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What is wrong with the MDMA available today? - v2

Jmoda

Bluelighter
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Jun 11, 2020
Messages
154
ok so after searching the previous thread trying to gather and compile the sources which have led to the current focus of this discussion I have come up completely empty handed! I don't know if this some joke or a social experiment or what but this site has always been pretty reliable and when people take these claims at face value without looking into it they actually believe that there's such a thing as mehdma. Now dealers are using it to push gold or magic "old schoolMDMA" at ridiculous prices and using this as a sales tactic.... guess what? It's the same stuff (if not worse).
Thats the dealer game. My friends thought they had legit MAPS formula mdma at some point.

The only practical way to solve this debate is for le junk to throw a party with his source of mdma. Everyone can then see the light.

Or....if le junk can just ask his chemist how they make the product specifically, that may help too. The answers all seem to be with le junk
 

Ambien Powered Rabbit

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Jan 23, 2021
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Dream land
That first post has really set off a chain reaction. people can relate to mdma now seeming different than their first impressions. But that is true with most drugs. difference with MDMA is it can leave such an incredible first impression that it actually seems really uncommon for people to be able to reliably replicate that for any real length of time. The expectancy of perfection is understandably very difficult to live up to. Most people discontinue using MDMA after a short time and move on.
What is really bugging me about this isn't the experiences that myself and other people are having. it is that a reality of drug use is being disregarded and blamed on something completely fabricated.
 

Jmoda

Bluelighter
Joined
Jun 11, 2020
Messages
154
That first post has really set off a chain reaction. people can relate to mdma now seeming different than their first impressions. But that is true with most drugs. difference with MDMA is it can leave such an incredible first impression that it actually seems really uncommon for people to be able to reliably replicate that for any real length of time. The expectancy of perfection is understandably very difficult to live up to. Most people discontinue using MDMA after a short time and move on.
What is really bugging me about this isn't the experiences that myself and other people are having. it is that a reality of drug use is being disregarded and blamed on something completely fabricated.
The original poster still has access to "oldschool" product and still gets the same experience from it as opposed to the junk thats everywhere now.

It may disregard peoples experiences because the oldschool is touted as better...and maybe it should be more framed that therr are in fact different experiences to be had from the seemingly same compound.
 

Ambien Powered Rabbit

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The original poster still has access to "oldschool" product and still gets the same experience from it as opposed to the junk thats everywhere now.
That was 5 years ago and if it were true I doubt he would have started this thread tbh. anyone else claiming stashes of 80s mdma and talking about their friend, the skilled ecstasy chemist (who hasn't provided any insight to this in 5 years) would be disregarded... but people want to keep this going for some reason, so that post is gospel.
 
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Jmoda

Bluelighter
Joined
Jun 11, 2020
Messages
154
That was 5 years ago and if it were true I doubt he would have started this thread tbh. anyone else claiming stashes of 80s mdma and talking about their friend, the skilled ecstasy chemist (who hasn't provided any insight to this in 5 years) would be disregarded... but people want to keep this going for some reason, so that post is gospel.
Well. We have people who share a similar experience to the meh effects.

I and also many friends have also personally experienced first hand different batches of mdma that gives starkly contrasting effects. One where you get wall-blasted in the first two hours and have a steep drop off thereafter and another that gives a satisfactory true rolling waves of pleasure experience for 4+ hours.

For the longest time i questioned my own brain for driving the experience change over time, but after recent experiences i am firmly in the camp that there is in fact a difference.
 

Ambien Powered Rabbit

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After a few knockoff batches of yellow and blue crowns circulated (reagent tested as meth) the once popular Rolex brand name had earned a bad reputation. even a good quality batch of white rolex crowns containing mdma wasn't selling well. I watched someone begrudgingly buy one and then spend the night moping that it was nothing like the caps of pure mdma last week... the caps last week were just white rolex crowns that had got sat on and crushed in someone's back pocket at a music festival and the powder was put in capsules and sold. I passed that feedback onto our dealer. "just sell them like that". The next night, mopey and the bandits erupted through my front door, eyes rolling around like marbles in a washing machine. "bro...fucksake... you gotta try these caps bro!".
 

psy997

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Joined
Jul 9, 2012
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noitacoL
That first post has really set off a chain reaction. people can relate to mdma now seeming different than their first impressions. But that is true with most drugs. difference with MDMA is it can leave such an incredible first impression that it actually seems really uncommon for people to be able to reliably replicate that for any real length of time. The expectancy of perfection is understandably very difficult to live up to. Most people discontinue using MDMA after a short time and move on.
What is really bugging me about this isn't the experiences that myself and other people are having. it is that a reality of drug use is being disregarded and blamed on something completely fabricated.

Confirmation bias at work.

You don't know what you're talking about, obviously.
 

Ambien Powered Rabbit

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you said the same thing to a couple of chemists in the last thread when you could not understand what they were saying. maybe you should look at the real reasons why you hide under blankets when you take a drug that causes you to be honest with yourself.
 

TripSitterNZ

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as a chemist i don't take chemists word for granted due to the fact each chemist only has their area of expertise a physical chemist can not just start going on about high level organic chemistry. nor would you expect a organic chemist to go and calculate all the quantum energy levels of a chemical system on a computer.

I was one who was against the mehmdma but now i see its acutally true after covid and enchorchat busts all the good supply is quickly drying up and mdma that still tests postiive on kits does not produce said typical effects of heavy gurning eye rolling extreme love unity and connection with all things.

And i was the motherfucker who was getting good product up til this point trolling the shit out of these threads since 2019. But now i admit its true its just like how idiots who try make LSD never get it right and make a inferior less smooth product same applies to mdma.
 

TripSitterNZ

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All the MDMA i ever consumed in the last 5 years was tested before coming here by labs like EC. Upwards of 94% purity mostly 80%. Was getting really good pure white fluffy crystals super clean stuff recrystallized here and acetone washed 3 times once the suppliers had imported it.
 

psy997

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you said the same thing to a couple of chemists in the last thread when you could not understand what they were saying. maybe you should look at the real reasons why you hide under blankets when you take a drug that causes you to be honest with yourself.

Show me where that happened. Otherwise, I will continue to assume that you have arrogantly walked in here with a bone to pick, nothing more.
 

indigoaura

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Jan 4, 2009
Messages
1,569
@Ambien Powered Rabbit - At the risk of sounding rude, I would like to point a few things out...

You registered a few weeks ago.

You have fewer than 20 posts.

You are blowing up our thread.

This is a pattern we have seen before, where a new user arrives and posts A LOT and complains A LOT. To what end?

I have worked very hard to attempt to summarize the previous unwieldly thread into a few posts. There is a MLA formatted research summary complete with Works Cited that summarizes the research side of what we are talking about. You have not really addressed that.

I can also point you to the samples I have personally submitted to Drugs Data (some with standard effects and some with subpar effects, and both of which show up as MDMA).

Now you are claiming this is a social experiment of some kind or a deceptive thread. Let me be clear with you and anyone else reading - this is a collection of people who have had similar observations or experiences and are motivated by understanding why. We don't have access to the lab equipment or tools we need to further the research. If we did, we would have the answers we are looking for and could stop talking about it. There is no intent to deceive here.

As for first impressions...funny, because MDMA produced reliable, incredible experiences for me for about a half decade. There was no issue with it not living up to a first impression. The first use was not even the most impressive roll. The point that it changed for me was the point that my supplier quit and I had to turn to a new supplier. At that point, everyone in my circle agreed that the product was different, and there were very consistent comments such as the drug making people cold and shivery instead of hot and sweaty, or the desire to be quiet instead of talk. It was not just me. Everyone commented on it.

So, my perception has nothing to do with Le Junk. All he did was comment on something that I had already observed repeatedly. His post resonated because it was familiar to me, and I am sure many others in this thread feel the same way.
 
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indigoaura

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as a chemist i don't take chemists word for granted due to the fact each chemist only has their area of expertise a physical chemist can not just start going on about high level organic chemistry. nor would you expect a organic chemist to go and calculate all the quantum energy levels of a chemical system on a computer.

I was one who was against the mehmdma but now i see its acutally true after covid and enchorchat busts all the good supply is quickly drying up and mdma that still tests postiive on kits does not produce said typical effects of heavy gurning eye rolling extreme love unity and connection with all things.

And i was the motherfucker who was getting good product up til this point trolling the shit out of these threads since 2019. But now i admit its true its just like how idiots who try make LSD never get it right and make a inferior less smooth product same applies to mdma.

You were, indeed, trolling the shit out of us since 2019. :ROFLMAO: Glad you can see where we are coming from now. I long suspected that your region just had a uniquely good supply due to your location.
 

Ambien Powered Rabbit

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@Ambien Powered Rabbit - At the risk of sounding rude, I would like to point a few things out...

You registered a few weeks ago.

You have fewer than 20 posts.

You are blowing up our thread.
you have more than 100x as many posts here! you are literally on every page gatekeeping and trying to steer discussion your way. so do not say I am blowing up your thread with 12 posts. your posts are one of the main reasons I am sceptical this
 

Ambien Powered Rabbit

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Dream land
I have worked very hard to attempt to summarize the previous unwieldly thread into a few posts.
you have summarised what YOU wanted to include and disregarded anything that didn't fit YOUR ideas. I wasted time looking for the evidence ruling out the obvious causes until I realised why they weren't included in your summary...because they don't exist!
There is a MLA formatted research summary complete with Works Cited that summarizes the research side of what we are talking about. You have not really addressed that.
you have taken other people's work and reinterpreted it to confirm what you believe. please tell me about some "barioisomer derivatives" present as native impurities from new mdma synth which have highly potent mdma inhibiting properties.
I can also point you to the samples I have personally submitted to Drugs Data (some with standard effects and some with subpar effects, and both of which show up as MDMA).
your at home trials and what you claim to have witnessed in others don't carry more water than the drugsdata tests. why do you mention the thread is only for mdma tested by one of these labs when you think they produce insufficient results? you really don't seem to want an answer unless it fits with what you have already decided is true.
 

indigoaura

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Jan 4, 2009
Messages
1,569
@Ambien Powered Rabbit - You may be taken more seriously if you spelled correctly, used capitalization, or used accurate punctuation. Just a suggestion.

Yes, I summarized what I felt was most relevant. Anyone else in the thread is welcome to write their own summary of other research that they feel is relevant.

Please direct me to where I used the word "barioisomer" in my summary. I am not familiar with that word.

You are still not actually commenting on any of the research or theories, just here being inflammatory.

I have in writing from International Energy Control that they are incapable of determining most synthesis byproducts because they do not have reference samples. There are also multiple research articles that speak on the inefficiency and incapability of GCMS in identifying those impurities. Have you read that research?

The reason why I said that the thread is for tested MDMA is to avoid the posts where someone has product that has never been reagent or lab tested, but they want to add their experience report. In order to gather further evidence, we really need reports on tested product, not something in a baggie that could have been anything.

I wonder, is this your second account? Did you have a different user name previously?

Everyone has their own power to read and draw their own conclusions. You are welcome to disagree with us, but I am not a fan of people who are rude and pick and choose what to read, comprehend, and respond to.
 
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psy997

Bluelighter
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Messages
2,783
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noitacoL
as a chemist i don't take chemists word for granted due to the fact each chemist only has their area of expertise a physical chemist can not just start going on about high level organic chemistry. nor would you expect a organic chemist to go and calculate all the quantum energy levels of a chemical system on a computer.

I was one who was against the mehmdma but now i see its acutally true after covid and enchorchat busts all the good supply is quickly drying up and mdma that still tests postiive on kits does not produce said typical effects of heavy gurning eye rolling extreme love unity and connection with all things.

And i was the motherfucker who was getting good product up til this point trolling the shit out of these threads since 2019. But now i admit its true its just like how idiots who try make LSD never get it right and make a inferior less smooth product same applies to mdma.

TripSitter, it's massively unfortunate that you're now personally knowledgeable of MehDMA. And, I appreciate the stark contrast of then vs now as it relates to the case that we are making here. I wish you good MDMA in the future, as I do for us all <3

you have summarised what YOU wanted to include and disregarded anything that didn't fit YOUR ideas. I wasted time looking for the evidence ruling out the obvious causes until I realised why they weren't included in your summary...because they don't exist!

you have taken other people's work and reinterpreted it to confirm what you believe. please tell me about some "barioisomer derivatives" present as native impurities from new mdma synth which have highly potent mdma inhibiting properties.

your at home trials and what you claim to have witnessed in others don't carry more water than the drugsdata tests. why do you mention the thread is only for mdma tested by one of these labs when you think they produce insufficient results? you really don't seem to want an answer unless it fits with what you have already decided is true.

1) I'm personally - and I know indigoaura is, too - 100% supportive and wanting of a list that compiles the evidence against our case. In fact, indigoaura has compiled a "most likely issues if not MehDMA" list, if I'm not mistaken. Even better would be a compilation of all of the theories against our case, the amount of posters that have argued against us, the percentage spread between various theories proposed, etc. However, a lack of such an intimately detailed report does not mean we are disregarding evidence presented against our case. In addition, generally, the evidence presented against our case is not quite evidence, and disregards our many combined experiences in one or numerous ways, effectively nullifying the value of said evidence. I and many others have brainstormed, multiple times, the potential scenarios that eliminate MehDMA and instead implicate individual, or groups of, users as the cause of poor MDMA experiences, also.

2) How has indigo misinterpreted research study evidence of MDMA byproducts that inhibit various aspects of the MDMA experience? In academia, it is generally accepted that to make or rebut a claim, one must provide evidence for their assertion. It also also easier to criticize and condemn than it is to brainstorm and hypothesize. So, then, please present evidence for your (strong) claim that indigoaura is maliciously and inaccurately mis- and reinterpreting other people's work. You do not have the credibility built, neither through previous engagement nor presently added value, to come into our thread, throw shit around like a monkey, and then be accepted as if our thread is now not covered in shit.

3) If you don't understand the reasoning behind our continuous reiteration of a specific focus on reagent and lab tested MDMA, then I don't know what to say really, besides being unnecessarily rude. Your third point generally doesn't make sense, and my guess is that's the case because you seem, to me, to be misunderstanding some pieces of our hypothesis as well as mixing various points. Ideally I would write exactly where I see the disconnect, and, I don't have the time for that.

Please do continue posting if you're interested in getting to the bottom of this (including the answer being all of us experiencing a mass delusion). But, only do so if you are willing and able to make solid, logical posts explaining your position (and your position can account for our experiences - the main issue with most evidence presented here against our case is that it does not account for one or many aspects of our experiences, as I mentioned in point 1).
 

indigoaura

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Joined
Jan 4, 2009
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@Ambien Powered Rabbit - I went back through the thread and read all of your posts in an attempt to better understand what your frustrations are.

As far as I can tell, you are frustrated that Le Junk did not post his test results, and also that new user reports were relayed anecdotally by other people rather than in first person by the new user. Is that accurate?

What other frustrations do you have? What else are you looking for?

I also reviewed all of my previous replies to you. You call it gatekeeping, but I have been attempting to address your questions and correct inaccuracies/misunderstandings in your posts. Generally, you ignore replies to you and do not address questions posed to you in replies.

I'm not sure what you think is motivating the people here other than a genuine drive to understand what is going on. Some of us have been engaged in this conversation for years. Others are newer posters to the thread, but have shared valuable research and added nuance to the discussion. Why would anyone waste years of their life actively engaged in a conversation they did not care about?
 

TripSitterNZ

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May 6, 2019
Messages
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The Dimension of LSD-25
whatever byproducts are in these shitty synthesis should have a in depth study into them easily phd material in the future for somebody to have a fun challenge. Highly important with the increase of mdma used in thepary though proper mdma made by like nicols for maps is 99.9% pure which must be the most amazing roll on earth. Sadly nicols has retired from his position at the university But still comes in to make LSD and lyseramide analogues for studies. By investigating the effects of these things blocking mdma would even come to make even greater new compounds it would surely allow us a greater understand into neuroscience and brain chemistry.

Though i won't take mdma again in my life trying to sober up and get away from all my past addictions i assume whatever good product still existed those manufacturers also got busted by enchrochat. Leaving a massive gap in supply in europe people are now turning to even less pure precousers more amauters going on board because all the experinced folk are now in jail cells. MDMA is truly going to be fucked for a long time to come.

The only hope is the future legalization of mdma hopefully one day people can access a highly pure legal sacrament to feel that love and healing.
 
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