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U.K. - Government urged to sell cocaine and ecstasy in pharmacies

S.J.B.

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Government urged to sell cocaine and ecstasy in pharmacies
Henry McDonald
The Guardian
October 20th, 2020
Cocaine, ecstasy and amphetamines should be “nationalised” and sold legally in government-run pharmacies to undermine global drug-related crime, a UK drugs reform charity has recommended.

In a book – with a foreword written by the former prime minister of New Zealand Helen Clark – the drugs liberalisation campaign group Transform has sought to set out practical ways to sell the drugs in state-run special pharmacies as an alternative to what it calls the “unwinnable war against drugs”.

The book includes a mock-up of what a packet of legal, prescription cocaine would look like, including health warnings, which Transform said could be sold over the counter by specially trained chemists.

Transform’s campaign for legalising the three drugs is backed by the former president of Colombia Juan Manuel Santos. He has publicly stated that only through legalisation can the resources of mafia organisations be taken away. “I am totally in favour of legalising cocaine,” Santos said.

The book proposes that a specialist regulatory agency, overseen by the government, could license production of the drugs.
Read the full story here.
 

TripSitterNZ

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i believe cocaine is one of three drugs which should remain illegal and come with ways to help users with a addiction to it. Its literally funding terrorism in south america and central america everytime somebody uses cocaine they are support barbaic blood cartels who are x100 worse than even isis. Ecstasy should be legal though.
 

Nightraver

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I’d settle for being able to buy some weed without fake pills shite gear or brown powder being threw at me every time I want a nice bit of smoke and I’m positive this countries drug problem would start dropping if a person didn’t have to deal with the scum of the earth just to score some nice weed
 

S.J.B.

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Its literally funding terrorism in south america and central america everytime somebody uses cocaine they are support barbaic blood cartels who are x100 worse than even isis.
This is all due to that the fact that it is illegal.

If the U.K. legalized cocaine, it would have to produce it domestically, as international law disallows the import and export of controlled substances for non-research (EDIT: or medical) purposes. For example, all of Canada's legal cannabis is produced domestically.
 
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SunriseChampion

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I've been talking about pharmacy MDMA since I first touched the stuff. In my lifetime! I'm going to start gambling on all these legalisation and decriminalisation maneouvres...as in betting on when they'll come through.
 

Nicocastillo7

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i believe cocaine is one of three drugs which should remain illegal and come with ways to help users with a addiction to it. Its literally funding terrorism in south america and central america everytime somebody uses cocaine they are support barbaic blood cartels who are x100 worse than even isis. Ecstasy should be legal though.


This is true, I can imagine all the drugs that are going to be diverted to this part of the world. If we even get good MDMA from the UK now it will increase more ... This is good news for consumers like me, but I don't know how much on a public health level.
 

Branggen

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i believe cocaine is one of three drugs which should remain illegal and come with ways to help users with a addiction to it. Its literally funding terrorism in south america and central america everytime somebody uses cocaine they are support barbaic blood cartels who are x100 worse than even isis. Ecstasy should be legal though.
Isnt that the exact reason they want to make it legal, so its produced on farms and not by cartels
 

negrogesic

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i believe cocaine is one of three drugs which should remain illegal and come with ways to help users with a addiction to it. Its literally funding terrorism in south america and central america everytime somebody uses cocaine they are support barbaic blood cartels who are x100 worse than even isis. Ecstasy should be legal though.

The legalization and regulation of cocaine would reduce drug trafficking associated violence immensely. There would be no need for it.

Cocaine usage might increase. I feel like in the US states where marijuana is legal more people use it than they did before. Which isn't a big problem as marijuana isn't particularly harmful.

The problem is cocaine is harmful. And tremendously addictive. New black markets would arise to supply those that exceeded their monthly quota of cocaine, etc. The savings of reduced policing and DEA budgets would go to treatment however.

It seems as the tripsitternz has done too much sitting and not enough tripping, otherwise you would realize that the impact from legalization and regulation would be a positive as far as the mitigation of human suffering is concerned.
 

TripSitterNZ

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The legalization and regulation of cocaine would reduce drug trafficking associated violence immensely. There would be no need for it.

Cocaine usage might increase. I feel like in the US states where marijuana is legal more people use it than they did before. Which isn't a big problem as marijuana isn't particularly harmful.

The problem is cocaine is harmful. And tremendously addictive. New black markets would arise to supply those that exceeded their monthly quota of cocaine, etc. The savings of reduced policing and DEA budgets would go to treatment however.

It seems as the tripsitternz has done too much sitting and not enough tripping, otherwise you would realize that the impact from legalization and regulation would be a positive as far as the mitigation of human suffering is concerned.
i think people over estimate legalization of hard drugs it would not impact the situation in south and central america at all. illegal or legal changes nothing for the cartels they will still carry on the murder. Coca can't grow everywhere in the world and especially won't be able to grow in a UK climate. The other viable location for growth is south east asia outside of the tropical jungles of the americas. Cocaine is not like weed where people wont will kill each other over turf and growing areas. The land size required to support the consumption of cocaine for a legal market would also not be viable in most places expect the vast expanse of where its already grown by cartels. You can grow cannabis anywhere in the world. if people could grow coca anywhere they would be doing it already.

I think people don't realize the cartels will never change even if it was legal for them to grow. Money only matters and complete control. And i believe most people just don't want to accept the fact that every time they snorted cocaine myself included you have funded the most violent terror groups to ever walk the earth and have blood up your nose. This is a reason why i never would get back into doing cocaine.
 

negrogesic

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i think people over estimate legalization of hard drugs it would not impact the situation in south and central america at all. illegal or legal changes nothing for the cartels they will still carry on the murder. Coca can't grow everywhere in the world and especially won't be able to grow in a UK climate. The other viable location for growth is south east asia outside of the tropical jungles of the americas. Cocaine is not like weed where people wont will kill each other over turf and growing areas. The land size required to support the consumption of cocaine for a legal market would also not be viable in most places expect the vast expanse of where its already grown by cartels. You can grow cannabis anywhere in the world. if people could grow coca anywhere they would be doing it already.

I think people don't realize the cartels will never change even if it was legal for them to grow. Money only matters and complete control. And i believe most people just don't want to accept the fact that every time they snorted cocaine myself included you have funded the most violent terror groups to ever walk the earth and have blood up your nose. This is a reason why i never would get back into doing cocaine.

Yeah but I think the overarching point is that net human suffering would decrease upon legalization and regulation.
 

LandsUnknown

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i believe cocaine is one of three drugs which should remain illegal and come with ways to help users with a addiction to it. Its literally funding terrorism in south america and central america everytime somebody uses cocaine they are support barbaic blood cartels who are x100 worse than even isis. Ecstasy should be legal though.

Even drugs like cocaine should be legalized and regulated. Under the best of circumstances, coke, heroin, meth, etc. would not be safe substances or even close to it. They'd still be addictive and potentially very dangerous. However, if users were taking measured doses of a pure form of the drug, it would be far less dangerous than it is now. Because nowadays, there are often substances in the batch that users don't know are there.

Some of these substances can be very dangerous, such as levisiamole in cocaine. Heroin is sometimes laced with fentanyl. There are many other examples. This greatly increases the risk of overdose, because users do not know what they're taking. Purity is also unknown, which further adds to the confusion. Taking things like cocaine, heroin, and meth is never going to be safe. However, legalizing and regulating it would be the best way to reduce harm to users.

And keeping it illegal is exactly why money from drug sales is going to dangerous criminals. The criminalization of drugs causes a lot more harm than good, even when it comes to the more dangerous ones like coke, heroin, and meth. I agree that addicts should have more resources to get help. Decriminalizing coke and other hard drugs would free up more resources for addiction treatment. So, people could more easily get help if they need it.

I also agree that MDMA should be legal. It's fairly safe compared to things like cocaine and other hard drugs. People rarely get seriously addicted to it or die from using it. Many, if not most, users have experienced more benefits than negative effects from it. It can actually offer profound healing experiences in the right setting. However, if it's illegal, it often ends up adulterated and is not available in clearly measured doses. Thus, it increases the harm and reduces benefits.

Criminalization is all around a bad policy with all drugs, but it's especially obvious with comparatively safe and potentially beneficial drugs like MDMA and psychedelics. Still, even though using cocaine is a great example of an addictive and dangerous drug with very few potential benefits, legalizing it still would reduce harm to users. And it would potentially allow addicts to have more access to the treatment they need than they do currently.

Also, legalization/decriminalization does not necessarily result in increased usage. Studies from countries that have legalized/decriminalized various substances have shown this. So, legalization/decriminalization most likely does much more good than harm overall, even for drugs that are best avoided. Because it's less harmful to the user, reduces harm to society by taking funds away from dangerous criminals such as the cartels, and frees up resources that could be used to help addicts.
 

S.J.B.

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i think people over estimate legalization of hard drugs it would not impact the situation in south and central america at all. illegal or legal changes nothing for the cartels they will still carry on the murder. Coca can't grow everywhere in the world and especially won't be able to grow in a UK climate. The other viable location for growth is south east asia outside of the tropical jungles of the americas. Cocaine is not like weed where people wont will kill each other over turf and growing areas. The land size required to support the consumption of cocaine for a legal market would also not be viable in most places expect the vast expanse of where its already grown by cartels. You can grow cannabis anywhere in the world. if people could grow coca anywhere they would be doing it already.
In 2018, the typical retail price of cocaine in the U.K. per pure gram was $106.81. In Colombia, the typical wholesale price per pure gram was $1654 per kilogram. That is a 6400% profit, excluding the profit that the Colombian wholesalers are making. You don't think someone could figure out a greenhouse setup within that kind of margin? And forget about cultivation... a chemical manufacturer could easily develop a process to make enantiopure cocaine for below that price. Cocaine is a bit too complicated for clandestine chemists to make profitably but it's pretty simple stuff by pharmaceutical industry standards.
 

trogere

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100% pure pharma grade cocaine, that would be so much better that the shit going around.

Please count me in for pharma ket and mdma!!!!
 

TripSitterNZ

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In 2018, the typical retail price of cocaine in the U.K. per pure gram was $106.81. In Colombia, the typical wholesale price per pure gram was $1654 per kilogram. That is a 6400% profit, excluding the profit that the Colombian wholesalers are making. You don't think someone could figure out a greenhouse setup within that kind of margin? And forget about cultivation... a chemical manufacturer could easily develop a process to make enantiopure cocaine for below that price. Cocaine is a bit too complicated for clandestine chemists to make profitably but it's pretty simple stuff by pharmaceutical industry standards.
eantipure cocaine synthesis is not easy. and the few methods out there for a total synthesis requires many steps with extremely low yields and formation of many inactive stereoisomers. if it was easy it would of already been done. Cartels have employed many phd biologists and chemists in the past since the 1970s to try come with ways of expanding their business. Natural cocaine is the highest quality even higher than total synthesis and way way cheaper. Nature is the most efficient chemical factory in the world. People can not compare the usage rates of cannabis legalization to a hard addictive substance such as cocaine or meth. These things were once legal in the past. With the state of UK drug usage and binge drinking its clear the British can not control their substance use and if cocaine was made legal usage would increase among the entire populace and those with full blown addictions will most likely be totally defeated by the drug. Decriminalization is totally different to legalization and decriminalizating drug use is what i would support but still sentencing dealers smugglers etc to jail while the end user is given health treatment to treat addiction. Hell cocaine use could be totally avoided if they legalized 5meo dmt and gave that to every user at the pharmacy under a controlled setting.

Mike tyson only kicked his cocaine usage due to smoking the toad.
 

negrogesic

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eantipure cocaine synthesis is not easy. and the few methods out there for a total synthesis requires many steps with extremely low yields and formation of many inactive stereoisomers. if it was easy it would of already been done. Cartels have employed many phd biologists and chemists in the past since the 1970s to try come with ways of expanding their business. Natural cocaine is the highest quality even higher than total synthesis and way way cheaper. Nature is the most efficient chemical factory in the world. People can not compare the usage rates of cannabis legalization to a hard addictive substance such as cocaine or meth. These things were once legal in the past. With the state of UK drug usage and binge drinking its clear the British can not control their substance use and if cocaine was made legal usage would increase among the entire populace and those with full blown addictions will most likely be totally defeated by the drug. Decriminalization is totally different to legalization and decriminalizating drug use is what i would support but still sentencing dealers smugglers etc to jail while the end user is given health treatment to treat addiction. Hell cocaine use could be totally avoided if they legalized 5meo dmt and gave that to every user at the pharmacy under a controlled setting.

Mike tyson only kicked his cocaine usage due to smoking the toad.

You're right, id imagine commercial cocaine probably would have a plant origin but this isnt a huge problem. A company in New Jersey already handles 100 tons of coca leaf a year. The decocainized flavor extract is sold to coca cola and the cocaine is sold to pharmaceutical companies. This is from legally grown coca. Bolivia alone grows huge amounts of legally grown coca. It could be scaled up. Cartels aren't essential.
 

TripSitterNZ

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You're right, id imagine commercial cocaine probably would have a plant origin but this isnt a huge problem. A company in New Jersey already handles 100 tons of coca leaf a year. The decocainized flavor extract is sold to coca cola and the cocaine is sold to pharmaceutical companies. This is from legally grown coca. Bolivia alone grows huge amounts of legally grown coca. It could be scaled up. Cartels aren't essential.
that legally grown coca is acutally cartel controlled. Bolivia has extreme rates of murder and violence. Coca cola could care less about what happens to people getting murdered in south america to drive profits of their soft drink. This cartel problem is probably impossible to solve and a legal market will do nothing to change the status quo.
 

S.J.B.

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eantipure cocaine synthesis is not easy. and the few methods out there for a total synthesis requires many steps with extremely low yields and formation of many inactive stereoisomers. if it was easy it would of already been done.
Again, just because cartel chemists haven't done it doesn't mean that GlaxoSmithKline or Patheon can't. The expertise and available resources are really not comparable. It's not easy but drug companies are experts at making complex molecules as cheaply as possible, and synthetic chemistry has come a long way since Casale's cocaine synthesis.

Hell cocaine use could be totally avoided if they legalized 5meo dmt and gave that to every user at the pharmacy under a controlled setting.
Everyone I know who got into a cocaine or heroin addiction had been using psychedelic drugs beforehand. They aren't some kind of magical ward against addiction, although some people may find them useful in that regard. 5-MeO-DMT, for example, is legal here and quite popular in the rave scene, among people who continue to do plenty of other drugs...
 
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trogere

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Again, just because cartel chemists haven't done it doesn't mean that GlaxoSmithKline or Patheon can't. The expertise and available resources are really not comparable. It's not easy but drug companies are experts at making complex molecules as cheaply as possible, and synthetic chemistry has come a long way since Casale's cocaine synthesis.


Everyone I know who got into a cocaine or heroin addiction had been using psychedelic drugs beforehand. They aren't some kind of magical ward against addiction, although some people may find them useful in that regard. 5-MeO-DMT, for example, is legal here and quite popular in the rave scene, among people who continue to do plenty of other drugs...

I'm a bit surprised. 5-meo-dmt popular in the rave scene?!? I know where to look at to buy some, but I pass. This one has a tricky dose-effect curve. I would extract and use DMT way before 5-meo-dmt.
 
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