birdup.snaildown
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2020
- Messages
- 1,139
JGrimez said:You need to wake up, sir. Especially for someone who claims to desire a Trump win.
I want whoever won to win. My preference is less important than the truth.
JGrimez said:You need to wake up, sir. Especially for someone who claims to desire a Trump win.
I want whoever won to win. My preference is less important than the truth.
Here’s a tweet with a link to a blog that provides an explanation for the over 300%. (It’s a pro-Trump blog.)Wayne County is where Detroit is located.
It always votes democrat, even when Michigan goes republican.
Clinton won Wayne County by 288,934 votes
Biden won Wayne County by 332,617
Again, the numbers are consistent.
...
Wayne County (2016)
D H. Clinton 66.8% 517,842 R D. Trump 29.5% 228,908
Wayne County (2020) 597,170 68.5% 264,553 30.3%
Here’s a tweet with a link to a blog that provides an explanation for the over 300%. (It’s a pro-Trump blog.)
Basically they mixed up the state data.
Trump is not a stupid man. And to put all of this down to narcissism is a stretch. So maybe there's something else at play?It troubles me more and more that the more sensible trump supports here can't see what's happening.
Trump doesn't care who won, he just wants to stay president. So he is doing absolutely everything he can to remain president.
It's not about fraud, it's not even not about fraud, it's about winning.
That's why, like the dictator he sees himself as, he is trying to force Republicans to bow to his wishes and appoint their own slate of electors.
That's the goal, stir up as much confusion and division that states are willing to just ignore the majority of their voters and directly appoint trump.
Trump's approach isn't what you do if you are actually worried about fraud, it's what you do when you're a narcissist and care only about winning, no matter what the truth or the law says.
With trump I expect that, with his obsessed cult like fanatic supporters I expect that.
But there's actually some reasonable people whom I otherwise respect who don't seem to see it. And that particularly concerns me.
Fortunately America's democratic systems are actually pretty damn robust and it's quite unlikely that even a renegade president will be able to overcome them.
And when he's out of office, it will be a great day for American democracy.
That would be Biden.
Trump is not a stupid man. And to put all of this down to narcissism is a stretch. So maybe there's something else at play?
If there's any experts here on the Constitution (and it's gazillion amendments):
What, if any, provisions are made should something unfortunate happen to a President (Elect?) and a Vice President (Elect?) under this particular set of circumstances i.e. given that it's a change in Political Party to boot?
JessFR said:It troubles me more and more that the more sensible trump supports here can't see what's happening.
JessFR said:birdup.snaildown said:
I want whoever won to win.
JessFR said:That would be Biden.
The Succession Act. Thank you. Got some reading to do.Killing Biden wouldn't solve trumps problems.
He didn't win. And in America you can't really win by default so to speak.
At noon on January 20 his term expires. If he hasn't been reelected by the electoral college by then, and there's nobody else to take over, the succession act and constitution would take effect instead.
Which means president Nanci Pelosi.
Trump knows he needs the electoral college to vote for him to stay in office. So he's trying his best to disrupt the process in the most vulnerable states in the hopes when the EC votes in mid December, the swing states that went against him aren't able to vote for Biden. Either cause they couldn't certify their results or because he's convinced their legislatures to send republican electors in disregard of the actual result.
It's a disgusting, un-American, borderline treasonous act that would damage faith in the democratic system for decades to come and severely hurt the country. But it would mean trump gets 4 more years and that's all he cares about.
Also the very fact he's gone to these lengths should show everyone with a brain that he's NOT joking about a third term. If he can find any way to do it, ANY way lawful or not. He will.
Which is why he has to be thrown out as soon as possible. The longer he's in the more power he gains and the greater the threat to the countries future.
Thank christ he lost. Most likely these desperate attempts to throw out the legitimate result of the election will fail miserably as they have so far. But that we are even discussing such brazen attempts to subvert the will of the majority of the country as well as the entire process going back hundreds of years shows the danger he poses.
Here’s a tweet with a link to a blog that provides an explanation for the over 300%. (It’s a pro-Trump blog.)
Basically they mixed up the state data.
Speaking of media and their bullshit though I was horrified when I saw the below last night. More so because this was PBS! I had respect for them. But since when do they post opinions and factually incorrect information in the form of banners or graphics during a press conference
I'll go through it and list them (one or two technically incorrect and some opinion or speculation based).there are a number of banners in that clip. which specific statements do you feel are inaccurate?
alasdair
Just quick note:If a president somehow managed to force an election in his favour, the American people wouldn't take it.
There would be a war.
The US is not Russia.
For the record (just so I don't get called out again and be accused on not knowing what I'm talking about):
I know the procedure under normal circumstances. But looking for the particular premise that I've put forward wasn't on my radar at the time. And I'm wondering if it was something that the Founding Fathers could have even dreamed of or foreseen as being a remote possible set of circumstances.
Whatever the case and before I've found and read the relevant:
It's not that far fetched of a premise.
May be worth looking at under what circumstances a POTUS has the authority to declare Martial Law and what effect that would have on an election (and particularly an election that is technically or legally or constitutionally still in limbo) (which it is no matter what anybody wishes to believe).
If a president somehow managed to force an election in his favour, the American people wouldn't take it.
There would be a war.
The US is not Russia.
Side note: The Vice President doesn’t necessarily become president if the president-elect dies until Congress declares the winner of the vote by the electoral college.What, if any, provisions are made should something unfortunate happen to a President (Elect?) and a Vice President (Elect?) under this particular set of circumstances i.e. given that it's a change in Political Party to boot?
WHAT HAPPENS IF THE WINNING PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE DIES AFTER THE ELECTION?
The 20th Amendment says the term of the current president and vice president ends at noon on Jan. 20. There is no provision to extend it. The amendment also says if the president-elect dies, the vice president-elect shall be sworn in as president at the start of the new term.
However, the winning candidate doesn’t become president-elect until a joint session of Congress counts the votes from the Electoral College and declares a winner, Pildes said.
By law, Congress is scheduled to formally receive the votes from the Electoral College on Jan. 6. The new Congress, which will be elected in November and sworn into office on Jan. 3, will preside.
WHAT HAPPENS IF THE WINNING CANDIDATE DIES BEFORE CONGRESS DECLARES A WINNER?
“That’s the worst, most confusing time,” said John Fortier, director of governmental studies at the Bipartisan Policy Center. “They are going to have to figure out what to do with (Electoral College) votes cast for a candidate who has died.”
If the winning candidate dies before the Electoral College meets, the electors could coalesce around a replacement candidate recommended by the party, perhaps the vice presidential candidate.
“For the most part, these people are picked because they are loyal party people,” Fortier said. “You could have a few stray here or there, but they are not rebels.”
A party’s electors would have an incentive to coalesce around one candidate, he said, because they wouldn’t want to risk throwing the election to the other party. But there is no guarantee they would all agree on a replacement candidate.
Some states have laws that require electors to vote for the presidential candidate who won the statewide vote; other states could quickly pass laws governing the electors in the event that a candidate dies.
“The party can say what the party wants, but the states would decide what to do with those electors,” Hasen said.
The Supreme Court ruled unanimously in July that states may require electors to support the candidate picked by voters in the election. However, the court left open what would happen if the candidate dies.
“Nothing in this opinion should be taken to permit the states to bind electors to a deceased candidate,” Justice Elena Kagan wrote in a footnote to her majority opinion.
If this happens, expect litigation.
WHAT IS THE ROLE OF CONGRESS?
The 12th Amendment to the Constitution gives Congress the final say on who is elected president and vice president. Congress decides whether to accept or reject slates of electors from the Electoral College and to determine whether a candidate has won the required 270 electoral votes to become president.
As a check on this power, both the House and Senate must agree to reject a slate of electors. If the two chambers don’t agree, the electors get counted under federal law, said Michael Morley, an assistant law professor at Florida State University.
If no candidate reaches 270 electoral votes, the House chooses the president and the Senate chooses the vice president, in a process spelled out in the Constitution.
In the House, each state delegation gets one vote for president, and they must choose among the three candidates who received the most votes in the Electoral College. Currently, Republicans have a majority in 26 state delegations, but the numbers could change after the November elections and a new Congress takes office.
The Senate would choose the vice president by a simple majority vote.
Election experts said they wouldn’t expect the courts to play a role at this point because the Constitution clearly grants Congress the authority to resolve a disputed election for president.
The Supreme Court did effectively decide the 2000 presidential election in favor of Republican George W. Bush by ending the recount in Florida. But the court’s ruling came before the Electoral College votes were presented to Congress.
“It is really in Congress’ hands after the electors have voted,” Fortier said.
It's shocking how many "patriots" would celebrate the destruction of the systems that have defined America for hundreds of years.