Opioids Suboxone-Making an alcohol based tincture.

[Wishdoctor79]

My only advice is all the stuff I talked about in above posts. Keep me updated on your experience. I'd be curious as to your review of a sub/alcohol mixture

Hey there.

My pleasure.

You might be able to use a lower dose with a tincture, since studies have shown buprenorphine in an alcoholic solution being up to ~40% more potent than the same dose given as a sublingual tablet/film, and lots of people on BL have felt it was subjectively stronger as well. (It's not clear whether the improved bioavailability is just from being in a solution, in which case water would work as well, or if the alcohol content is responsible.) Also, I think most of the absorption is completed pretty quickly with a liquid, and shouldn't require more than a couple of minutes of holding it or swishing it in the mouth.

Jtemperance, do you know the strength of the alcohol solution evaluated there, both the alcohol strength and the buprenorphine strength because both variables would change uptake rates and uptake fractions?

I do remember seeing the bioavailability studies for Suboxone/Subutex but it was 20 years ago when Reckitt got the legal go-ahead for the first Congress-approved drug mandated by law before the filing of a New Drug Application to FDA, a first. Reckitt organized the whole thing through lobbyists pushing the Drug Abuse Control Act (DATA) of 2000, echoing the 30-years prior approval of the methadone maintenance regime authorized by DATA 1970.

CfZrz, Since i only had 52 tabs i didn't want to waste any of them with experiments shooting in the dark on the two strengths absent any knowledge of methodology and the strengths used by Reckitt that supposedly have 40% higher uptake compared to tablets. If you post the study I'll look at it but your situation with the films is complicated by the chemistry of the film itself and how it interacts with the buccal membrane. I can get 16-20 visible chunks plus some powder from one 8/2 tablet but it'd be very difficult to divide a film into that many pieces. But yoy don't and can't know how much of the active ingredients are retained in the sticky goo adhering to all the surfaces it contacts as you prepare and administer that solution. You can't know how much you're "wasting" by washing it down the drain.

Grinding tablets to powder and dissolving in water/EtOH wastes some of the source material. Reckitt didn't dissolve Suboxone tablets in H2O/EtOH, they used buprenorphine HCl. I don't know how much of the buprenorphine would be retained in the sludge of dissolved tablets and how much is retained in any filter. I don't know the relative retention or loss of the naloxone versus the buprenorphine, and Reckitt's studies on uptake didn't have any naloxone in the solutions. It's just way too many unknowns.

Taking the little crumbs and having one 8/2 tablet last me three or four days is working just fine. I have consistently more energy every day and so I've postponed my anticipated visits to the vicinity of my old methadone clinic. While the going rate there used to be 20 cents/mg it's surely now going as low or maybe even lower than 10 cents/mg because of the economic suicide of this country from the corona-phobia coup engineered by the fake news media.

 

[CfZrx]

Hey there.


Jtemperance, do you know the strength of the alcohol solution evaluated there, both the alcohol strength and the buprenorphine strength because both variables would change uptake rates and uptake fractions?

I do remember seeing the bioavailability studies for Suboxone/Subutex but it was 20 years ago when Reckitt got the legal go-ahead for the first Congress-approved drug mandated by law before the filing of a New Drug Application to FDA, a first. Reckitt organized the whole thing through lobbyists pushing the Drug Abuse Control Act (DATA) of 2000, echoing the 30-years prior approval of the methadone maintenance regime authorized by DATA 1970.

CfZrz, Since i only had 52 tabs i didn't want to waste any of them with experiments shooting in the dark on the two strengths absent any knowledge of methodology and the strengths used by Reckitt that supposedly have 40% higher uptake compared to tablets. If you post the study I'll look at it but your situation with the films is complicated by the chemistry of the film itself and how it interacts with the buccal membrane. I can get 16-20 visible chunks plus some powder from one 8/2 tablet but it'd be very difficult to divide a film into that many pieces. But yoy don't and can't know how much of the active ingredients are retained in the sticky goo adhering to all the surfaces it contacts as you prepare and administer that solution. You can't know how much you're "wasting" by washing it down the drain.

Grinding tablets to powder and dissolving in water/EtOH wastes some of the source material. Reckitt didn't dissolve Suboxone tablets in H2O/EtOH, they used buprenorphine HCl. I don't know how much of the buprenorphine would be retained in the sludge of dissolved tablets and how much is retained in any filter. I don't know the relative retention or loss of the naloxone versus the buprenorphine, and Reckitt's studies on uptake didn't have any naloxone in the solutions. It's just way too many unknowns.

Taking the little crumbs and having one 8/2 tablet last me three or four days is working just fine. I have consistently more energy every day and so I've postponed my anticipated visits to the vicinity of my old methadone clinic. While the going rate there used to be 20 cents/mg it's surely now going as low or maybe even lower than 10 cents/mg because of the economic suicide of this country from the corona-phobia coup engineered by the fake news media.

I think the extreme potency of bupe makes a lot of the unknown variables, like how much gets lost in tablet sludge, kind of irrelevant. I find that bupe has a certain high, and once you set your baseline tolerance, it has that bupe kind of mini-buzz. If you take more than your baseline dose you enter the next and presumably last type of bupe high which is when you have a lot of energy and feel mildly, but solidly euphoric for a very long time. So I guess the best thing to do is lower your tolerance to like idk, 4 mg/day. Im kind of stuck at 8, but can see myself dropping to 6 this next month SHit, then 10 mg one day would almost be 100% stronger!!!

 

[ryax]

for sure, the lower you go, the stronger the effects
only problem with suboxone and low dose , is redosing
you need to wait about a hour or a hour and a half before even attempting to redose. if you have abupe buzz, taking more will only send you to a very hard nodland. if you dont have the bupe buzz, taking a bit more is risky but , sometimes just a crumb will set it off

with a 8mg suboxone strip, only 1.6mg of bupe is actually being absorbed.

 

[CfZrx]

with a 8mg suboxone strip, only 1.6mg of bupe is actually being absorbed.

Yes, or if you use alcohol to inflame the capillaries or veins or whatever it is in your mouth, we could see that number bump up to maybe as high as 3mg absorbed from an 8mg strip.

I'm curious, if you take the whole 8 every morning, does the buzz last all day? 6 hours? I find that broken into 2mg doses, the buzz can last all day if you are feeling good otherwise, like good sleep, eating well drinking plenty of H2o.