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Using kratom to get off methadone?

Thinkwithportals

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Feb 3, 2014
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So this is my first time posting on this site, though I've browsed it numerous times. I wasn't sure where to post but I could really use some insight/advice! Sorry if this gets a little long, but I would really be appreciative if someone read through/could help me out.

About two years ago I was heavy into trying any drugs I could get my hands on. My boyfriend at the time was going to a methadone clinic and gave me some of his dose. I asked him if it was addictive and he told me no, and like a gullible and stupid kid I believed him and did no research of my own. I didn't think it was all that great, and he told me I could achieve a "small rush" by IVing it. It was the pink liquid methadone. I know, really stupid and one of my biggest regrets to this day. But I didn't really care at this point in my life and would try anything. Before I knew it I was injecting it every few days, until it became every other day. And I developed a really bad needle fixation. After a few months I decided that I wanted to stop and found out just how nasty methadone withdrawal really is. Im lucky that I haven't suffered any damage to my veins or (not that I know of yet) to my overall health.

I broke up with him but still saw him and continued my dose of around 20mgs every other day for a few more months until I'd had enough and hopped off cold turkey. I made it 14 days and broke down and found other means of obtaining methadone.

Recently I've decided that this time i am getting off for good. I havent done any drugs for awhile aside from occasionally smoking pot and I want to try and be completely drug free for awhile as I have a really good career opportunity that requires it. I took my last 20mgs of methadone 6 days ago (on Wednesday) and ordered 500gs of plain bali kratom powder. The kratom wouldn't get to my house until Saturday, but I was okay with going 2/3 days without methadone. On Saturday morning though the withdrawals were really bad and I found about 1/4 of a suboxone pill that I had saved and took that (knowing i was well enough into withdrawal to avoid predicated withdrawals) it eliminated my symptoms and I felt better. I received the kratom around noon that day and waited until 6pm to test it out. I took about 4 grams in tea and noted a slight euphoric affect but that could have just been a placebo.

On Sunday I felt the withdrawal creeping up on me and took another 4grams in tea at noon. In almost minutes my anxiety and hot/cold flashes subsided.

Around midnight (today) I noticed that I was really sensitive to temperature (hot/cold flashes) and the anxiety/restless limbs were creeping up. I made some more tea (about two teaspoons, so 6 ish grams) and felt better within the hour.

So it's been 6 days (counting wednesday) since i took methadone and usually i would be writhing in pain on the floor, but i'm surprisingly content and actually have energy! (Far different from the last time i tried to kick methadone)

I'm wondering if it is too good to be true, or if I'm just lucky - or if this kratom is really all it's cracked up to be! Of course I know that it is potentially addictive and habit forming so i'm going to use as little as i have to through the withdrawal period. And gradually taper my dose after 25 days. I'm hoping that the 500grams(1.1lbs) of kratom powder will be enough to see me through as it doesn't seem like I need all that much to curb the awful symptoms.

My question is, has anyone had success with kratom in regards to kicking methadone? I am really serious about getting off it, and trying to do everything necessary to restore my body back to even levels. (Exercising, drinking water, vitamins, etc)
Any advise on this topic, or knowledge on the use of kratom would be greatly appreciated.

Again, sorry that was so long!

Also see the continuation of the Thinkwithportals' recovery saga in their more recent recovery journal's:


Congrats [mention]Thinkwithportals[/mention]!!! Keep up the fantastic work <3
 
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Bluesbreaker

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Jan 25, 2014
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How many times a day do you take your 4 to 6 grams of kratom?

I think it's a very good idea. Provided you have enough kratom to take twice or thrice a day, you can make it till the end of february and then taper off.

The only thing I could add is to wean yourself off kratom not too hastily. Take your time to quit it, for it won't be easy (easier than methadone though, and that's the point).
 

Thinkwithportals

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Feb 3, 2014
Messages
128
How many times a day do you take your 4 to 6 grams of kratom?

I think it's a very good idea. Provided you have enough kratom to take twice or thrice a day, you can make it till the end of february and then taper off.

The only thing I could add is to wean yourself off kratom not too hastily. Take your time to quit it, for it won't be easy (easier than methadone though, and that's the point).
So far, once a day has sufficed for the worst of the symptoms, and usually I take it around noon. Towards the middle of the night if I get uncomfortable ill drink about 3 grams and find that I can go to sleep comfortably without waking up more than a few times. Which is amazing to me!
I've read that most take it 2-3 times a day, but luckily I have a few weeks to go through the withdrawal at home, so I'm trying to tough it out when I can, though like I said, once a day seems to be doing the trick. I'm just relieved that the anxiety/sleeplessness seems to be completely gone. Those are the worst for me.
And that's what I planned to do, once I get towards the one month mark, I'm going to start tapering down to 1/2 grams a day, then every other day, then hopefully not at all.
Thank you for your input :)
 

weekend addiction

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How many times a day do you take your 4 to 6 grams of kratom?

I think it's a very good idea. Provided you have enough kratom to take twice or thrice a day, you can make it till the end of february and then taper off.

The only thing I could add is to wean yourself off kratom not too hastily. Take your time to quit it, for it won't be easy (easier than methadone though, and that's the point).
Solid advice. Small steps forward stops big steps backward.
 

Thinkwithportals

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Feb 3, 2014
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128
^ thank you, I agree! I'm going to try to keep my dose under 10gs each day and try to skip days of taking anything when I can. If the symptoms become too much I will probably take a higher dose, but then take a break from it so a tolerance/habit doesn't develop. I also have a prescription to seroquel but I don't know if that would help with sleep.. And at this point the kratom is helping me sleep so I probably won't take them unless absolutely necessary.
 

Stargazer

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I watched a video on a guy w/d'ing from H on Mayan Kratom. He was in hour 48, and was lying on the couch covered in a blanket. I know damn well that hour 48 w/d doesn't look like that. What I mean is it is helping, just like you said. The fact that he was drinking anything period was amazing.

I saved the video is you want to watch it. I'm thinking about going the Kratom way myself. You seem to be feeling alot better than this guy. He still doesn't have energy....but is alot better than he would be without it.

Right after he finished drinking a cup of tea, whoever is filming asked him if he felt better, he responded "significantly". He still can't sleep etiher. Good for you. Keep going.
 

Bluesbreaker

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Jan 25, 2014
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Seroquel will certainly help you sleep when you want to get off kratom completely ;)
 

Thinkwithportals

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Feb 3, 2014
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I watched a video on a guy w/d'ing from H on Mayan Kratom. He was in hour 48, and was lying on the couch covered in a blanket. I know damn well that hour 48 w/d doesn't look like that. What I mean is it is helping, just like you said. The fact that he was drinking anything period was amazing.

I saved the video is you want to watch it. I'm thinking about going the Kratom way myself. You seem to be feeling alot better than this guy. He still doesn't have energy....but is alot better than he would be without it.

Right after he finished drinking a cup of tea, whoever is filming asked him if he felt better, he responded "significantly". He still can't sleep etiher. Good for you. Keep going.
I would be interested in seeing the video!
I am currently on day 8, and honestly... The worst I've felt is sometimes if I haven't taken kratom in 8-10 hours I'll get slight aches and pains, and chills. But that is all.
I have even been sleeping over 8 hours a night, which is so amazing to me! I would definitely recommend it from my experience so far... I am a little wary of coming off kratom, but I am hopeful that it will be tolerable as long as I taper my dose correctly.
I am very headstrong about this, as I have wanted to kick methadone for awhile, it's almost surreal that I am actually doing it.
Thanks for your response/support :)
 

Stargazer

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No problem thinkwithoutportals...I will post it.

You know what was messed up though? Obviously the woman filming doens't know what H or opiate w/d is like...and she says at one point, something like It's too late to do anything, you have no money and no way to come w any. wtf???

I hate that horrible hour, at like two a.m., when you know, there's nothing you can do....and it causes your anxiety level to go to the ceiling. You DON'T ever say that to someone kicking. Jesus. What a idiot...but on the flip...I do admire her for sitting w the guy while he's going through it. We're all more self-destructive while alone...

That is awesome that you're getting through. Seriously, I am happy for you girl. And of course, anytime. I understand as I've been through w/d more times than I can count...and it sucks. It's not easy to stop. I admire what you're doing.:)
 

Stargazer

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Think...I decided to put up when he's at 84 hours...which I think is admirable as hell. I know he wants to go down the way so badly....but he made it far. He ATE...that is jaw-dropping to me. I'd still be dry heaving and gagging....I can't even drink anything. My lips crack...it's just hell. And sleep? No. Once I hallucinated at the three day mark....I thought the lady on tv was talkign to me, and the only way I could answer her is to put the cordless phone near the tv. Whoah. Out there. And I got clarity here and there, and realized I was hallucinating. It only happened to me once...but it scared me. You can check out his other videos on youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gk-njfY5TKQ

Edit: Hope it helps for you to see it works for others...so you feel safe.
 

Black Rabbit of Inle

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Using as little kratom as you can, while still avoiding withdrawals would be best, as many people who try to quit this way end up with an addiction to Kratom instead.

As Bluesbreaker said, it will be easier to get off the kratom in the end, but you may still have to deal with mild withdrawals. And once you're off everything PAWS may still be an issue, although not everyone goes through that.

Good luck with weaning off the methadone.
 

Lutopia

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Dec 10, 2013
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38
I saw yu talking about these hot cold flashes I'm on Opana and endocet and I have these hot/ cold sympt. What causes these? How can I rid myself of these ... Please help
 

Stargazer

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Lutopia, I believe someone recommended clonidine, and said it completely helped w the hot/cold flashes, which drive me crazy too. Hot one minute, sweating like crazy, then freezing, in a cold sweat....yuck.

Clonidine(Catapres) is used to treat high blood pressure, restless leg syndrome, and hot flashes. There are some really good threads on the forum, megathreads for "Opiate Withdrawal". You have to get clonidine by prescription. Hot/cold symptoms are part of w/d'ing. I don't know why you personally are getting them if you're not out of meds...unless it happens when it's time to take another dose? I have no idea why they happen. Sorry.
 

Lutopia

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Dec 10, 2013
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Hi Stargazer;tanx 4 the info. I failed to mention ;I also take Perc"s x3/day. Do u think it's coming off and on them during the day? AND should I tell my Pain MD?

Good idea. Exersize heck just walk round the block. Also helps get a new perspective for a little while. Lutopia

This is Lutopia again where could we see the vidio?
 
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Stargazer

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Luiopia, if you are directing your questions at me, yes, I would definately tell your Dr. about the way you're feeling. Maybe he can adjust your meds, and figure it out.

I have tried to explain that my meds need to be adjusted. My Dr. doesn't seem to understand or believe "tolerance". I don't go to a pain management Dr. I go to a normal D.O., that I was referred to by my neurologist, because he will write the Rx's I need, my neuro doesn't. But, I know more about tolerance than a guy that went to school to be a Dr. :? It's scary. Damn. Not the person you'd want to recommend your pain regime for surgery lol. Thank God for Anesthesiologists right?

I also wanted to address that the "Sober Living" forum has all of this information, such as about clonidine. I apologize for not mentioning that you I didn't look at your profile or amount of posts, so I don't know how new or familiar you are. Maybe a moderator could've kindly mentioned it, rather than using acronyms that are lost on us...but maybe that was the point? Being that this board is so huge, I'm not entirely sure I even read clonidine mentioned on the Sober Living thread the first time I read it...there's lots of conversations going on here. And one thing leads to another...but on The Sober Livng thread, neversickanymore, a mod, has been through alot, and has lots of information and knowledge about the ins and outs of opiate w/d and then some...check out his stuff. Very informative and incredible insight. It should be taken into consideration, that we are trying really hard to get to know the board, and this it takes alot of time. I spend hours reading the board, and go to lots of different forums and still am not doing this right. I try to learn, and be supportive.

Right now, I am also struggling w a heroin addiction and trying to come to terms w it. My reasons for sobriety are financial and I don't want any part of the lifestyle. I've already walked this road, more than once which maks me feel even more remorse ,and self hatred. Unfortunately, sober living isn't the forum I go to the most....yet:(. I look forward to the day it is....

I am trying my best to get familar w everything on bl. And if you want to watch the video, the link is right on my post to thinkwithoutportals when I mention that the guys at the 84hour mark of w/d'ing from heroin. It's on youtube. If you click on that link, and watch that video, you'll see others you can watch too. You can also go on youtube and type "Withdrawal from opiates with Kratom" or something similar, and you'll find videos. Hope that helps some...and your reason for the hot/cold could be due to some w/d.

That happens to me even while I'm taking my pain meds, not just during w/d. I believe it's because my dose isn't stable, and hasn't been for a couple of years. I'm not entirely sure about that and definately mention that, especially if you have a pain management dr...I'm not sure if you're coming on and off of percocet due to running out early or by choice. I don't think I'd mention you run out early because you're taking too many though. If that's the case, you might want to look into adding some loperamide w your meds. In the search engine, at the top right of bluelight, type in "opiate withdrawal", and stuff will come up in regards to it. Then you can go from there. I'm not sure how you meant that. I hope everything works out well. :)
 

Thinkwithportals

Bluelighter
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Feb 3, 2014
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128
Just wanted to post a quick update for you all :)
It's been just over two weeks and my dose of kratom is around 12g's. Today I didn't take any and only had one small bout of anxiety - and a lot of chills and lethargy. But other than that there was little to no symptoms. I have been EXTREMELY comfortable through this whole process- and plan to start tapering the kratom soon and then hop off completely :) I wanted to thank you all for your support again - y'all have been awesome :)
 
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