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TV: Physostigmine/GHB - Catalyst, ABC - 27/05/04 @ 8pm.

Cowboy Mac

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edited 17/05/04 - updated thread title and added a new post regarding air date/time.

The ABC's Catalyst is a scientifically based program and is doing a story on physostigmine, which was previously discussed in the thread: Physostigmine - GHB Antidote. They would like to include a user perspective to balance out the scientific information/expert opinion and are asking for a volunteer to discuss their GHB experiences/use. Dr. David Caldicott (drplatypus) will be discussing his research on physostigmine, and use at the Royal Adelaide Hospital as a GHB antidote.

edit: interview is now completed. thanks.
 
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I have spoken with Maryke again, and ideally they would like to speak with someone who has needed medical assistance with GHB, so someone who would be in the situation of possibly needing physostigmine. They are not trying to represent GHB as a drug that sends everyone to hospital, but given the focus of the research they're looking at, it would fit into the story a lot better. This might be an even more difficult ask, but they are not being fussy, so they are still willing to accept views from a GHB user who has not had medical attention.
 
Dr. David Caldicott (drplatypus) will be discussing his research on physostigmine, and use at the Royal Adelaide Hospital as a GHB antidote.

It's about time some form of broader recognition came to drplatyus and team.
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Your Work.
 
Good work!
Its good to see that out of all the recent media publicity 1,4b is getting, there will be some good that will eventuate from it.
 
They will be filming parts of it this week, but I suggest you keep checking the Catalyst website, or this thread.
 
I have just received an email from Mayrke regarding the air date:

Thursday, 27th May, 2004.
8pm, on ABC.


This will be a fascinating story regarding a treatment which may become a more widely used antidote for GHB overdoses.
 
Yes Don't miss it!

It'll be interesting to hear what he's got to say on physostigmine, as I'm sure there will be mention of the fact that the answer was there all along, yet no-one had thought it important enough to look a bit deeper.

This says something about everything. From allocation of government research funds, to pharmaceutical companies offering to find an answer[NOT]. It even spreads to doctors and academics many of whom should have been concerned enough with G related hospital admissions to have searched to find a solution. A solution which incidentally, was waving a "published reference hand" for all to see. Well thankfully there is a concerned Dr or 2. drplatapus's team did the searching and came up with something published shortly after GHB was first synthesized.

Despite recent media hysteria highlighting the numbers of admissions to emergency, and the expected responses that would create, it would again seem this is simply another example where the coalface workers have had to provide the answer. Was it that no-one else in the right position could be bothered?

While I don't wish to in anyway understate the achievements of drplatapus and his team, the fact remains that the basic information on Physostigmine being used for G-OD, was already in existence. Some Bluelighters are good reference hunters ;) but if it weren't for the fact that a team of medical researchers made the find, it may have been a discovery in vain, as it seems few ears of significance were listening - well, they certainly weren't looking.


To doctors who may remember once prescribing it for glaucoma or as antidote to insecticide or TCA poisonings, physostigmine would at first seem an odd choice for treating a GHB coma, as it's typically a drug used to block actions of drugs like scopolamine and atropine, and so works primarily on ACh (muscarinic) receptors.

It was used as an antidote for tricyclics where it exerted neuroprotective effects on areas of the brain affected by these drugs. Goodman and Gilman (6th Ed) lists Physostigmine as the only reversible anticolinesterase with appreciable capacity to cross the blood brain barrier to exert central actions.

[This is due to physostigmine being a tertiary amine, as opposed to many other agonists of this class which are quaternary amines and don't get through]

The danger - in case anyone thinks self medicating will be the go - is that physostigmine is itself a powerful poison, capable of causing seizure itself. So leave the administration to someone who hasn't already made the mistake of over-dosing.

Here's a bit on the history and pharmacology of physostigmine. It comes from the Calabar bean, a perennial in tropical Africa. The bean was used by tribes of West Africa as an "ordeal poison" for witch-craft. Work done by Daniell in 1840 established some of it's pharmacological properties. in 1864 a pure alkaloid was extracted and named both Physostigmine and eserine by different researchers. By 1880 it was being employed in the treatment of glaucoma. Physostigmine remained one (the least toxic) of the few known reversible anticholinesterase (AChE) inhibiters. Non-reversible AChE inhibiters were unknown until around world war II when the nerve gas and pesticide research resulted in the nasty carbamyl esters and organophosphorous compounds.

The reason physostigmine isn't used today so much is that better replacements were found for most of it's uses. It also found uses as a tricyclic antidepressant antidote. The modes of action -from what I've been able to discover - aren't well known, but I'd be interested to see what lead to it's discovery as a GHB antidote.

Interesting stuff. Program your schedule for Thursday, 8:00pm ABC.


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Physostigmine
 
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8pm tonight guys.

GHB – reporter Paul Willis

This Catalyst report investigates the newest party drug on the dance scene GHB. It’s caused several deaths, many more to overdoses and its use is growing. With hospital emergency wards being overwhelmed by severely overdosed GHB users, this story explains what exactly is GHB doing to users. It turns out that it’s a naturally occurring substance in the mammalian brain. But it depresses the central nervous system and slows breathing, heart rate and lowers your blood pressure. People who overdose on GHB have to be intubated and ventilated, so every weekend hospital emergency wards are being pushed to the limit by overdose cases - taking up places on ventilators. But one doctor in Adelaide may have the answer to battling this drug, and freeing up hospital beds. It’s an out of favour drug called physostigmine, with the ability to bring people out of GHB coma in minutes.


source
 
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I sure hope someone can put this into mpg/avi form as I'm travelling Oz and where I am at moment, there is no T.V. If so, could someone put a url in here if/when it gets done..

Cheers :)
 
was interesting. seemed a little bit scare mongering but probably only a reflection of the true dangers of ghb. thanks for the heads up on it.

that doctor seems to be doing some great work (thanks!).

one question: they said it had been tried on semi conscious ghb overdose victims, is it safe to try on people who are dangerously close to respiratory collapse and not conscious?

got a mate to record it to avi, will encode it and hopefully get a torrent up over the next few days.
 
one question: they said it had been tried on semi conscious ghb overdose victims, is it safe to try on people who are dangerously close to respiratory collapse and not conscious?

Good question, but I do hope it was not meant in the context of self administration. Perhaps it could be prepared as a preventative, but in guessing I'd very much doubt it. I could be wrong though, I'll let drplatypus answer that.



I thought the Catalyst segment was very well presented. I also thought comments drplatypus made were well balanced in regards to drug use; indicating a general neither condemn nor condone attitude. Comments made regarding choosing another drug over G, and his number one wish being that G and all it's analogues could somehow disappear; were also I feel not made without good reason.

This man has explained the desperation of casualty staff, their absolute frustration at having more people turnup to emergency than they have respirators for. Who's life is saved first? I'd be tearing my hair out if faced with such decisions. Sure there are probably a few of the old manual respirators around, but that ties up another staff member or 2 and a bed, and is I'd imagine, a far cry from the monitoring possible with a logged EEG, ECG etc.

It was good to have a peak into the emergency department, but also into the role of the frustrated doctor, a feeling which must also felt by many health workers and doctors. Respiratory failure is at the far end of dangerous conditions, so these workers have a right to feel biased against the use of G.

Now if there was a way of quantitatively testing all of the possible G precursors, some of these people may not feel the way they do. But there isn't such a test, and probably never will be. What's taken as G today - normally 1,4B - may be something completely different tomorrow. There's just that many possible pro-drugs in this family. Hat's off to drplatypus. Pharmacologically speaking, I'm sure there's nothing quite like the feeling of re-defining a poison as an indespensable remedy :)


(Pro-drug: inactive substance, but becomes active in-vivo)
 
im interested because i don't imagine it would have much value if it only applies to semi-conscious OD victims, because generally those people wake up naturally without assistance.

its real value would be if it could reverse severe overdoses related to g/1,4b?
 
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