Harm Reduction ⫸Should I Try HEROIN?⫷

[subotai]

Ok im just going to leave my opinion on this and see if anyone else agrees rather than argue over nothing

It really depends on your personality type if you will get addicted to heroin IMO. I generally am not the most sociable person so I wound up really enjoying drugs that more or less required no other interaction with people to increase my enjoyment of them. Opiates are by far at the peak of that group, with weed and amphetamines being a bit below that. On the complete other hand, I never even came remotely close to abusing cocaine. Id do it every once and a while, but it just wasnt really a good fit for my ideal mindstate, although I did enjoy the fuck out of it.

And I know this is a murky and hearsay ridden subject but lets be honest, not all dope is created equal. Im not gonna say I always get 10/10 bags, and sometimes you get bags that barely do anything, but more often than not where im at, youre gonna get shit at least decent enough to make you OD if you arent careful. When you can just feel that pungent dope taste in your senses more than anything it might be cut with, its just like the lights on a drag racing strip in my mind like you put a dab on your tongue and its just the most rancid yet satisfying taste.

might take a little travel and waiting around to get to that point but odds are you dont really have much better to do if youre buying dope to begin with and the trip back is always WAY more enjoyable than the ride down so i kind of look at it as a one way trip really.

and all you really need is transportation, money, and a cell phone if you want to make it real easy. Thats all that seperates you from fiending for that high, to actually making it happen.

And once you make a routine out of it, its hard to not slip up because you know how easy it would be to go get it again. And we all have our reasons for using drugs but at least personally, I dont usually replace bad habits with good ones I just replace them with not as bad habits. But since theyre still bad habits, I just wind up saying fuck it, I might as well get the BADDEST habit because whats really changed here?

It is possible to use heroin recreationally you just cant let it become your only form of recreation. But odds are, if you are drawn to abusing opiates in general, you are ok with not actually doing much while the "recreation" takes place. You could get an eight ball of coke to yourself but if you dont do anything on it then whats the fucking point? You get high enough on heroin, and YOURE AT the fucking point. You could say, the batteries ARE INCLUDED.

quoted for posterity. Im really not (I am) trying to toot my own horn here

but fucking THIS

IMO

 

[ComfortablyNumb95]

does anyone on here have experience with chipping? and I'm not talking about taking it "just on the weekends" because that will most certainly get you addicted. i'm talking about every 3-4 months.
i know such a situtation can easily turn into "just once a month" and so on to addiction, but i have control of my drug usage (my friend often tell me this) and have been using opiates for 10 months without problems (albeit not the best ones, that give you more euphoria etc.).
i'd like to use H on special occasions or every 3-4-5 months, but i'm afraid of addiction.
and yes i've tried heroin.

so does anyone have experience with this? (both bad and good ones)

 

[lolwhatzdrugs]

does anyone on here have experience with chipping? and I'm not talking about taking it "just on the weekends" because that will most certainly get you addicted. i'm talking about every 3-4 months.
i know such a situtation can easily turn into "just once a month" and so on to addiction, but i have control of my drug usage (my friend often tell me this) and have been using opiates for 10 months without problems (albeit not the best ones, that give you more euphoria etc.).
i'd like to use H on special occasions or every 3-4-5 months, but i'm afraid of addiction.
and yes i've tried heroin.

so does anyone have experience with this? (both bad and good ones)

Yup. Most people here have experience with chipping, and most people here are addicts. If you think you have will power, and you're taking it every few months, then you don't need heroin, get yourself 10 10mg hydrocodones, and that should last you 3-5 months. If you buy say, a gram thinking it will last you a year or two, it will end up lasting you a month.

That's how this usually works, you might even have self control for a year or two, maybe a while longer or shorter. Then a major stressor hits your life out of no where (death in family or with friend, job loss, girl/boyfriend loss - there are a bunch of major stressors that you will be willing to fool yourself over) and then come the justifications.



One of my friends who is extremely addicted to heroin told me when I gave him 10 mg of oxycodone for the very first time: "Only losers with no self-control get addicted to this kind of stuff." Guess it takes one to know one for him
(Should have known, he didn't even really feel the 10 mg of oxycodone when opioid naive, after abusing hydrocodone for a little bit my first time with two 5 mg percocets had me fucking floored for 20 something hours)


Heroin is a long term (psuedo and lying )solution to what is almost always a short term problem, sometimes there's not even a problem. It's often a solution to a problem you never had. It started this way with me, I was getting high. I have a loving family, no depression or anxiety, a great childhood, a good brain, a future which would go as I commanded it, and I just liked the way it felt, lying in bed high with that fuzzy feeling and reading a good book by myself was THE SHIT. I was one major stressor away from being a good sized addict. The monkey that clings to your back feeds on you more than you feed on it, it licks your tears while stabbing you in the back. You hate to love it, and you love to hate it.

But I was fine, I had a happy life, no depression, hated drinking, don't really have an addictive personality (except with opioids, but this due to it's negative reinforcement mainly, if I could switch off the withdrawals as long as I never used it again recreationally to get off it for good, I believe I would be fine never abusing it again.

But I was safe. I knew I had control, I kicked cocaine after using it every day for three months without a second thought. I had this, no drug would conquer me, I would never slip up, fucking bulletproof.

And so it came to pass.....

 

[ComfortablyNumb95]

yes, i totally understand what you're saying.
painkillers aren't really available around here, so the opiates i can easily find are methadone, bupe and heroin.
next time i'll use it will be (maybe) in 3 months, i'll just try to use it as little as possible, like twice a year maybe... i too like you have no anxiety, depression etc. but what you said is the exact same tbing i thought: let's say i use once every 2-3 months and then something really bad happens, heroin is the best at temporarly hiding the pain so i'm scared i'd resort to heroin relieve the stress.. i usually don't do this with drugs, but heroin.. is another matter

 

[lolwhatzdrugs]

If you really are completely opioid naive, you might want to give buprenorphine a try.

When I had 0 tolerance I got high on 20 2mg buprenorphine pills (I mean nod out pass out on my keyboard fucked up high) for like 50 days straight with no perceptible increase in tolerance, and when it was done I experienced 0 withdrawal symptoms. Crazy month and a half; I wish I could take my poor mu receptors back to that point and get smashed on 200 micrograms of buprenorphine at a time.


Yeah, it is the #1 drug for hiding pain (though I started my dependency with pharmaceutical opioids) and the fucked up thing is while using it chronically your body migrates from emotional pain that you're covering up->emotional AND physical withdrawal pain, and if you're doing it straight with no breaks, by the time this happens you're just straight up fucked.

 

[nolys]

Has anybody mentioned that millions upon millions of people each year unknowingly take heroin in the form of diamorphine?
My girlfriend who just had our son 3 weeks ago used it in a 16 hour Labour and had 3 doses, she was fucking wasted. She never once again mentioned it, and she looked like she enjoyed it quite a bit.
I know recreational vs medical is a factor here but I know many people whohave taken it and never mentioned it again.
Heroin is available in some parts of my city, I know maybe 5 people who have tried it, not a single person has taken it more than twice. In saying that, none of them IV which may be a factor.

I would and certainly will try heroin if the opportunity arises, if it's street gear I will smoke or insufilate, if diamorphine I will IM and the only reason for this is because I have tried everything else at least once bar heroin and Crystal, checking things off the list is something I enjoy doing and experiancing. I am intrigued how certain chemicals can cause different effects in the human brain.
I don't smoke, drink, take any drugs (unless a new one crosses my path) apart from very rarely some cocaine on my birthday or new years, or maybe a codeine cwe if my gf who is always sick has bought some and not finished a box maybe twice a year.

I would also sniff glue once if the opportunity arose, but that's just me...

 

[Orlando O. Ortega]

If you do "try" heroin wait until you're middle-age and middle-class with more to lose, it will temper the frequency of usage. Maybe.
If you buy it in the states the quality will be piss poor most of the time. Yet the impulse to use will frequently be on your mind.

"They can get it out of your bloodstream but not your [brain]." --Charlie Parker (after Forrest Whitaker in the film 'Bird')

 

[ComfortablyNumb95]

If you really are completely opioid naive, you might want to give buprenorphine a try.

When I had 0 tolerance I got high on 20 2mg buprenorphine pills (I mean nod out pass out on my keyboard fucked up high) for like 50 days straight with no perceptible increase in tolerance, and when it was done I experienced 0 withdrawal symptoms. Crazy month and a half; I wish I could take my poor mu receptors back to that point and get smashed on 200 micrograms of buprenorphine at a time.


Yeah, it is the #1 drug for hiding pain (though I started my dependency with pharmaceutical opioids) and the fucked up thing is while using it chronically your body migrates from emotional pain that you're covering up->emotional AND physical withdrawal pain, and if you're doing it straight with no breaks, by the time this happens you're just straight up fucked.

no, i'm not opiate naive, i've been using them for 10 months. and actually i'm on bupe right now :D
i guess i'll resort to bupe or methadone if i want an opiate high (can find them very easily and are super cheap).. or i'll buy some Kratom maybe, that's an option
i wanted to try heroin once more because the few times i smoked it wasn't a lot.. i was high but not as high as i would have liked. but maybe i'm better off like this.

 

[lolwhatzdrugs]

Has anybody mentioned that millions upon millions of people each year unknowingly take heroin in the form of diamorphine?
My girlfriend who just had our son 3 weeks ago used it in a 16 hour Labour and had 3 doses, she was fucking wasted. She never once again mentioned it, and she looked like she enjoyed it quite a bit.
I know recreational vs medical is a factor here but I know many people whohave taken it and never mentioned it again.
Heroin is available in some parts of my city, I know maybe 5 people who have tried it, not a single person has taken it more than twice. In saying that, none of them IV which may be a factor.

I would and certainly will try heroin if the opportunity arises, if it's street gear I will smoke or insufilate, if diamorphine I will IM and the only reason for this is because I have tried everything else at least once bar heroin and Crystal, checking things off the list is something I enjoy doing and experiancing. I am intrigued how certain chemicals can cause different effects in the human brain.
I don't smoke, drink, take any drugs (unless a new one crosses my path) apart from very rarely some cocaine on my birthday or new years, or maybe a codeine cwe if my gf who is always sick has bought some and not finished a box maybe twice a year.

I would also sniff glue once if the opportunity arose, but that's just me...

If you do "try" heroin wait until you're middle-age and middle-class with more to lose, it will temper the frequency of usage. Maybe.
If you buy it in the states the quality will be piss poor most of the time. Yet the impulse to use will frequently be on your mind.

"They can get it out of your bloodstream but not your [brain]." --Charlie Parker (after Forrest Whitaker in the film 'Bird')

no, i'm not opiate naive, i've been using them for 10 months. and actually i'm on bupe right now :D
i guess i'll resort to bupe or methadone if i want an opiate high (can find them very easily and are super cheap).. or i'll buy some Kratom maybe, that's an option
i wanted to try heroin once more because the few times i smoked it wasn't a lot.. i was high but not as high as i would have liked. but maybe i'm better off like this.

You're on bupe for maintenance? What dosage? What opioid were you using for 10 months before it? What dosage/type of H did you take, and what ROA?

If you've been dependant for that long, kratom is probably only an option for helping you taper off of opioids or helping to ease withdrawal symptoms from tapering or cold turkey. You didn't mention your tolerance, I guess it's possible you're only taking 50-200ug of buprenorphine; in that case you might feel kratom, but you probably aren't taking that dosage. I'm not the greatest source regarding kratom as I've only done it a few times when I had lowered my tolerance, and it was only a little pleasant, with crummy side effects that greatly outweighed any fun, and the third or fourth time I took it I felt like I was dying, worst stomach cramps I've ever felt (was parachuting finely ground powder) - ugh, I was curled up into a ball, literally, in bed begging for the vomit response to come and clear everything out - and it never fucking came. I think I just passed out while in pain.

Methadone I personally always found fun when I could still get the pills, but only when taken for short periods of time. I had a limited supply of pills (80-90) so I never took it more than 10-11 days, give or take a few in either direction once a month. If you take it constantly (unless you're constantly bumping up the dosage - a super horrible idea) the high that is there will go away. Many people say there is no high, there is - it's just not comparable to heroin or morphine in the euphoria/nod department. That's why people try and mix it with benzos, a good amount end up dying. I never did that, I knew I'd black out and end up chasing a high I wouldn't even remember and probably end up dead or int he hospital*shudder*

 

[ComfortablyNumb95]

eheh no.fortunately i'm not addicted, i take bupe and methadone "recreationally" every once in a while (i meant i was high on bupe :D) because here in italy painkillers are virtually non-existent on the streets and i can find them very easily and cheap. i usually snort 1-1.5 mg of bupe to get a nice high for like 10 hours and i'll be relaxed the whole day after (i know nothing conparable to heroin, but it's waaay cheaper, lasts longer and is less mentally addicting imho).
i smoked heroin 3 times, the first time i should've smoked it all at once but i was being careful and i just smoked enough to get me very relaxed but not really high.
the second time i was offered it so of course i didn't smoke a lot.
the third time i shared a 0.6-7 (i guess) of brown with other 3 people.so i got high but not that much.

maybe i'll try again on my bday but i really got to take a pause from opiates because i've been using them every week for the last 5 or 6 weeks and it's def not good.

i ready mixed reviews about kratom, i have to try it to find out. fortunately i usually suffer less side effects than my friend (like last week my friend puked 6-7 times and i just puked once)

cheers mate

 

[lolwhatzdrugs]

eheh no.fortunately i'm not addicted, i take bupe and methadone "recreationally" every once in a while (i meant i was high on bupe :D) because here in italy painkillers are virtually non-existent on the streets and i can find them very easily and cheap. i usually snort 1-1.5 mg of bupe to get a nice high for like 10 hours and i'll be relaxed the whole day after (i know nothing conparable to heroin, but it's waaay cheaper, lasts longer and is less mentally addicting imho).

I dunno, I'm just a little bit odd in what I enjoy, and I thought that buprenorphine (even with it's half agonist ass) was pretty fucking euphoric. I know it still doesn't have that 'peak' combo of relaxation of euphoria like heroin, but I thought it was pretty comparable. It's method of action seemed to let me take pretty high doses when I was almost completely opioid naive, and like I said earlier I would nod off really fucking heard, probably nodded the most and hardest of any opioid I've ever taken. For me to nod off like that on oxycodone I would have a had to be up for 30 something hours

i smoked heroin 3 times, the first time i should've smoked it all at once but i was being careful and i just smoked enough to get me very relaxed but not really high.
the second time i was offered it so of course i didn't smoke a lot.
the third time i shared a 0.6-7 (i guess) of brown with other 3 people.so i got high but not that much.

maybe i'll try again on my bday but i really got to take a pause from opiates because i've been using them every week for the last 5 or 6 weeks and it's def not good.

Just be careful, the adventure can turn from a joy ride, to a roller coaster, to pain and pleasure mixed in a fucked up and wretched way. The buprenorphine is probably a good bit more forgiving than the methadone when it comes to taking it for an extended duration due the partial Vs. full agonism. I wouldn't smoke your dope if you must do it. You always waste some whether due to the heat, or you miss some trying to suck it up. I would vote for plugging it, that's my ROA of choice, when I did it anyway.

i ready mixed reviews about kratom, i have to try it to find out. fortunately i usually suffer less side effects than my friend (like last week my friend puked 6-7 times and i just puked once)

cheers

How much you like it probably has to do with what other opioids you have tried and which ones you have liked, how much you appreciate stimulant like opioids VS. nodding out, and whether you like that smack you in the face high feeling, or the subtle nuances. I generally like both kinds at their own time, but still didn't much care for kratom.

 

[ComfortablyNumb95]

I dunno, I'm just a little bit odd in what I enjoy, and I thought that buprenorphine (even with it's half agonist ass) was pretty fucking euphoric. I know it still doesn't have that 'peak' combo of relaxation of euphoria like heroin, but I thought it was pretty comparable. It's method of action seemed to let me take pretty high doses when I was almost completely opioid naive, and like I said earlier I would nod off really fucking heard, probably nodded the most and hardest of any opioid I've ever taken. For me to nod off like that on oxycodone I would have a had to be up for 30 something hours

Oh yeah don't get me wrong, I love bupe because it's cheap, lasts quite long and I like the high a lot. it's just not overly euphoric but very very relaxing. and listening to music with your eyes closed is just, beautiful.

Just be careful, the adventure can turn from a joy ride, to a roller coaster, to pain and pleasure mixed in a fucked up and wretched way. The buprenorphine is probably a good bit more forgiving than the methadone when it comes to taking it for an extended duration due the partial Vs. full agonism. I wouldn't smoke your dope if you must do it. You always waste some whether due to the heat, or you miss some trying to suck it up. I would vote for plugging it, that's my ROA of choice, when I did it anyway.

yeah I'm trying not to take opiates too frequently. like twice a month at most (even if lately it's been everyweekend :/) have you ever plugged bupe and how does it compare to snorting?

How much you like it probably has to do with what other opioids you have tried and which ones you have liked, how much you appreciate stimulant like opioids VS. nodding out, and whether you like that smack you in the face high feeling, or the subtle nuances. I generally like both kinds at their own time, but still didn't much care for kratom.

yeah I too like both, it depends on the situation. if I'm hanging out I prefer a bit of a stimulant efect but if I'm slumped on the couch of course i want to nod. I like bupe because at the right dose it allows you to do both IME

 

[JackiePeyton]

Chipping is dancing with the devil. Pull out now. Either go all the way- full on addiction and learn hell or get smart-IMO .

 

[Ignot]

Fuck this drug, A buddy of mine just received a Felony and is going to do jail time for sure. His 40k a year career/salary is GONE FOREVER.
His record is now FUCKED. and he is in a constant battle with this shit. He started with 5mg percocet, and a few months ago graduated to injecting Heroin.
FUCK THIS SHIT.

 

[sogno]

I don't know if you remember my previous post in this thread about my friend who wanted to try h. He was very convinced in doing it, he even bought it....
Just wanted to let you know my friend decided to not try it. He read almost the entire thread and decided to not doing it.

 

[muie]

Should I try heroin?

Speaking from plenty of experience in both use as well as having been around the scene for 10+ yrs I will tell anybody who asks this question, heroin is worth trying *STRICTLY* and only when someone knows they are terminally ill, don't have long to live, or are in constant agony not pain but extreme 10/10 unbearable screaming at the top of your lungs pain.

Every drug has its time and place and heroin is not for people who want to live, or use it as a recreational drug which is how many if not most users go down either OD or ruined for life addiction wise once you start on the needle there is no coming back, even smoking or snorting isn't something to play with.

While its true that heroin is no worse than strong pharmaceutical opiates like fentanyl from a pharmacological point of view (minus the cuts/impurities) that doesn't mean its as 'innocent' as the pharmaceuticals, the reason is that an addict using pharmaceutical opiates can only get a finite number since they are prescribed many addicts use their scripts and a bunch of other people's scripts but eventually they run out and aren't always available. With heroin, once you have a hook up there will never, ever be any such problems as running out or not having it available, in my experience the most I had to wait for my dope was 2-3hrs tops when the dealer/s were re-upping, as opposed to having to go 1-2 weeks without pharms!

Also heroin is not as 'forgiving' an opioid as the others like oxy/hydrocodone or morphine even. Although it is said heroin is basically morphine after the first 10-15min (when smoked or injected) I have done my fair share of morphine and in no way do I agree with the statement that morphine is like heroin after the first 15-20min. While its true that during the first 10min-15min after smoking or shooting the high is very stimulating & 'uppy' to the point you feel like you had some very pure/clean cocaine, but right after that it transforms into a very sedating, nodding out high. Even when it turns into the traditional, sedating, nodding out high its nowhere near as sedating as morphine nor as nauseating. It's like saying that codeine is the same as morphine since 10-15% of codeine is converted to morphine, so by that rationale 200mg codeine is equivalent to 20mg morphine, which I do not need to tell you is very misleading. Codeine has very different effects from morphine the same way heroin is different from morphine. I know many junkies that love dope and hydromorphone but dislike the morphine rush.

These qualities give heroin the euphoria and unique effects that grip so many people indifferent of class, culture, race or education, myself included! Although I've never used a needle even at the height of my addiction I was using *almost* a gram a day (nr.4 east coast dope) I would do .9 or 9 points and a half just so that I had a half point in the morning to smoke while I waited for more dope to come.

 

[ComfortablyNumb95]

@sogno: could you clear your inbox?
@muie: yes heroin is metabolized in the body into morphine, but there are other metabolites involved like 6-acetylmorphine (iirc, too lazy to look it up now), maybe that accounts for the different effect.

 

[Dirtycakes]

So here's my little 2 cents as of right now. 5 days ago my very sober husband found out about my heroin addiction. So I decided I was going to get "clean", now I was addicted to h at 15 and kicked it on my own with no withdrawals I figured shiiiiiit this won't be no thang but a chicken wang. I didn't really plan on quitting. But I entertained him with throwing out all of the things I used (I plug) little squeezey things, the cups, baggies etc. Any who, my relapse was pretty bad, for me anyways. At 21 I used for 8-9 months every single day a pretty sizable amount (don't need to say what we aren't in competition right? and omg was I SICK, I've never experienced what my two addicted brother in laws have shown to be dope sickness. Throwing up, the chills, leg pains, restless leg syndrome, no energy, nausea, migraines the whole shebang hit me like a freight train. 2 days later I relapsed and felt guilty so I was honest with my husband and told him. After setting myself back to day 1, 3 days ago. I feel like I've been fighting for my very soul. It's been hands down the most painful experience I've ever been through and now 3 days sober I did an honest sweep of the house. Gave him everything, showed him all my hiding spaces and due to absolutely no physical willpower to ever go through this again I'm actually pretty excited about getting clean. I'm starting to not feel like death, managed to shower and eat for the first time in 5 days even if it was just a few tablespoons of peanut butter. I just can't sleep @-@ it's driving me crazy I feel like my body goes into freaky terminator restore mode when I sleep and wake up feeling a little better then I did before. I can't sleep but I have no energy to be awake and function like a normal person yet :/ and I'm fighting dehydration. I mean I think I'm doing pretty decently. I never imagined how hard this would be. I have no energy to do chores or cook and I'm usually Martha freaking Stuart -.- without my hubby's care and understanding, zombie movies & sniper elite 3 I would have NOT been able to and would have not even considered quitting. But now I do and I am, so Troy, even though you'll never see this cheers to you, you've literally thrown me into the pits of hell and jumped in with me. Your a pretty cool guy I totes wouldn't mind spending the next 50 years married to you, you make my life a little brighter every day...and yeah that's it for now. P.s. Not to end this on an extremely weird note but do h withdrawals give you weird dreams? The first day I was having super vivid bizarre sex dreams (can anyone say highschool musical aged Zach Effron & the rock 3sums?) uh yeah me neither -.- now for the last two days I've been having these horrible lucid nightmares about not being able to escape Michael Myers and him stabbing my daughter in the heart and butchering my husband I BARELY can wake myself up quick enough before he starts walking towards me. T_T that and horrible surgery dreams that somehow also involve Michael Myers. It's making it harder and harder to get to sleep...^.~ that took longer to type on a phone then I thought but you guys get the gist of it. Sorry if it's a little tmi. But thanks to whoever reads! Ttyl ~ Renee

 

[phildobaggins]

Hey I wish u the best of luck renee my best friend Is coming off dope right now and I came off methadone myself a few months back and I'm telling u quiting Is the best thing u can do for yourself my friend is really struggling and trying to taper But i just went cold turkey off dones and it really was a relief once I'd gotten through it Just to have that monkey off my back, now I'm Actually gonna be going to school for addiction counseling I really wanna help people in these types of situations. The best Advice I can give u is eat light foods and try taking imodium if ur getting bowel trouble or cramps that or I like peptobismal that really helped me through methadone withdrawls and for fucks sake don't get on methadone It's worse than heroin I think, and the withdrawls last forever I was litterally moaning in pain at one point the cramps got so bad It's strait up unbearable I wouldn't wish that on my worse enemy, stay strong

 

[hrodricktaikos]

Heroin here in Brazil is a legend...Just coke mixed with baking soda and a horrible weed from paraguay
I want to try H, oor another opiate / opioid.
Yesterday I've tried Tramadol (150mg) but I didn´t feel anything different...