Stopping Effexor xr the day before exctasy

[kpx2200]

I have read a bunch of threads about the safety of exctasy and effexor xr and the possible complications such as seritonin syndrome. I have also heard sometimes it stops the MDMA from working almost completly. I myself experienced this. I have never read any threads about a strategy that I think might work. I'm wondering if this makes sense scientifically.

My question is can I stop taking effexor a day and a half before taking the E? I am hoping that the massive release of serotonin/dopamine will prevent the withdrawl symptoms associated. For anyone that doesnt know stopping effexor suddenly can cause severe withdrawl symptoms. I have forgotten to take it in the past and the withdrawl symptoms for me usually dont set in until close to two days after missing.

I have taken effexor xr and extacy before and felt almost nothing happen.
I want this to be the best concert of my life. You know, have one of those experiences that everyone talks about. The exctasy not working is my main concern because it seems stupid to go through all the risk of mixing and have nothing happen.


Strategy:

Im taking it for a concert and would have 3 effexor xr in my pocket.

Step 1: I would probably take the MDMA/Exctasy around 7:30PM.

Step 2: Right after the encore around 11PM I would pop one 75mg effexor pill.

Step 3: I would then pop the other two in two hour increments of 1AM and 3AM.

Step 4:The next day I would take my regular dose of 225mg effexor xr at around 1-2PM like usual.

Since effexor has such a short half life the levels should have started to fall dramatically by 730PM night of the concert thus reducing seritonin syndrome risk but more importantly allow me to feel the full effects of the exctasy. Taking the effexor after the concert in three hour increments should help reduce the neurotoxicity and at the same time reduce the chances of serotonin syndrome . The X should be mostly out of my system by 3AM.

From my past experience there is at least 24 hours between missing a dose of effexor xr and withdrawl symptoms.

What do you guys think of this plan? Are there any flaws in it?

 

[kpx2200]

I'm sorry. I posted this in the wrong fourm. I found this helpful website through a google search. I diddnt realize this was a region specific fourm. I'm reposting in the exctasy fourm. Moderators sorry for the confusion and please delete. Thanks

 

[belarki]

OMFG don't stop taking effexor suddenly! You'll regret it once the withdrawl symptoms kick into full swing 12 hours after you miss a dose....

You're not at much risk of serotonin syndrome combining 225mg venlafaxine and mdma, as you mentioned it'll just completely kill the mdma experience. Just don't bother. It's not worth it, why wreck a perfectly good concert by a) having to deal with effexor withdrawl and b) being dissapointed that the pills you ate aren't working?

Have a beer instead and enjoy the music

 

[warpion0]

NO NO NO NO NO. You need to wait at least 2 weeks and usually more like 6 after coming off the effexor before you'll actually be able to fully experience the effects of MDMA.

What will happen is you'll get the electric shocks / other shitty withdrawal symptoms, you'll feel like crap, and you'll get just as much nothingness out of the pills.

 

[filenet]

seriously listen to belarki - some peeps take 6 months to wean off this horrible AD!

 

[Smoifer]

Can tell you from first hand experience, NO it won't work. It took me 3-4 weeks to roll after i stopped Effexor XR cold turkey and even then it was a half arsed roll off what were the best pills in Melbourne at the time. It's not worth the withdrawl and waste of a flipper.

 

[Mr Blonde]

Unfortunately, as others have pointed out this is not going to work. Depending on how long you have been taking it, it's going to still be in your blood system and besides that taking serotonin-norepinephrine medication causes changes to your receptors (down-regulation) that can take weeks or even months to be normalized.

 

[fortehlulz]

My partner accidentally forgot to take her Effexor XR two days in a row. The second night was not pleasant - her mood was through the floor and when we crashed, it was an evening beset by hardcore night terrors.

I strongly suggest you don't omit your anti depression medication in favour of biccies (or for that matter, anything really), its not worth it.

 

[kpx2200]

I posted this in the extasy forum but since you all took time to awnser in here, I thought id post it here also.

Thank you for all the concern and advice. I have done some more research and am putting it in this thread so that other people can find it/ argue and correct my findings. It took me a long time to find any info NOT related solely to SSRI/SNRI + MDMA seritonin syndrome.

Do you think there could be even a 5-7% increase in the effectivness of the MDMA if I am off the effoxor for only a day?

Just to clarify, I am not "just stopping" the effexor xr. I have routinely gone upwards of 2 and a quarter days before I remember to take my effexor. What usually reminds me is a slight headache and some dizziness which I know is associated with the beggining of a withdrawl. I pop my dose and 40 mins later im fine.

My plan is to set my alarm and take my effexor Friday at 430AM. The concert is on Sat at 8:30. I will take effexor in my pocket and if I feel any sort of serious withdrawl coming on before 7:45 I will not take the E and pop the effexor. If everything goes smoothly though, ill pop the E at 7:50. Then at 12:50 i'll take 1 75mg of effexor followed by another 2 in 2 hour increments. Therefore I will only be technically off the once daily effexor xr for 20 hours. For me this is not long enough to bring on a withdrawl.



I don't see seritonin syndrome to be a huge factor because, and im quoting another thread,
-"It's not the SSRI vacation, nor taking MDMA during an SSRI vacation that is the problem. It is the temptation to take a large dose of MDMA which is the real issue. And, just like being numb and burning yourself without knowing it, you can over do the MDMA dose thus leaving yourself open to neurological harm without even being aware of what is going on. Many folks will increase their MDMA intake to compensate for the muted roll. This is not a good thing to do because even though the receptors are not responsive, the MDMA still has an affinity for them (leaving them open to potential damage)."

I am strictly limiting myself to one pill and based on the short half life inherint of effexor it will be out of my system for that brief period and my actual seritonin levels will be within an acceptable risk range. Obviously elevated due to the X though. If you are the type to get really messed up, blackout and take more and more pills to get higher and higher then obviously the risk for seritonin syndrome is severe. In my case I see this as a non-issue.


The main problem with my plan as Warpion0 has pointed out is that it does take weeks for you to feel MDMA fully. -The reason for this is, "the serotonin receptors down regulate as a result of being inactive while on an SSRI. It could take weeks or even months for them to become fully engaged (up regulated) again. The result of taking MDMA during this time of readjustment is pretty much like taking MDMA while also on the SSRI (the receptors do not respond, and the roll is greatly muted)."


Exctasy aside, there seems to be a lot of misconceptions in terms of seritonin syndrome and lee way. I know many people who are perscribed 300mg of effexor xr 70mg vyvanse (adderall like stimulant) and a booster of Adderall XR plus busiprone as needed for anxiety. All of these drugs greatly increase the amount of seritonin in the brain. Seritonin syndrom like the flu can range from a slight headache and diziness to full on death if not treated with antiseritonigistic and benzo drugs. It is a serious risk with extasy however because the dosing, mixture, and potency are not regulated as strictly as pharmacuticals.

 

[Crankinit]

The point is that it just plain won't work. You'll go to a lot of effort and waste your pingers only to be dissapointed. Just go and have fun, smoke a little weed and have some beers maybe, you shouldn't need to be rolling to have an awesome time if it's a great concert.

 

[Mr Blonde]

Many folks will increase their MDMA intake to compensate for the muted roll. This is not a good thing to do because even though the receptors are not responsive, the MDMA still has an affinity for them (leaving them open to potential damage)."

The research I've seen points to the main neurotoxic factor with MDMA consumption being dopamine and it being metabolized by the wrong MAO (MAO-A perhaps?) leading to it becoming a super-oxidative compound; not MDMA binding to actual serotonin receptors.

The reason for this is, "the serotonin receptors down regulate as a result of being inactive while on an SSRI. It could take weeks or even months for them to become fully engaged (up regulated) again. The result of taking MDMA during this time of readjustment is pretty much like taking MDMA while also on the SSRI (the receptors do not respond, and the roll is greatly muted)."

Ok I have to correct this misinformation as well. Using MDMA whilst on an SSRI does not work because SSRIs bind to the serotonin transporters with a greater affinity then MDMA does. MDMA works by binding to the transporters and reversing them, flooding the synapse with serotonin. An SSRI works by blocking these transporters so serotonin cannot be taken out of the synapse.

Yes, serotonin receptors are down-regulated during the course of treatment with an SSRI. This is not because the SSRI binds directly to them, but because serotonin is hanging around in the synapse longer and therefore binding more often to the receptors, leading to down-regulation.

I know many people who are perscribed 300mg of effexor xr 70mg vyvanse (adderall like stimulant) and a booster of Adderall XR plus busiprone as needed for anxiety. All of these drugs greatly increase the amount of seritonin in the brain.

An SSRI plus amphetamines and buspirone doesn't have the risk of serotonin syndrome that you seem to think it does. Yes, amphetamines act somewhat on serotonin but not to a great extent and their main action comes from their effects on dopamine and norepinephrine. Besides which, amphetamines release dopamine and serotonin in the same way MDMA do (reversing transporters), so using an amphetamine with an SSRI is going to lead to zero release of serotonin.

I hope this all makes sense to you.