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Opioids Utilising Kratom for Opiate Withdrawal

k20

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 2, 2009
Messages
194
I've tried about 3 grams of the kratom x10 extract and was kind of disappointed.

My pupils got pretty small tho.

People seem to enjoy the actual leaves a lot more...should try it out sometime.
 

pallidamors

Bluelighter
Joined
Sep 27, 2008
Messages
7,168
Location
Bankailorado
Something worth being said: You can do too much kratom, just like any other opiate. I learned this the hard way when I was trying to wean myself off oxycontins. I approximated given my tolerance and did wayyy too much. To this day, 2 years later, I can't even think about kratom without feeling really queasy D:.

This is a good point that I think some people forget when they're using kratom to wean off of opiates. All the fibrous plant matter and water that you're chugging with it (especially if you're using powdered leaf or extract) can exacerbate the already profound nausea that comes with withdrawal for most people, so if you don't take your doses somewhat slowly, you can end up purging the very thing that's supposed to help you out. On the plus side though all that fiber helps to regulate your bowel movements a bit, which is excellent during withdrawal.

Taking too much kratom can also lead to some jittery and uncomfortable stimulation in some people. This seems to happen more with higher doses, as the stimulatory effects of some of the alkaloids overtake the mu opioid effects on the ol' dose response curve. I'd say this is probably the closest thing to a kratom OD as most people will ever get, but again, since withdrawal is already going to have you jittery from the adrenergic dumping in your peripheral nervous system, the prospect of more jitters is another reason to dose slowly. In lower doses though, the stimulation can be a very positive thing since some people (myself included) find it quite motivating, so you can still accomplish daily tasks and be productive as you get off of opiates.

I'm not too sure what pharmacological action in kratom is responsible for its stimulatory effects, but I suspect that it, at least in part, involves serotonin, since I've had really bad effects after taking several (around 7 to 8) grams of kratom while I was on Paxil. So I'd be very careful using kratom for withdrawals if you're on SSRIs or SNRIs (or any other type of antidepressant, really!)

So, even if you have a monstrous opiate tolerance, I'd say kratom is still pretty useful, but you may want to give yourself a couple days for your body to acclimatize itself to this unique plant. Really if you're going to go the kratom route, I would stick to moderate doses a few times a day, and even if you are still feeling withdrawal symptoms, ride them out rather than trying to up the kratom, since you'll probably get some adverse reactions trying out heroic doses. After about 2 days you should be used to the lower doses of kratom, and you can titrate your dose down from there or continue on a maintenance dosing schedule if you wish.
 

Pegasus

Ex-Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 15, 2006
Messages
8,073
^Great advice, thanks for the post.

I'm surprised at all the people saying how short-acting it seems to them. I can get by on two doses a day and only barely start to feel w/d in between the two.
 

EyesLikeMiyagi

Greenlighter
Joined
May 22, 2010
Messages
10
Location
North Carolina
Kratom has an opiate like feel sure, but nothing will compare to the real thing. However i could see it as a step down from say oxy, but it does seem to not last very long. Although it will blow my friends out of the water and they'll be gone for hours. However they are not opiate users. I suggest giving it a shot, everyone's body reacts differently to it and all substances.
 

Bojangles69

Bluelighter
Joined
May 20, 2009
Messages
1,758
Well I'll admit when I was doing my taper kratom was "ok" but loperamide put it to shame in terms of effectiveness.
Kratom did very little for me as except make my body a bit warm and stop some hot flashes, but for the most part I was still in pain and anxious. Plus when the kratom would wear off in 3-4 hours, if I tried to redose I got this sick overstimulated hyper feeling that sometimes came with a headache and the shakes.

When I tried a moderate dose of loperamide, it got rid of 90% of my wds and lasted for more then 24 hours. After this past taper I did I'll recommend loperamide over kratom anyday. It was such a cleaner/healthier feeling, and it lasted a shitload longer. Just make sure if kratom isn't really floating your boat, try matching your dose with lope and taper the lope WITH your opiate. If you wanna get off completely taper the opiate for 2-3 weeks, then taper the lope for another 2-3 weeks after that.
Its what I've been doing and its been one of the best experiences I've ever had getting off opiates.
REMEMBER if you do use lope (not to hijack the thread) if you just stop it at a high dose wds will come right back. You need to slowly taper it down like any other opiate so you don't lose your mind and get thrown into wds.
 

hundo

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 1, 2010
Messages
5
Location
cave
As I've found out recently, it definitely works, but like everyone else here has pretty much said, it works best if you throw in some lope and a sprinkling of benzos, or taper with it, etc... but i've gone off pretty fucked up habits only jumping onto kratomtomclub without being very uncomfortable thanks to that gnarly tasting plant powder.

just remember to check your teeth after chomping it because having a bunch of krat stuck in your buckteeth isnt a cute look for anyone, and it does get stuck there

also- take it with some tums or pepto beforehand so you dont hork it all up. washing it down with something really really really sugary and noncarbonated helps a lot too. on that note, strong but madd siugary ginger tea is good for that, and also helps with the nausea and generally shittiness of W/Ds

good luck dudener
 

daddict

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 25, 2009
Messages
58
Location
Europe
Just an update, I stopped the kratom progressively and it was no big deal compared to methadone withdrawals. Overall, I stayed on it for little less than two months (the last month limiting intake to once a day). It did great job for me, considering that I've been on methadone for over 10 years and had made countless tries to wean off.

It doesn't take all withdrawal symptoms, but it helped tremendously with the most difficult ones (especially cravings). The withdrawal from kratom itself was limited to runny nose, some gastrointestinal discomfort and slight chills.
 

getreal

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 21, 2006
Messages
3,154
Location
Back in the USA
daddict,
So now youre clean of it all- both the methadone and the Kratom? Thats some very good news,
congratulations ;)
 

mrlampshade

Greenlighter
Joined
Jun 6, 2010
Messages
1
ok, so how does kratom work for someone that has been on 150mgs of methadone for almost 10 yrs. i have taken up to 450mgs of methadone in a day without any kind of high (no, i'm not lying) anymore, and i want to get off of it. would it help me?
 

anapanastan

Greenlighter
Joined
Oct 6, 2010
Messages
7
Location
Humboldt
a quick and relatively easy way to detox from opiates.
Get these 4 Rx's.
1.) Darvon 65 - aka; Propoxyphene take four 65mg every 8hrs. for 2 days, reduce to three every 8 hrs for 2 days, reduce to two every 8hrs 2 days, reduce one every 8 hrs. 2-3 days.
2.) Bellodona 1/8 gr. or Dicyclomine 10 mg / 5ml sol. to control intestinal distress.
3.) Clonazepam .5mg - 1.0 mg as needed for aniety. 2-3 /day.
4.) Catapress TTS-1 weekly patch for high blood pressure surges.
The trick with this setup is the Propoxyphene.
Many docs know opiate detox symtoms include; high blood pressure, aniety, and violent stomach cramps-so bad you can't keep the other pills down. Even so they can be reluctant to prescribe another opiate. Not always appreciating what propoxyphene is.
Propoxyphene is a Methadone analog -oh yeah, a weak one that keeps you functioning during detox, but weak enough to prevent another habituation problem.

You have to have all 4 meds. The Catapress patch is superior for the uncomfortable blood pressure swings. The Clonazepam is a must for the anxiety.
This really works and can keep you solid enough to look normal and even go to work. Bearing in mind the side-effects using hazardous things etc.
good luck.
 

lozgod

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 29, 2010
Messages
715
I tried Kratom while I was sick. It is definetly a stimulant like yohimbine. No thanks. Don't need help making my brain go even more haywaire while my adreniline is on overdrive already.
 

jjdonkey

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
Messages
43
Location
Chicago
a quick and relatively easy way to detox from opiates.
Get these 4 Rx's.
1.) Darvon 65 - aka; Propoxyphene take four 65mg every 8hrs. for 2 days, reduce to three every 8 hrs for 2 days, reduce to two every 8hrs 2 days, reduce one every 8 hrs. 2-3 days.
2.) Bellodona 1/8 gr. or Dicyclomine 10 mg / 5ml sol. to control intestinal distress.
3.) Clonazepam .5mg - 1.0 mg as needed for aniety. 2-3 /day.
4.) Catapress TTS-1 weekly patch for high blood pressure surges.
The trick with this setup is the Propoxyphene.


No offense, but i'd rather take one OTC "drug" (Kratom or Loperamide) than go out and "Get 4 Rxs". It's not as easy as walking in and saying "Hi, I have a list of four prescriptions...I'll be back in 10 minutes" I mean I'm sure you can get Darvon on the street, but your local supplier probably doesn't have CATAPRESS TTS patches.
 

somethingbetter

Greenlighter
Joined
Mar 4, 2011
Messages
2
Just to add some experience ...

I've used kratom a few times to get off oxys or norcos. I'm currently using it again to get off prescribed tramadol, then norcos again. Long term sobriety plan: meetings be damned, for me, they make me want to use more... still haven't found the magic bullet for that.

My experiences:
- it can relive almost all forms of withdrawal including anxiety, RLS, sleeplessness but be careful with dosage, sources, and titrating down before the body gets addicted (and it will, I've withdrawaled from kratom in the past and it's just as frustrating if not as terrifying as harder opiates).
- Loose stools can be transitioned into a lorapidine taper/withdrawal because you need it. ;-)
- capsules are very helpful but sometimes a beyotch to obtain or pay for, and lots of them contain a dangerous amount of the female hormone, progesterone, so I mix the fine powder with orange juice, turn it into a "clay", and roll it into swallow-able pellets and huck them down with a glass of oj. I thought of this method myself and it makes it more palatable and less dependent on buying capsules.

I'm currently tapering down on some high potency indo and planning on titrating my doses down starting in a few days. I got in trouble with my scripts because I supplemented with some rarely available oxys and morphine from friends for over a month. I had 30mgs of morphine for a few days before I got my kratom yesterday and so far, my low-dose of 10 rabbit poop sized pellets every eight hours has kept me from freaking out.

I'm too old and weaksauce to go through "real" withdrawals. I think the poster who mentioned the weight-training and cardio to help flush the system out has the best idea. The mu-opiate receptors need to be let down gently and replaced with real life health options.

Sorry for the tl;dr but I really wanted to inform people about the pellet system because it's easy and healthy - much easier than toss and watch and much healthier than screwing with a carcinogen like progesterone in capsules.
 

Pegasus

Ex-Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 15, 2006
Messages
8,073
^What does the average "rabbit poop" weigh? ;)

I really like the ingenuity, thanks for posting this!
 

NeighborhoodThreat

Bluelight Crew
Joined
May 24, 2009
Messages
22,288
Location
Richmond, VA
I'm too old and weaksauce to go through "real" withdrawals.

Nobody wants to go through withdrawals.

I don't think going through them cold turkey proves anything to anybody, at least about how "hard" you are...
 

lozgod

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 29, 2010
Messages
715
I tried Kratom when not in withdrawal and felt like I took some ephedra. Makes me scared to try it during WD becuse the last thing I want is a stimulant.
 
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