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The Big & Dandy DOC Thread - Third opinion

Folley

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Folley I hate to break it to you but you set a baby compared toy psychedelic experience. I took 6 mg DOBat the age of 14 orally with no problems. Please ready posts in this forum before you diffestnamytjing to me. I'm older, more experienced, and all I do I'd high dose. I used to eat 2+. Mg of LSD and crave more. I dont put drugs in my ass. I blow. 80-85mg of
2C-C as my typical dose. I honestly feel insulted.
Feel insulted all you want, someone needed to point out your obviously reckless behavior so that other members of the forum will not copy it. 5mg is a VERY high dose, 7mg is ridiculous. Whatever dude, have fun.
 

Thanatos

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You obviously haven't read my previous posts. If I can chill on multiple mg of LSD than 7 mg will be fine for me.
Thus is a hr site but of course some visitors will have a naturally high tolerence.
I think you should take circumstantial factors into account before you insult a member that is more expetienced than most.

If you wold look look into my history you would know I'm a hard head and a former stim addict.
Plus I've dosed high on DOB and DOI. Don't call your elders foolS when they are well aware of the situation at hand.
 

《Plasticity》

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Feel insulted all you want, someone needed to point out your obviously reckless behavior so that other members of the forum will not copy it. 5mg is a VERY high dose, 7mg is ridiculous. Whatever dude, have fun.
There's a huge difference between 5mgs sublingual and 5mgs plugged. Typically plugged phens are 1.5+X stronger than oral, buccal, sub. I agree with thanatos, your not taking other peoples tolerances or how experienced of a tripper someone is into consideration. I have an online buddy that also says 5mgs is the sweet spot. Phen hardheads like me will find 3mgs a fucking tease, if I'm going to invest 15-20 hours then I want the effects to be strong enough to keep my interest. I wouldn't reccomend just anyone 5mgs as a starting dose but thanatos needs 45mgs insufflated 2c-i, 40mgs insufflated 2c-e, and 45mgs insufflated 4-aco-dmt to get off, you really think he wouldn't be able to handle 5mgs DOC? I take 2/3 of those doses and I found 3mgs boring.

Thanatos 7mgs does seem a bit excessive but if you titrate properly you should be able to find a sweet spot before that 7mg mark. Anyways let us know how it goes bud, keep in mind DOC takes 2-3 hours to peak so take that into consideration when titrating
 

FunctionalOlfactio

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I know I am placing myself in the path of considerable opposition with a opinion that will be unpopular. Please understand this is only my opinion and isn't an insult of any individual.

I can't speak from personal experience with DOC. Speaking from my experience with other chemicals I can say that Shulgins high end dose recommendations tend to be border-line break through experiences for a healthy sober individual without tolerance. Shulgins high end dose recommendation for racemic DOC is 3mg. I recognize individual genetic variance can play a part in drug sensitivity, but genetic extreme hyposensitivity is a rare phenomenon. I have observed a pattern of rapid dose escalation to extreme doses with frequent use in DOC users.

My concern is that drug metabolic kinetics are complex and that there might be a metabolic explanation for progressive dose escalation that might have long term implications in DOC users. This might be due to a bi-phasic half life and/or metabolic inhibition with repeated use. If this is the case, this would mean the chemical would be in your system long after effects became sub-threshold. As the baseline dose increased with frequent repeated use higher doses would be required to achieve a psychedelic experience. Over time this could influence the metabolic kinetics of other drugs too. Dietary factors are probably relevant.

I wonder if something like this might account for the variance in 25x-NBOMe tolerance that some observe.

--------------------
http://www.shulginresearch.org
http://www.freeleonardpickard.org
http://www.maps.org
http://www.erowid.org
 

Thanatos

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Of course captain, I'll report while I titrate up.

As i said I'm going to start in the microgram range, and once I get to mg, Im going to move up to .5 until I reach about 2mg. By then I'll know the character and decide my dose. I'm fairly certain that ~7 will be my sweet spot, if not higher.

Like you said captain, I'm not trying to feel 'okay' for 20 hours. I wanna be off my rocker frying my dick off during the peak. What's the point of moderate dosing for such a long lasting compound?
 

Solipsis

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Uhm enhancement? People report doing things like playing an instrument like a god and other sorts of hypomanic extravaganza.

You seem to self-contradict a bit at a very first glance, but anyway I side with folley that some of the things you report on are incredibly irresponsible but the plan to titrate DOC is smart and unlike them. Do what you want with your own body and mind regarding megadosing or multicombo'ing - I know your record - but don't pretend it is normal, that wouldn't be good for the community. Don't you know BL has an ever decreasing tolerance for that? It's been announced from high echelons. And it shouldn't only count for heroin and meth abusers.
So emphasize behavior like this titration, that would be great. And realize that people read our posts and base their own decisions on them.
 

Thanatos

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Solipsis, I preach HR, but when talking about a dose that would be fitting for me or my experiences why would I hold my tongue? If this is not a forum to report and converse about subject experience than it is fundamentally flawed and goes completely against the spirit of open dialogue.
 

《Plasticity》

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I should also clear this up, to anybody who read my post DO NOT start at 5mgs, please. That post was directed at thanatos and thanatos only being that he has quite the hefty tolerance. I know it's horrible HR but I strongly feel that thanatos will be fine taking that dose and very well may be underwhelmed. Thanatos, I would reccomend allergy testing then start with a 3mg dose and titrate from there if you need be. When your slowly titrating something so long lasting there will be quite the tolerance build but I'm sure your very well aware of this, anyways have fun man and definately come back and let us know what dose suited you as well as the effects it brought to the table.
 

!!Lg09dU3o

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3-MeO-PCP and DOC combo?

Both have:
~ 1.5 - 2 hour comeups.
~ 8 - 12 hour durations.

The stimulation and dissociation may balance, while the dopaminergic action at NMDA receptors and whatnot gets the one-teo punch with the serotonin provided by the 5-ht stimulation.



Thoughts?
 

Solipsis

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It's rather about warning others about that tolerance and emphasizing that difference rather than expressing how much for example you want to fry your dick off, similarly I've seen you talk countless other times about things that happened such as your T-7 incident where various compounds were in your system (sorry those things happened, though by the way I have yet to see that closure we agreed on) and doses or ROAs may have been questionable, or just now that your brother ate a gram of DiPT. I'm pretty sure there are a lot more examples - just to be clear, again, this is not about judging what you do with yourself but about what message is sent to others by how exactly you convey such stories.
Nobody wants you to hold your tongue, but if you do preach the HR like you say you do, why don't you immediately recognize what is dangerous about such actions right after you post them. Imagine that some random person is looking for information on a compound and ONLY reads one of those posts of yours and chooses a dose based on that. An extreme example, but that could really end badly. In reality I am more concerned about the moral norms set in BL/PD by how much mention of irresponsible drug use is accepted.
This goes 10 times if you want to be a mod for multiple fora no less. That means setting an example sometimes.

3-MeO-PCP and DOC combo?

Both have:
~ 1.5 - 2 hour comeups.
~ 8 - 12 hour durations.

The stimulation and dissociation may balance, while the dopaminergic action at NMDA receptors and whatnot gets the one-teo punch with the serotonin provided by the 5-ht stimulation.

Thoughts?
Dopaminergic action at NMDA receptors? I think you got that wrong, plenty of NMDA antagonists do have dopaminergic action though.

Have you tried these compounds separately, if so how often? The duration is longer than 12 hours... The main effects may last that long but the total duration is extensive.

Both can produce mania which should be related to their dopaminergic action - I think on D2 receptors, NMDA has nothing to do with it and the ligands for that are such things as aspartate and glutamate.
Anyway I think the combo would be a good way to go temporarily crazy with full blown delusions of grandeur level mania.
Why not do some light ketamine use during DOC instead, that should be a lot safer? Even then, don't only use the R-isomer since that can be tricky and unbalanced as well.

If you want monoaminergic actions working together to achieve MDMA-like empathogenic stimulation, combine a dopaminergic agent with a serotonin-releaser yes - but what you suggest is probably not the way. Too much dopaminergic action and not exactly the right kind of serotonergic action.
It may be alright at very low doses, but that is something for people with experience and a lot of self-control.

Find something else please :)
 
Last edited:

afer

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Tried this compound for the first time yesterday in dosage of 4mg, dissolved in ethanol. So did other 2 people - same dose, same setting. All very pleased. It has minimal side effects (yawning, slight jaw tension, negligible nausea, and minor shivering is pretty much all), gives a sane degree of stimulation, is visually spectacular, and leaves you with a relatively clear headspace - an aspect which I particularly enjoyed. Perfect for something like a day-long walk along the seashore or anything else associated with physical activity. Not for indoor research, though - overly "amphy" for that purpose, as I feel it.
Personally enjoyed it very much, highly recommended. It does exactly what is expected and is not physically or mentally demanding.
 

Thanatos

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DOC definitely has the potential to be a gem. The relaxed, opiod/MDXX combo type of euphoria an body high is out of this world.
I can tell the DOC is going to be a real winner once I work my way into the higher doses.

This is uncommon for me, but I have to agree with Shulgin. It truely does seem to be an archetypal psychedelic. It has everything you want in spades.
 

Thanatos

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2.3mg after I allergy tested the other day.
I had mild tachycardia but it wasn't anything bothersome. I'm looking forward to the many years I'll have with this one.
 

《Plasticity》

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What would you rate it on the shulgin scale? That dose would be a bit underwhelming for me so I'm surprised you had a great trip at that dose, I'm sure you'll find more accurately what DOC has to offer at high doses. My next trip is gonna be aMT tommorow but perhaps next weekend I'll set aside some time and go for 4mgs as 3mgs didn't leave a lasting impression on me.
 

Xorkoth

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I like all doses of DOC, even .5mg, as they all eventually lead to the beautiful plateau. That's my experience with it, although all of the parts are more extreme and better with a full dose, and the really small doses don't ever get fully psychedelic.
 

Thanatos

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What would you rate it on the shulgin scale? That dose would be a bit underwhelming for me so I'm surprised you had a great trip at that dose, I'm sure you'll find more accurately what DOC has to offer at high doses. My next trip is gonna be aMT tommorow but perhaps next weekend I'll set aside some time and go for 4mgs as 3mgs didn't leave a lasting impression on me.
I was at a ++ and I insufflated 3mg 5-MeO-MiPT 6 hours or so in and got to a full-roaring ++ bordering on +++ by the end of the peak.
 

《Plasticity》

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I like all doses of DOC, even .5mg, as they all eventually lead to the beautiful plateau. That's my experience with it, although all of the parts are more extreme and better with a full dose, and the really small doses don't ever get fully psychedelic.
It was enjoyable at 3mgs but my trip was VERY different than what others experience, I'm a real phen hardhead though. At three mgs I got ZERO body effects at all, no euphoria, no music appreciation, a tease of a headspace, no stimulation and overall it felt like a really visual 20 hour 2c-c trip, I went into the trip with expectations of something profound after reading the entire v2 DOC thread (probably part of the problem) and was totally let down. I know there's potential in this chem but I think I'm gonna to push the dose to be satisfied as I don't enjoy long lasting underwhelming trips.

I was at a ++ and I insufflated 3mg 5-MeO-MiPT 6 hours or so in and got to a full-roaring ++ bordering on +++ by the end of the peak.
Sounds like fun :). Ooohhh I was just asking xorkoth about chems that go well with moxy because I don't tolerate high doses of 5-meo's very well and was thinking of using it as a booster for other drugs. Any suggestions on what moxy works well with? I've got DOC so how was the synergy between the two?
 

Thanatos

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Their was great synergy between the two compounds. It more or less blended into the DOC trip but gave me some of that twisted tryptamine flavor that really rounded it out.
Lol I kept telling my brother who was tripping with me that I felt like a psychedelic bean bag. I was just soooo relaxed :D
 

《Plasticity》

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Nice, I'll definately give that a try, anything else in particular you find that combines well with moxy? Ever mix it with 4-subs?
 
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