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Opioids Tramadol Tolerance

BK38 said:
Glad you're taking steps to get off it. A jump off from just 750mg to nothing would be way too much for me, but I guess it's ok if you have morphine to stabilize you and the diazepam to prevent you from seizing. I've also experienced seizures from tramadol, but only once I went above 400mg and then took less (so yes, also seized when in tramadol wds). It's a bit of a bitch and does have quite a protracted withdrawal, but you can do it! (I took Tramadol pretty solidly for 5 years or so at doses between 100mg and 500mg)
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need to do something about it ... 1500mg of tramadol a day, that's too man, my doctor is concerned about my health at the moment, they prefer to give me morphine. I take diazepam almost 4 years ago anyway.

I did not know about the seizures in the wd of tramadol
 
Nicocastillo7 said:
need to do something about it ... 1500mg of tramadol a day, that's too man, my doctor is concerned about my health at the moment, they prefer to give me morphine. I take diazepam almost 4 years ago anyway.

I did not know about the seizures in the wd of tramadol
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I'm not surprised that your doctor is concerned, I'm a druggy and I'm concerned! 1500mg is just not a viable amount to be ingesting at a time. Again, I'm glad you're in talks with a doctor and you're monitoring your health more closely. Ime, the first month without Tramadol is the hardest and it gets easier after that. Good luck!
 
BK38 said:
Glad you're taking steps to get off it. A jump off from just 750mg to nothing would be way too much for me, but I guess it's ok if you have morphine to stabilize you and the diazepam to prevent you from seizing. I've also experienced seizures from tramadol, but only once I went above 400mg and then took less (so yes, also seized when in tramadol wds). It's a bit of a bitch and does have quite a protracted withdrawal, but you can do it! (I took Tramadol pretty solidly for 5 years or so at doses between 100mg and 500mg)
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Diazepam isn't used during tramadol WD to prevent seizures but as a muscle relaxant
 
BK38 said:
I'm not surprised that your doctor is concerned, I'm a druggy and I'm concerned! 1500mg is just not a viable amount to be ingesting at a time. Again, I'm glad you're in talks with a doctor and you're monitoring your health more closely. Ime, the first month without Tramadol is the hardest and it gets easier after that. Good luck!
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I don't take 1500mg at a time, I take 150mg doses all day long up to that dose, anyway, thanks man, I'm still here so I guess I can do it
 
Vinnie77 said:
That's very rare that you don't have opiate cravings like most people. Good for you. If you ussually wake up little bit depressed and you know it will get worse within few hours, then you can try pregabalin. It worked better than anything else i tried for depression and anxiety.
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I did try pregabalin (Lyrica) at some point and it did nothing for me unfortunately, even at high doses. It's so weird I'm still wondering why. Plus I've heard that weight gain is a huge issue with that drug.
 
Nicocastillo7 said:
I don't take 1500mg at a time, I take 150mg doses all day long up to that dose, anyway, thanks man, I'm still here so I guess I can do it
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Wow that's a lot!! I'm glad you're trying to stop. Please stay strong man.
Though at this point do you still get the effect of Tramadol? or is it just for maintenance?
 
Raven6 said:
Wow that's a lot!! I'm glad you're trying to stop. Please stay strong man.
Though at this point do you still get the effect of Tramadol? or is it just for maintenance?
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750mg is just for maintenance, even 1500mg is just a little high, but nothing, I need to add soma and hydrocodone to the mix to get a high

I try 450mg for maintenance, but it doesn't work for me
 
Raven6 said:
I did try pregabalin (Lyrica) at some point and it did nothing for me unfortunately, even at high doses. It's so weird I'm still wondering why. Plus I've heard that weight gain is a huge issue with that drug.
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Pregabalin is one of that substances that works like magic or does nothing at all so i am not surprised. What about kratom as a substitute for tramadol ?
 
BK38 said:
It does also relax muscles, but it literally raises your seizure threshold (Tramadol lowers it) and is used for this purpose too. It's useful for both of those properties.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29682729/
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Yeah, i know that diazepam is used to prevent seizures, but how can you have a seizure from tramadol if there is very small amount of tramadol metabolites in you body during WD ?
 
Vinnie77 said:
Yeah, i know that diazepam is used to prevent seizures, but how can you have a seizure from tramadol if there is very small amount of tramadol metabolites in you body during WD ?
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Much in the same way that you can have a seizure from alcohol when in withdrawal. Your brain naturally produces gaba and other neurotransmitters. When your body is flooded artificially, like it would be from alcohol or tramadol, your body stops/reduces the production of it's own inhibitors (as the alcohol or tramadol is fulfilling that role). Your body is constantly trying to reach homeostasis and so it stops producing that by itself. When the alcohol or other substance is then suddenly removed, you have a lack of inhibitors in the brain and your brain is "over excited" with your brain literally shooting out way more signals. That lack of balance or homeostasis is basically withdrawal in some respects. A seizure occurs when all of those signals fire off at once when the brain's neurotransmitter system is very off balance. That's the really simplified spark notes version as far as I understand it.
 
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BK38 said:
Much in the same way that you can have a seizure from alcohol when in withdrawal. Your brain naturally produces gaba and other neurotransmitters. When your body is flooded artificially, like it would be from alcohol or tramadol, your body stops/reduces the production of it's own inhibitors (as the alcohol or tramadol is fulfilling that role). Your body is constantly trying to reach homeostasis and so it stops producing that by itself. When the alcohol or other substance is then suddenly removed, you have a lack of inhibitors in the brain and your brain is "over excited" with your brain literally shooting out way more signals. That lack of balance or homeostasis is basically withdrawal in some respects. A seizure occurs when all of those signals fire off at once when the brain's neurotransmitter system is very off balance. That's the really simplified spark notes version as far as I understand it.
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Yeah, but that means that you can have seizure if you go cold turkey from high dose of any substance, not only alcohol or tramadol.
 
Vinnie77 said:
Yeah, but that means that you can have seizure if you go cold turkey from high dose of any substance, not only alcohol or tramadol.
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No, it's dependent on the substance. Things like benzos, gabapentinoids etc are particularly dangerous because of their inhibitory properties. Tramadol may be have this kind of action because of it's SNRI properties.
 
Vinnie77 said:
Pregabalin is one of that substances that works like magic or does nothing at all so i am not surprised. What about kratom as a substitute for tramadol ?
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I've been researching Kratom lately, and I would like to try it. Though the biggest problem is availability. Kratom isn't sold where I live so I'm struggling to find a reliable online supplier that provides worldwide shipping.
But is Kratom safer than Tramadol? They both work on the Opioid receptor as far as I know.
 
Safer and less addictive, but obviously you won't get as high as you do from tramadol. It's milder, but you are interested in supressing depressive thoughts, not getting high, so if it will work, it will be better option comparing to tramadol
 
I took a 3 year break and when I was prescribed it again I still had a tolerance. I was talking it for back pain at 50mg once or twice a day for 2 years.
 
Tramadol. Had a very bad experience with it thanks to an even worse doctor. I had gotten off Vicoden and was switched to Tramadol. straight switch no tapering. I had been on the hydrocodone for 8 years at that point and my pain was managed and I had no withdrawal from the Vicoden. Smooth sailingThe Tramadol didn't give the warm loosening up feeling but it did OK. No withdrawal and being able to sleep was great.

Then this doctor decides out of the blue he was just going to cut me off any Rx pain meds. Just BANG. In two days I was almost non functional. The WORST RLSI have ever experienced even when I was up and moving. If I stopped moving it was like I had zero control over my whole body. Twitching shaking and that horrible RLS sensation I can't even describe x 100. I've had problems with RLS since the accident that has me on pain meds now but no opiate/oid pain med I've ever been on caused withdrawal symptoms near as bad as Tramadol.

The RLS was uncontrollable. My legs and even arms would just spasm and launch into a full blown punch or kick. The lady I was with got on the wrong end of it. My leg spasmed when we were in bed and I booted her pretty good. i had to sleep on the couch till I got things under control. So of course I found a new doctor who was quite confused as to why the other doctor cut me off. There was nothing in my records or even his notes as to his reasoning. Meds like oxycodone or even hydrocodone are far better than Tramadol and if withdrawal does ever become a concern the opiate version is easier than Tramadol.

I'm on Dilaudid now. Only 8 mg a day but I can get by on that. I use it mainly for the RLS (which is worse than having a multiple compound tib/fib injury.) I know that from personal experience to be fact. So I might just do the whole 8 mg in one dose at bedtime. What RLS? haha. I'll never use Tramadol again. Thankfully my pain doc and I are on the same page. I've been thinking about switching to oxycodone. In oral use form I believe it does work better than Dilaudid. Nasally the Dilaudid is great though so if it ain't broke.

Anyway my experience with Tramadol was not a pleasant one. My experience will not be everybody's but I think it's safe to say if someone does have problems with RLS Tramadol may best be passed by. With my RLS there is nothing else that works besides the narcotics. Especially now since I had to have the foot and ankle that was messed up amputated last March. Now its's RLS combined with phantoms. Double whammy. I explained all of it to my doctor and he's got me on an effective treatment. The Tramadol can be left on the shelf.
 
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Raven6 said:
Ah I was never aware that there is a "Permanent Tolerance". That's very sad to know. I've always wished I could go cold turkey for a while, reset my tolerance, then get back on them, and repeat the proccess.
Thank you fot the info though.
Any idea how long it would generally take for the permanent tolerance to kick in? took tramadol daily from 2018-2019 a tolerance came and I stopped. Now it’s 2023 I got prescribed it and I STILL have a tolerance and I don’t understand this. Did some brain change occur? How is this possible
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