a big shot of prope for instance, like now. If all I have by way of nicotine delivery is either my e-fag or some nicotine sulfate, its barely worth bothering with. Slightly but nothing special. And even using the e-fag I still crave, crave, crave a smoke with that shot.
 
I wonder what combining hordenine with nicotine would be like. Since hordenine is a reversible MAOB inhibitor and its legally available as a body building supplement.
 
Limpet_Chicken said:
You do have access to some RIMAs. Harmala alkaloids, those beta-carbolines, harmaline, tetrahydroharmine, harmine are found in Banisteriopsis caapi vine, and harmine+harmaline although not tetrahydroharmine are found in the seed of syrian rue, else named esfand, Peganum harmala.

Coincidentally these alkaloids are present at low levels in tobacco, and without them, nicotine alone, is not all that reinforcing. I've had both pure nicotine, transdermally, bucally, vaporized and intranasally. As well as using an E-fag. Ever used one? the e-liquids that contain only nicotine as the active substance are just not even remotely as satisfying either alone or as an adjunct to opioids.

Injected nicotine sulfate does not substitute for smoking tobacco for example and its not even close to the same, nor is it anything like as good without the MAOI when taken by any route in combination with opiates. When I have a big shot of prope for instance, like now. If all I have by way of nicotine delivery is either my e-fag or some nicotine sulfate, its barely worth bothering with. Slightly but nothing special. And even using the e-fag I still crave, crave, crave a smoke with that shot.
Click to expand...

Have you ever tried any of the natural MAOI alkaloids/plants you mentioned in combination with nicotine, either from e liquid/vapour or as natural tobacco.
Unfortunately I don't have access to any MAOIs, synthetic or natural, mainly due to where I live.
 
Yage vine, no, harmala extractions yes. Harmala seed in its raw state, couldn't bear the smell of it.

Tobacco, lol yes, I do use an E-fag but I also like smoking a few real cancer sticks during the day, especially morning and night. These herbal MAOIs are available 'online' (will say no more), yage (B.caapi) vine should, SHOULD be cleaner as there are bronchodilator alkaloids such as vasicine, vascicinone present in the syrian rue seed.

I just had a smoke, and then went to the e-fag and they are nothing like the same. Very noticeable. I've been contemplating making my own nicotine e-liquid by adding back extracted harmine, harmaline and THH in small quantities, to see if it once again substitutes properly for e-fag juice.


I've also tried syrian rue extract, rectally, both alone and (for some odd reason) in combination with (oral) diethyl ether)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top