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the market: stocks, bonds, options, whatever

kingorlowest

Greenlighter
Joined
Mar 10, 2021
Messages
15
Location
San Francisco
True, you could buy immediately and then spend it. That's probably the best way. But in theory you do have to pay taxes whenever you spend/send crypto, since there's no way to distinguish between transferring money between wallets or spending it on goods/services. So in theory, if I've held BTC for a couple of months, use it to buy some drugz online, I have to pay capital gains tax on the difference between when I acquired it and the price it was valued at when I spent it.
 

electronDegenerate

Bluelighter
Joined
Dec 10, 2020
Messages
382
Location
Wildling Country
BTC is testing $60K today! Will it succeed?
Seems like it!

So I was playing around on Binance keeping my trading scheme I was ranting about earlier in mind.
It is actually proving to be quite realistic to snipe 1-2% even a couple times in a day. I managed to do it while the markets were all going down yesterday and while they were rising today. Still have a little anxiety when it comes to picking my coins. I almost chose one that looked great while zoomed in a little on the charts but when I zoomed out I realize they were still hovering right at their all time high from a week ago after like 300% gains. A coin that could suddenly devalue massively right out from under me is still something I have to be very wary of.
However I started with $937 and just by systematically sniping those low percentages I am now sitting on $993. Not too impressive but its a worthy proof of concept for my own self. I did not realize that all the trading pairs on the US Binance were to USD or Tether anyways with only a handful of BTC trading pairs. So thats convenient.

Someone in here should test this idea out with me.
Also I think it would be amazing if I got on this forum with a stupid basic ass idea like this and made all you guys rich
 

Xorkoth

🎨 ARTministrator 🎨
Staff member
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53,341
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In the mountains
I'll test it sometime soon, maybe once I buy my next BTC (in the next few days). I was talking to my friend who spent 2017/2018 day trading crypto and he said that he lost more than he gained trying to do just this... it is very hard to read he says. But he also said he would generally get greedy and try for5%, 10%, and then end up selling for a small loss more often than not. In any case you'll have to account for not all of your trade attempts working out and you'll lose some.
 

Xorkoth

🎨 ARTministrator 🎨
Staff member
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I'm pleased, I have been watching Verano Holdings (a weed stock that recently had its IPO, that my friend deeply involved in the industry is sure is going to end up being one of the main US players) has dropped some every day since its IPO, from a brief high of $32 down to $18. It seemed to find a bottom at $18, hung out around there for a week, and then started going up. On Thursday I bought in at $19.25, and I'm up 13% so far. It's a long term hold for me, and I plan to average in more, but it feels good to (apparently) have finally chosen good entry point on something. Even with my house, I bought it 3 months before the housing bubble collapsed in 2008. It immediately lost about 40% of its value right after I bought it. 13 years later, I am finally in the green on it. I also took out a first time homebuyer credit of $7500 which I have to repay $500 of every year for 15 years, and 3 months later when my house lost like $100k of value, Obama legislation made the first time homebuyer credit $8000, and it didn't need to be repaid. Worst housing market entry ever. 🤣 :cautious::cautious:
 

thujone

Bluelight Crew
Joined
Aug 31, 2006
Messages
10,860
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::1
Even with my house, I bought it 3 months before the housing bubble collapsed in 2008. It immediately lost about 40% of its value right after I bought it. 13 years later, I am finally in the green on it. I also took out a first time homebuyer credit of $7500 which I have to repay $500 of every year for 15 years, and 3 months later when my house lost like 4100k of value, Obama legislation made the first time homebuyer credit $8000, and it didn't need to be repaid.

shiiit bro, harsh buzz :(

there's a huge housing bubble here, i'm planning to just move off-grid and build a cabin but even lumber is expensive now so might have to go with a shipping container or something
 

Xorkoth

🎨 ARTministrator 🎨
Staff member
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Messages
53,341
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In the mountains
Yeah it really pissed me off... still kinda does but oh well, what can you do? It's just almost comical to me how every time I've invested in anything, even a house and property, it's been right at the height of a bubble. It's uncanny. I could only owe like 20% of my house's value, instead I owe 60% of my house's value, and the timing was SO CLOSE.
 

electronDegenerate

Bluelighter
Joined
Dec 10, 2020
Messages
382
Location
Wildling Country
The trick is to be ready the next time the bubble bursts. You can be the guy that swoops in and grabs one of those foreclosed houses for like 15% what its worth. Help the banks purge their books, note their loss, and get that massive government bailout money we were all so eager to chip in.

@kingorlowest I think you are totally correct about the Capital Gains Tax thing. Apparently the IRS is just implementing the enforcement of it now. Basically you will pay a percentage on every trade equal to your salary tax bracket. If you hold the coin more than a year before selling/trading it becomes long term capital gains with a smaller tax. So on my taxes next year I will have to calculate and pay the government 20% of the profit from every trade I made. Luckily these US exchanges will keep track of that for you.
Simply not claiming them is not a good idea. Its a matter of time before some exchange gets audited and when that happens anyone who used that exchange and didn't pay their taxes will be discovered.
However I don't think the US can do that with an exchange outside the US, so use that knowledge however you want. I'm not sure if they will attempt to get you to claim your profits from an exchange outside the country that they have no jurisdiction over. They must want you to use the honor system there.

Edit: To be clear you pay on the profit gained each trade, not the full value of the trade.
 

thujone

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Yeah it really pissed me off... still kinda does but oh well, what can you do? It's just almost comical to me how every time I've invested in anything, even a house and property, it's been right at the height of a bubble. It's uncanny. I could only owe like 20% of my house's value, instead I owe 60% of my house's value, and the timing was SO CLOSE.

At least with the house you end up with shelter and equity, it beats being in the red on an asset you couldn't live in.
 

Xorkoth

🎨 ARTministrator 🎨
Staff member
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Messages
53,341
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In the mountains
Oh yeah, no doubt. By the way I got the appraisal back and it appraised for $325k. :) So I'm about $70k above what I bought it for. And well over what I needed for the money I need to borrow and stay under 70% debt to equity. I'm going to owe $210 on it once the mortgage refinance closes next week. Currently I owe $155, but I borrowed money to fix the roof, windows, doors, install heating/AC and a wood stove, that I need to pay back, and I am taking out about $6k extra so I can use it to fix up my garage into a livable space (which will increase the value a lot more). Gonna do that stuff myself over time though.

I bought Volkswagen, just one share, yesterday at $320. It's at $450 at the moment, it's absolutely skyrocketing. I guess I finally made a good timing choice. :) Well okay it was a massive green candle that dropped from 480 briefy to 420, but it's going up. Should certainly raise in value a good amount, as it stands to be a leader in the EV market. I'm gonna watch it and probably set a stop loss for some percent less than it settles at at the end of the day, and hold it until my stop loss triggers or until we see where it goes longer-term.

I also feel good about where I finally bought into my new cannabis company that went public recently, I watched it steadily fall since its IPO, then it seemed to gather support around $18, stayed there for a couple of weeks and then started going upo. I bought in at 19.25 and it's been slowly climbing, I'm at around 12% gain at the moment but it seems like it found its bottom and will be climbing from here.
 

electronDegenerate

Bluelighter
Joined
Dec 10, 2020
Messages
382
Location
Wildling Country
Looks like we had a Crypto Sale today.

I'm still gathering my funds to start my experiment in earnest. I put what little I had into BTC and now that its down its tied up until it goes up again.
Thinking about my strategy for the future I have basically come up with three compartmentalized trading personas.
The Hodler
Focus on saving BTC, ETH long term. Rarely trades only after exceptionally large gains. May focus on stakeable coins on the side. Is in it for the long run.

The Keen Trader
Builds a relationship with chosen coins. Actively trades in and out of them. Go with the flow trading approach. Chooses strong, researched coins.
My current choices are XRP, DOT, UNI, XLM, ETN, BAT, and MANA.

The Manic Trader
Nothing else matters but reliably getting 1-2% for those compounding gains. Go against the flow trading. Always looking out for the coins that are in the red.
Requires nothing but volatility.

I'm going to see which approach is more effective (and enjoyable) after awhile.
 

Xorkoth

🎨 ARTministrator 🎨
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The stock market is starting to feel sketchy. My portfolio has been gaining or losing like 3-5% daily. Mostly losing lately. It's making me nervous but as I made my choices, I feel, wisely, I am just holding. I sure as fuck wish I had gotten in like a year and a half ago. My one stock that is WAY in the green I bought 2 years ago, it's keeping me afloat. If I had bought every one of my positions around then, I'd be at 2-3x my investment.... instead I'm like 25% down overall. Anyway looking years aheas this is a bump but it's hard to not feel salty about it. But training on not being reactionary and panic selling stuff meant for long term holding.

The stock market has been foundering for a little while now. Wonder whether we'll break from this or have a big correction first?

Even my damn Volkswagen is just exactly even right now. Seems like a good long term hold though since it's trying to outcompete Tesla for top EV manufacturer so I'll hold it.

My ARKK is my biggest ETF position and it's just been fucking me, I bought in at an average of $148 and it's sitting at $110 right now, it hit 110 a little while back and wen6 back up to almost 130, and now is back down. Makes me wonder if it's a good one to be holding. It certainly slayed the past few years. Can't really sell now though. I'd be at a substantial loss. Well, if I thought it was going to go a lot farther down I could sell and rebuy lower but... nah, I always fuck that sort of timing up.

BTC down too. I will probably stick another couple hundred in there soon.
 

thujone

Bluelight Crew
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I think there's a lot of stimulus money still sloshing around making things peaky. my best gainer these past few months has been in dividend equities. They are not as sexy as the growth equities but they also don't crash as hard when times get tough, and DRIP is a good solution for hands-off compound growth.
 

Xorkoth

🎨 ARTministrator 🎨
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What is an example of a dividend equity? I'm not exactly sure what the term means, though I can guess the general meaning.
 

thujone

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stable, blue chip companies that are mature and not likely to experience sudden growth. these are the counter-balance to pure growth ETFs. with growth equities you expect the price to continue rising and then cash out to lock in the gains. with dividend equities you get paid regularly, so by setting up a DRIP all the gains go to funding the purchase of more shares.

with dividend equities the price doesn't grow as much but because of the regular payouts you end up with more shares (and thus your value captured grows).

there are ETFs for this but in some cases you may as well just buy the company directly and avoid the fees, dividend aristocrats might be worth it though because those holdings are selected on the basis of consistently increased yields
 

Jabberwocky

Frumious Bandersnatch
Joined
Nov 3, 1999
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49,286
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Looking-Glass Land
stable, blue chip companies that are mature and not likely to experience sudden growth. these are the counter-balance to pure growth ETFs. with growth equities you expect the price to continue rising and then cash out to lock in the gains. with dividend equities you get paid regularly, so by setting up a DRIP all the gains go to funding the purchase of more shares.

with dividend equities the price doesn't grow as much but because of the regular payouts you end up with more shares (and thus your value captured grows).

there are ETFs for this but in some cases you may as well just buy the company directly and avoid the fees, dividend aristocrats might be worth it though because those holdings are selected on the basis of consistently increased yields
Do you pay taxes if you you drip it back into the market?
 

thujone

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Do you pay taxes if you you drip it back into the market?

yes, but it saves broker fees at least. i try to keep all this stuff in tax shelter to avoid having to think about it, now i don't have to pay an accountant to do my taxes either
 

Jabberwocky

Frumious Bandersnatch
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49,286
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Looking-Glass Land
yes, but it saves broker fees at least. i try to keep all this stuff in tax shelter to avoid having to think about it, now i don't have to pay an accountant to do my taxes either
I tried to see if I even have to pay I’ve only made like 400 tops most of mine is buying shares in my realm
 

electronDegenerate

Bluelighter
Joined
Dec 10, 2020
Messages
382
Location
Wildling Country
I've been rampantly gathering information about crypto altcoins.
So at current Ethereum is being massively restricted by it's "gas" prices. Many analysts consider it to be highly undervalued because of this in spite of the massive network that has been created around it. These prices are also affecting all the various other projects running on Ethereum. These issues are basically destined to disappear, and if I understand correctly no more ETH will be mined at that point as well. This is going to be a sort of flood gates being opened event for ETH.
This may just lead to an average pump in the market
or...
the idea behind ETH is to basically replace every function it can on the internet with a blockchain version of it. This system will leave a lot more of peoples finances and data security in their hands. Imagine for a second in 15 years blockchain is the defacto method of data transfer and handling on the internet. We are (potentially) in the very early stage of massive adoption of a new technology. Some analysts say ETH will hit a trillion dollar market cap.

There are several altcoin projects that I think will also massively benefit from this, and they fit into a couple catagories.
DEX coins
These are staking coins for decentralized exchanges. These run on the Ethereum network and adhere to a more purist principle of cryptocurrencies, that you maintain control over them. On Binance, Kucoin, and similar Centralized Exchanges they have complete control over your wallets and your cryptocurrency. You have to trust that they will have no issues that will affect your wallets. With DEXs you keep them in your wallet and contribute to liquidity pools. Right now the gas prices are a massive hindrance to using these. That will change when ETH upgrades.
DEX coins i'm watching are Uniswap, Sushiswap, Pancakeswap, 0x, Kyber Network, and 1Inch. Its only logical that trade volumes will skyrocket after the upgrade.

DeFi coins
These coins are governance coins for financial staking and lending programs. These are the projects that aim to muscle out the banks, and basically by definition will soak up huge amounts of money as they continue to grow. Because of this they may outpace any other cryptos growth in the coming years.
DeFi coins i'm watching are Chainlink, Compound, Aave, Maker, Yearn, Synthetix, Ankr, and Luna

The "Ethereum Killers"
This is an interesting an often hyped group. These projects are in some ways rivals to ethereum but many of them are addressing scalability issues that Ethereum faces that will essentially let them run along side with and integrate into Ethereum. These projects are are all creating large and hugely successful networks that are gaining a lot of traction.
ETH Killer coins i'm watching are Cardano, Cosmos, Polkadot, Ripple, Stellar, Tron, Solana, Neo, and EOS.

NFT Coins
I'll add this because I like the idea, but I am still shakey on how much potential is really there. These coins are all about online game and collectibles dApps/markets, and should similarly benefit from ETHs upgrade. I think the video game industry has been thirsty for new ways to monetize their games and blockchain has served them up an answer on a silver platter.
NFT coins i'm watching are Decentraland, Ecomi, Enjin, and Sandbox.

The actual Cryptocurrencies
I have to say when people think about the mass institutional adoption of cryptos they are usually thinking of the currency and associated payment methods aspect of blockchain. These are sort of your bluechip cryptos with approachable use cases and development of payment apps. I'm less into these at the moment because these do not run on Ethereum, and thats where I'll be focusing my attention on mostly this work season.
Currency coins to watch are Bitcoin (duh), Litecoin, Ripple, Stellar, Monero, Dash, Celo, and Electroneum.
 
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