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Harm Reduction ⫸Should I Try HEROIN?⫷

I feel like total shit I was doing really good went to detox I'm on suboxone I've been clean for a month and I used a few days ago just because it was around but I barely felt shit because of the subs. I figure that would deter me from wanting more but I still crave it now and I diddnt even crave it before :( now I got a bunch of oxy 15s and roxy 20s for free and I want to flush them so bad but the addict in me can't :( I'm just going to keep to my sub schedule and prey for strength fuckkkkkk
 
Bleachedleech said:
I just smoked a bag of H for the first time and felt absolutely no effect. I know the H was good quality because serious addicts have praised the quality up a good bit. The stuff going about is so good that the police have informed the dealers to weaken it due to a few too many overdoses. However I'm quite disappointed to say the least because I thought it was going to be good . I'm used to dihydrocodiene and take 300mg most days but surely that can't put my drug tolerance up that high that H don't work lol .
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You got sold bunk. Ripped off. Your are from Europe, right? Because then you'd have freebase heroin which is smokable, so the roa shouldn't be a problem.
 
Please understand that there are other victims to your choice to start heroin. This is my accounting of the last month of my 24 year old sons life after becoming a heroin user about a year ago.

Thank you all for your condolences at this most difficult time. The rumor mill has labeled this as a suicide. It most definitely was not. Carl had a successful, thriving, eBay business selling vintage toys, that he was actively involved in. He talked about the business and his plans a few hours before his death. Two nights before his death he helped me immensely to understand some patient issues about addiction with his hard earned experience. He was a wonderful son, that cared deeply about his parents, brother, friends and girlfriend till the end.
We learned about four weeks ago that he was a heroin user. We were as shocked and bewildered as any parents can possibly be. Within minutes of hearing this, we confronted him. In a lengthy, calm, rational discussion he confessed to the situation, but he led us to believe that he had never injected heroin and that he was weaning himself off of it with "suboxone" He told us he wanted our help. The result of that meeting was an agreement, that he must complete a detox program, and then enter a rehab program.
While at the detox program he made things difficult for his mother and me. At the end of the detox program everyone at the program was convinced that Carl was going to make it. They made us feel wonderful about our son, the progress he had made on his own, how Carl had helped other inpatients at the center, and that we had raised him right. We all felt so wonderful and optimistic at that point.
Then, in a lengthy, calm, rational discussion Carl made a case for NOT going to a rehab program. Based on Carl’s request and the information we received from the detox doctors, Sue and I eventually conceded. After he successfully completed the detox program he moved home with us, and we felt we could monitor his progress adequately. We all agreed that he would have to stay clean and sober during this two week trial period. At the end of the two weeks he would be drug tested. If he tested positive he would enter rehab immediately. If at any time after the two week period he tested positive for drugs he would immediately go to drug rehab, no discussion. Two weeks passed and he passed the drug test with flying colors. We congratulated him, and hugged him, and said many heartfelt thank you’s.
On Tuesday he was coming down with a bad respiratory infection and we took him to the doctors on Wednesday. We had agreed previously to respect his privacy on everything. He never told the treating doctor (not his regular primary care doctor) that he was a heroin user and they prescribed him a codeine (narcotic) cough syrup. On Thursday October 23, 2014 his mom found him dead. The ten day supply of cough syrup was ¾ gone. The medical examiner told us he found only three, fresh track marks in his arm and that is all. Codeine and heroin will kill you, the perfect storm.
The codeine in the cough syrup triggered the need for opiates. Most likely, the codeine bound up the euphoria receptors in his brain, but without the needed high. Apparently, he kept injecting, desperately needing the high. The heroin went to his breathing control receptors. His mother found him dead with the syringe in his hand.
Carl was an educated, smart, vital young man, who came from a family who loved him. He had his whole life ahead of him and will be sorely missed by his parents, brother, family, friends and everyone that knew him. We know he is in a better place. Carl will always be in our hearts.
 
I am so sorry John Messinger. I can't imagine the pain and anguish you and Sue must be going through.
 
John Messinger said:
The codeine in the cough syrup triggered the need for opiates. Most likely, the codeine bound up the euphoria receptors in his brain, but without the needed high. Apparently, he kept injecting, desperately needing the high. The heroin went to his breathing control receptors. His mother found him dead with the syringe in his hand.
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Heroin can easily knock codiene off the mu-opioid receptors in the brain, they would both be agonizing the cns and pns receptors. He just most likely underestimate how much his tolerance dropped, that's how the majority of users od.
 
Thank you, Bliss26. Please do not ever let your parents find you in the condition we found Carl. My beautiful son was reduced to something I can never forget. I will not violate his mom's wishes and post photos of him here, but in going back through the photos of him he reminds me a bit of Tom Brady, NE Patriots QB. Looking at old photos is something you will just do, if you ever find yourself in my situation.

We received a long letter from a good friend of Carl's the other night at a remembrance. One passage stands out: "I can remember... in Urban Outfitters this girl walked up to him and said "You are so tall!" She looked like she wanted to take him home right there. Xxxxx and I were like what the heck? Its THAT easy for Carl?! I saw that sort of thing happen to him at least 2 other times when we would go there...."

f33lg00d said:
Heroin can easily knock codiene off the mu-opioid receptors in the brain, they would both be agonizing the cns and pns receptors. He just most likely underestimate how much his tolerance dropped, that's how the majority of users od.
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Yes, I have pretty much come to that same conclusion in the week since I wrote that narrative. Nonetheless, I believe that he was totally blindsided by the codeine in the cough syrup, the label on the bottle did not say "Codeine" or "Cod" which I checked for as I handed it to the the investigating officer. By that, I mean he did not trust the treating physician enough to tell him he was a previous heroin user, HOWEVER, he did trust him enough to take the drug prescribed to him. I did not understand that situation until 46 hours later when my wife moved his car and brought in the prescription bags with the cautionary literature. 50 fucking hours too damn late.

Please do not ever let your parents find you like we found Carl. It will always hurt.
 
Carl knew if he told his treating doctor he was an opiate addict in recovery, his doc would not have given him a narcotic based prescription. He was right to think that, but in this case it would have saved Carls life.
It's very tricky , because if a person is an addict, and truthful with their doctor, the doctors have been known to leave patients in incredible agony they would never let their pet suffer through. Very difficult decision to make. In this case though, with a respiratory ailment that presumably wouldn't have caused too much suffering without narcotics, and so early in recovery, it's a shame that Carl decided to get the script filled.

I agree with pp, it sounds like an accidental OD caused by a lowering of tolerance that your son failed to account for when preparing his dose.

I am so sorry.
 
As many others have said:

No, you definitely shouldn't try heroin.

Unless you want to go through the absolute worst hell imaginable (actually worse that you can imagine), steal from and fuck over your loved ones in every way possible, completely fuck whatever you're trying to do with your life and likely end up dead.

Yeah I'm sure there are people that can do heroin more than a few times and not become a crazed addict, but those people are very rare-- the only one I've ever met was hooked on amphetamines so that was his main focus... So I guess he was a crazed addict, just not for dope.

But aside from him everyone else got addicted as fuck including myself. Quite a few are currently dead at the ripe old ages of anything from 20 to 30.

Basically just don't do it.
If you must do opiates stick with something relatively weak like codeine, or just do bupe.
 
NO

to anyone who asks should i try heroin? the both easiest, shortest, and most simple answer is NO!

people have no idea what they are getting into. dont ever mess with needles with any drug. let your doctor take care of that. it is so easy to catch a disease from a fellow junkie. hepatitas C is huge where i am because of needle junkies. most people actually get sick when they first do heroin because the dose is too strong. their fellow addicts tell them don't worry that is normal. the shit is straight up the devil. why do something so destructive to your body and risk having a highly illegal substance when you can just smoke a joint or get a bottle of booze.

one of the worst things about heroin is how dirty it is. everyone says the black tar is so good. realistically black tar is garbage. yeah it will get you high but it is loaded with cutting agents. pure heroin is white commonly called china white. it's like cocain, you're never going to get a clean pure product. it's always cut at least more than once somewhere. it's really stupid to be involved with such garbage when you can just find a known dr and get something much safer and cleaner like methadone or many other similar narcotics. personally i wont use any narcotic unless im in pain. and when i do that it's legally obtained quite easily. i have relatives hooked on pain meds. they get crabby when they don't have it. i can only imagine heroin junkies. not to be mean but from my experience heroin junkies are the worst of the worst. the only thing that makes hardcore alcoholism worse is they live longer. if all the thieving scum bag heroin junkies were to disappear one day i cant say i would miss them. think i'll stay being addicted to pot. at worse i just fall asleep or eat a lot of food.
 
Yeah it's never a good idea to try something so addictive that can change your life so much. It seems great the first couple of times but then it becomes all that matters nothing else in your life is as enjoyable or can compare to the feeling of being on heroin so you end up sacrificing everything to get it even if you do it once in a while and try to space out when you do it. And when you come down you get sick and just feel awful about everything. I would never suggest trying it but maybe a few can do it recreationally without getting addicted but I doubt this is common. I think people over exaggerate how bad it is physically for you (not including shooting up) since the most dangerous effect i think is addiction. my personal experience is probably limited though cause I never shot up. but I started by snorting a bag every once in a while after I couldn't afford painkillers. It was ok and everything but I ended up doing a couple bags every day for a few weeks that's as far as it escalated cause I got sent to rehab. It's not as bad as most people get but It became all I care about I did a lot of stupid and careless things that I would have never done to get that shit plus I wasted all my money while being charged 20-40 extra from a middle man who was supposedly my friend I found out when heroin is involved or any kind of addiction people get really selfish and won't hesitate for a second to fuck you over. When I was doing a lot of heroin I would hang out with my friend and her boyfriend. Seeing him showed me how bad it could really get from shooting a bundle a day for 10 years multiple other addictions including taking 20-30 mg of Xanax a day or he'd have a seizure, having a kid he never saw that lived with his parents, he would steal do anything to get it, for a couple months he was working and making around like 150 a day and his rent was 125 a week and he still was homeless cause he spent his money on drugs rather than rent he was staying in a really shitty and dangerous area was broke and couldn't keep any job he crashed at least 4 cars while nodding out at the wheel and almost had to have his leg amputated.If he was desperate enough he would have sold his house (if he had one) for two pills. This shit can fuck you up
 
John Messinger, my deepest sympathy for the loss of your son. It's every parent's worst nightmare, so sending much sympathy to you , and his mother.

I am still traumatized by finding a good friend "R" deceased back in July. She had been clean for years but the day of a party/BBQ, an old friend rolled into town, and she used for the first time in years. The combination of xanax to come down off of the heroin + low tolerance ended her life. When her father called stating that she didn't show up for her children, her cousin and I raced to her home, we found her dead. She OD several hours before we found her. The coroner was positive it was overdose and eight weeks later, it was confirmed via toxicology report.

Had I been at that party that day, I feel like I could have stopped her from using. Like your son, she was on a positive climb in life...in college for her BA, sober and taking care of her children, but one relapse cost her.

She was my close friend for 20 years, but I couldn't save her.
 
Not a single person has mentioned how benign a drug heroin actually is. The problems are caused by its prohibition and not directly from the drug itself. Do I need to go through the stupidity of the 'war on drugs', the almost uncanny resemblance to prohibition of alcohol in the 1920s in the USA (organised crime/violence, adulterated goods, unknown potency etc)? From a HR point of view, the prohibition of these drugs is an absolute disaster and responsible for almost every problem associated, not least the deaths, as in the case of John's son (RIP).
If it were not such an excellent analgesic then it would not be prescribed! I have tried it for breakthrough/rescue pain when using MR oxycodone, but oral bioavailability is too low and dosage required was FOUR 10mg tablets prn, max 12 daily. My friend mark, who has pancreatic cancer, certainly could never do without the vials of powder for reconstitution he gets, six boxes of five x 500mg vials IM monthly, the strongest Rx diamorphine on the market (Bayer HEROIN hydrochloride is no longer available in pharmacies here in the UK, only generics) and one of the reasons that survival rates from heart attacks are much better in countries which do not ban it outright is that in these places they tend to use morphine, a far weaker analgesic, as first line treatment for MI pain. Diamorphine apparently is the only commonly prescribed opiate which does NOT interfere with the electrical activity of the heart, so in the places where morphine is used, you could say that they were actually contributing to a higher mortality rate!
Using illicitly and often unhygienically (note recent illegal batches contaminated with anthrax, endemic to the Afghanistan/Pakistan region) made diamorphine, whether base or HCl salt, is a crap shoot, and the Casino bosses, the health authorities of those benighted countries where it is not used clinically, along with politicians who lie through their teeth about drug policies to garner votes from tabloid readers whilst knowing damned fine that they are talking through a certain orifice, are the bosses who allow the criminals to benefit from their ignorant policies, which àre CAUSING, not REDUCING harm from drugs.
Yes, of course you should try heroin if your pain levels are moderate to high. It has less side effects than any semi synthetic or synthetic I know of, and many trials have concluded that the risk of iatrogenic addiction when used as prescribed are nowhere near as high as oxycodone, hydromorphone, dipipanone and other drugs of similar potency. Fentanyl and its derivatives are probably the worst of the semi synthetics, certainly the most dangerous.
Diamorphine is one of the best analgesics on the market.
It is just a shame that certain countries do not see the obvious benefits of this superb medicine.
 
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^ sure it doesn't physically damage the body (excluding IV use) but it's just naive to call it benign
 
I think not. It does no known damage to any part of the body or brain. Unless of course it is not the pharmaceutical variety but the illicitly made stuff. Acetaminophen is a thousand times more dangerous and is responsible for more deaths than all opioids put together; I welcome the US decision to limit the amount in any dosage unit to 300mg, but to still permit supermarkets to sell huge tubs containing 500 tablets is just defeating the purpose. In the UK, max is 500mg but nobody may purchase any more than 16 tablets of any kind which contain it at any one time.
The IV damage is not normally caused by the drug but by the acid used to make heroin base into a water-soluble salt solution - the most common being heroin citrate.
 
zaborav said:
I think not. It does no known damage to any part of the body or brain. Unless of course it is not the pharmaceutical variety but the illicitly made stuff. Acetaminophen is a thousand times more dangerous and is responsible for more deaths than all opioids put together; I welcome the US decision to limit the amount in any dosage unit to 300mg, but to still permit supermarkets to sell huge tubs containing 500 tablets is just defeating the purpose. In the UK, max is 500mg but nobody may purchase any more than 16 tablets of any kind which contain it at any one time.
The IV damage is not normally caused by the drug but by the acid used to make heroin base into a water-soluble salt solution - the most common being heroin citrate.
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I am glad someone has at least brought up that heroin in itself in relatively benign. When not IV'ing the only physical problem that I have had that required emergency services was a fecal impaction. But that could have been prevented by more responsible use.
 
Ik it's not physically damaging, that's not the point. It's psychologically damaging, produce extreme addiction, depression, and dependence. Again it's naive to say apap is more dangerous, if you take a moderate dose of apap every day you'll be fine. If you try to take a moderate dose of heroin everyday, you'll constantly be raising your dose, run out of money, lose your job, and ruin your relationships with people that cared about you. Plus most people progress to IV use as othe routes become insubstainable with addiction and then it gets psychically damaging, and it's not just the acid; ik plenty of people that have fucked up there heart, got blood borne illnesses, needles stuck in veins, just shitty viens from heroin hcl. I've only had an abcess myself as a result of IV use, but people can lose limbs from this shit although much less common idk anyone personally that lost a limb.
 
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Should I try Heroin?

Definatly NOT!

I've been a heroin addict for 11 years and its completely destroyed my life and sevearly affected my relationship with my family. Believe me, this drug is in a league of its own.
I've done my time with all the other drugs, MDMA, Coke ect. and come out the other end with mostly good experiences and memories. But my time with Heroin has no good experiences, only bad, very bad.
You cant take Heroin recreationally, your either on it and take it every day(An addict), or you don't take it at all ever.
So my advice is to not try it, but I know there are plenty of people like me out there. What I mean by that is if there is a button that says 'Do Not Press' I gotta press it to see why. People like that, like me, are gonna try it no matter what because they have to satisfy their curiosity. If your one of these people, or your thinking about trying heroin please be very careful. Try and say to yourself that your trying it out of curiosity and its only going to be the once, rather than looking at it as a potential new pastime.
Heroin will only take you down one road, and at the end of that road is jail or death.

Have fun and be careful.

Collz
 
Well, I am a 20 year old, living a decent life, minding my studies. But I have always wanted to try the "H". Only once, of course, to experience it.

Is it safe or worth doing?
 
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