Some interesting dissociatives... 3-MeO-2'-Oxo-PCPy and 3-MeO-2'-Oxo-PCPr

ProbablyTrouble

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I have been playing around with some disso molecules and stumbled upon these two...

Looking at their chemical structure, it is VERY obvious that they're nearly identical to MXE:
3-MeO-2'-Oxo-PCPy
3-MeO-2'-Oxo-PCPr

Understanding that there are a lot of people interested in Rolicyclidine, and the potential for it's 3-MeO substitution, I think that there should be some investigation into these two.
Personally, I believe 3-MeO-2'-Oxo-PCPr will hold more promise, but I can't know until it's been synthesized. Both are SO close to the structure of MXE...

I would love to hear your opinions.
 

FormerBeagle

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Its been many years since I was involved with these kinds of compounds, but I was heavily invested in them at one point. Why is there interest in the 3-MeO analogs in particular? I can tell you that the 4-MeO pyrrolidine derivative lacking the 2' keto group is definitely active.
 

Dresden

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From what I understand, pyrrolidinyl pcp like dissos are not optimal.
 

FormerBeagle

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This is not my experience. Pyrrolidine substitution give quite active and interesting compounds, at least in some series. Not certain about the title compounds of this thread, but I have no reason to think they would lack activity.
 

ProbablyTrouble

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Its been many years since I was involved with these kinds of compounds, but I was heavily invested in them at one point. Why is there interest in the 3-MeO analogs in particular? I can tell you that the 4-MeO pyrrolidine derivative lacking the 2' keto group is definitely active.
There was a very brief period in 2014 where 3-meo-pcpy, pcpr, and pcmo were being produced. the only reason I can see that they didn't gain any foothold was that they were less ideal than 3-meo-pce and pcp.

However, I am not so concerned with those, but rather the as-yet unsynthesized 3-MeO-2'-Oxo-PCPy and 3-MeO-2'-Oxo-PCPr analogs. Granted, this is simply based on their similarity to MXE, but quite a similarity it is.
 
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FormerBeagle

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What are pcpr and pcmo? Propylamine and morpholine derivatives? If that is the case, definitely not optimum substituents.
 

Xorkoth

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I remember the PCMo, if I recall it wasn't too exciting or potent. Yeah the Mo is the morpholine.

I've been curious about these near-MXE analogues since I heard mention they might be produced. MXE, to me, is the ideal dissociative, such a fantastic drug.

Someone was also talking about 3-HO-2'-oxo-PCE
 

Xorkoth

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I have not tried PCP (only 3-MeO and 3-HO-PCP), but yes I prefer MXE to ketamine by far (and also to the PCP analogues I mentioned, and also to 2'-oxo-PCM and 2'-oxo-PCE, and 2f-DCK). It's just a really versatile drug that produces in me a feeling of magic unlike anything else. At low doses it's functional, at moderate doses it makes for the best wonky night with friends, and in high doses it's great for going into a hole. A few times I received spontaneous knowledge about how to do something I'd never learned before which I later verified which was really strange and cool. IMy friends and I would do it together and we all agreed it produces the best "flow state", where you can almost seem to predict what's about to happen. It's hard to describe but it feels magical. I could measurably jump higher on it too (not on hole doses obviously). It's rather psychedelic and dissociative at the same time and the euphoria is unparalleled in any other disso I've tried. The first time I holed on it was one of the most profound experiences of my life. Oral is the best route, nasal lacks something and feels weaker and I've IMed it but still prefer oral. It's just absolutely lovely, and I miss it. I could take or leave dissos in general these days but I miss MXE specifically.
 

sekio

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"Methoxpromine" (or maybe "methoxpropamine") would presumably be a nice substitute for MXE, as it's just 1 CH₂ group extra. It should be equal or slightly lesser in potency to MXE with maybe slightly longer duration thanks to increased logP.

i don't think the 2'-keto-PCP, 2'-keto-PCMo or 2'-keto-PCPy class have been looked into yet but they'd surely be a fertile ground to explore. If memory serves, PCPy is more sedating than PCP but still active as a dissoviative, but I don't know if it'd be the same for its substituted derivs.
 

FormerBeagle

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I have not tried PCP (only 3-MeO and 3-HO-PCP)
What did you find to be the difference in these?

If memory serves, PCPy is more sedating than PCP but still active as a dissoviative, but I don't know if it'd be the same for its substituted derivs.
I did not find PCPy and PCP to be substantially different. The pyrrolidine compound may have shorter effects, but I did not find it to be any more sedating. Unbelievably euphoric substances, but hazardous in the extreme to my personal biochemistry. I agree, 2'-keto would be interesting indeed to explore.
 

ProbablyTrouble

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Well! What a resplendent foray into this abyss I seem to have eschewed!


But To the point- Would anyone be interested in the development of the Glutamine bacbone of this natty duggout?
 

FormerBeagle

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Has this one been thought of lately?
Undoubtably active. I have a personal aversion to the N-ethyl, based on my unpleasant experience with PCE. But from what I am hearing about MXE, it might be worthwhile.

Well! What a resplendent foray into this abyss I seem to have eschewed!
But To the point- Would anyone be interested in the development of the Glutamine bacbone of this natty duggout?
Well, whatever you are smoking does seem to have interesting effects on syntax. Or maybe my hip-cred is hopelessly out of date.
 

Xorkoth

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What did you find to be the difference in these?
3-MeO-PCP is very psychological and it bends my thought process in ways I do not fully recognize. It's quite stimulating and it produces hypomania which can lead to mania and paranoia (I have never gone there but oh man have I seen some bad cases with this drug). It's energetic and can be pretty edgy and you'll look back and find your behavior to have been way out of the ordinary. In small doses (~2mg) with several hours between is the only way I've been able to really get reliably rewarding effects from it. For a time, I would use it to go out to shows and stuff, it filled the same role as a stimulant without the side effects. However I don't really care for it much anymore, it's the one I've done most of all the dissos because I found it pretty compulsive during the time I used it (a 2 or so year period).

3-HO-PCP is more sedating, much calmer and more centering, not as reinforcing. I still enjoy it. It leaves your judgment more intact and also seems to go deeper into something real, whereas 3-MeO-PCP warps your perception of what's real and feeds you delusions.

Undoubtably active. I have a personal aversion to the N-ethyl, based on my unpleasant experience with PCE.
I've always wanted to try PCE because all my favorite dissociatives are PCE based (MXE is by far the king, followed by 3-MeO-PCE which is like the centering, warm empathogenic part of MXE without the wonkiness and magic).
 

FormerBeagle

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I have asked about a custom synthesis
Thats awesome, I look forward to hearing a report!

3-MeO-PCP is very psychological and it bends my thought process in ways I do not fully recognize.

... and you'll look back and find your behavior to have been way out of the ordinary.
Man, that hits the nail on the head for me. The perceptual alteration of these drugs was so incredibly alluring to me, but they really distorted my subjective reality in a way that made it hard to live with what I think of now as a more objective reality. Its a mixture of subtlety that is hard to recognize at the moment and profound blenderizing of thought process that can be really hard to wrap your mind around. It has taken a decade or more of hindsight to come to the conclusion that these are a dangerous spiritual dead end for me. Really glad that others are exploring this class of compounds. I'll probably never go anywhere near them again without medical supervision.
 

Xorkoth

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I think using dissociatives for spiritual purposes is an extremely slippery slope which might be possible with occasional use of certain ones, but with regular use, is never a good idea. It leads consistently to a delusional place that feels to you like it's important and spiritual.
 

AutoTripper

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I think I just found an oppirtunity to obtain some 3 Meo PCP. Affordable to for a 0.5 or gram.
One attraction is as an altrenative to lysergamides and tryptamines, without the cross-tolerance factor, to experience recreationally and therapeutically in between trips.

I just heard how the Dutch Government are going to attempt to blanket ban ALL research chemicals, just as Gernany is doing right now.

So I was doing some scouring in case I want to get some more 1plsd or Ald-52, more than partly for microdosing purposes in the future due to knowing the exact dose.

The Dutch site I stumbled on has the 3 Meo. If I get the 1plsd from them, I imagine I will get some 3-Meo too. Unless someone wishes to disuade me otherwise?

Im not looking to abuse it, just a bit of harmless fun to add to an array of compounds to mix and match in moderation. I desperately need sone fun, relaxation, enjoyment, excitement, and essentially emotional and trauma release and healing from years of illness, trauma and stress.

I already have 1plsd, Ald-52, Lsd 25, 4-Ho-Mipt, 2 MDMA pills.

I might have some nn DMT too if a package gets to me safe and sound. With a sample of 5 Meo Dmt and option of more.

And I have the opportunity to get some 4-Aco-Dmt now too. I dont need a lot more, but variety is the key right?
I am tempted to add some 4-Aco. Heard so many good things about it. I would be more sure if I didnt already have the Miprocin.

But they are still different enough to each other I believe.
But the 3 Meo PCP is totally different. I would hope to use it recreationally, occasionally, just to relax, let my hair down etc, without so many strings attached as with the psychedelics.
Such a type of experience and usage would be incredibly therapeutic to me just to help me relax in life. I suffer unbearable stress and anxiety and physical discomfort everyday with little fun and that does more harm to one's psyche than anything when it is a permanent way of existence.

To break out of this, for any amount of time can be beneficial as long as the side effects or consequences do not outweigh the benefits.

Any thoughts massively appreciated thanks in advance anybody.
 
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FormerBeagle

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It is a nice little stash you describe, and the pcp derivative definitely helps round it out in terms of diversity.

I imagine I will get some 3-Meo too. Unless someone wishes to disuade me otherwise?
I’m not going to try to dissuade you. Everyone is different. And your individual biochemistry and life situation will dictate your response to these drugs.

Im not looking to abuse it, just a bit of harmless fun to add to an array of compounds to mix and match in moderation.
That’s weird. I feel like I am reading an echo of my voice from the ghost of Christmas past. I’m not sure of your experience with this class of drugs (the pcp derivatives), but I hope you understand the potential hazards of experimenting with them. I have no concerns about the other drugs.

I suffer unbearable stress and anxiety and physical discomfort everyday with little fun and that does more harm to one's psyche than anything when it is a permanent way of existence.

To break out of this, for any amount of time can be beneficial as long as the side effects or consequences do not outweigh the benefits.
I hope you have or might consider competent medical professional help for your physical/psychic distress. My concern from what you describe is that you feel like you need some escape. Nothing wrong with that. I needed some too, and found more escape than I could handle. Again, everyone is different and you may be fine. But some experiences you never really come back from in the same way. I was an evangelist for pcp relatives at one point, but would never want anyone to get into them that is not fully informed. Good Luck!
 
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AutoTripper

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It is a nice little stash you describe, and the pcp derivative definitely helps round it out in terms of diversity.



I’m not going to try to dissuade you. Everyone is different. And your individual biochemistry and life situation will dictate your response to these drugs.



That’s weird. I feel like I am reading an echo of my voice from the ghost of Christmas past. I’m not sure of your experience with this class of drugs (the pcp derivatives), but I hope you understand the potential hazards of experimenting with them. I have no concerns about the other drugs.



I hope you have or might consider competent medical professional help for your physical/psychic distress. My concern from what you describe is that you feel like you need some escape. Nothing wrong with that. I needed some too, and found more escape than I could handle. Again, everyone is different and you may be fine. But some experiences you never really come back from in the same way. I was an evangelist for pcp relatives at one point, but would never want anyone to get into them that is not fully informed. Good Luck!
Hello, thanks very much for your thoughts and experience. I think I perhaps should have elaborated a little, I feel I may have given an inaccurate impression.

I'm not simply in a reckless and foolhardy or kamikaze frame of mind as I can see it may come across. My thinking is very rational and calculated and I very deeply consider all of my actions in life with regards to the consequences, with a beneficial outcome always as the primary aim.

And It isnt exactly that I am looking for escape. Just- something different, anything different to shake things up a change of scenery, looking at things from a different angle essentially. Something more fun and interesting. Without even getting too deep into it or letting it get its hooks into me so much by being kind of consciously detached from it.

To put things in better context I developed lyme disease in 2005 which completely destroyed my life and I have been allergic to practically everything ever since with such a compromised immune system that I'm spending all of my energy and time battling multiple chronic infections in my respiratory system.

My allergy symptoms are incredibly extreme and I spend 7 to 8 hours a day managing and clearing excessive mucus from my lungs. My immune system is abnormally over reactive to everyday harmless foods and virtually all supplements, herbs etc.

It's a very complex situation all round and I have done incredibly well to live and cope with the symptoms and learn so much about my own body and condition and health matters in general.

The infection which caused my lyme disease was actually cleared several years ago now but correcting the "immune and nervous system dysregulation", which is essentially what lyme disease is, has so far proved impossible for me especially due to the fact that I am severely intolerance to virtually all supplements and therefore unable to follow any sort of comprehensive recovery program which is essential to restore balance after Lyme disease.

It's really been Catch 22 where all I can do is manage the best I can and be thankful for each day, one day at a time.

Due to my extreme over reactivity to everything I consume food wise and my 100-percent super restricted home-cooked diet which I cannot deviate from at all or suffer too much to be worthwhile, life has been so monotomous. For example there are only two types of herbal tea I can tolerate currently that I am aware of after 14 years of trying everything and anything- chamomile and nettle tea and I don't enjoy either of those apart from that plain water is the only thing I can drink.

All of the foods and drinks I dearly love I'm unable to tolerate at all, I experience abnormal excessive mucus production in my lungs and Airways which is unbearable when I ingest the things I must avoid. Like all of the amazing natural herbal remedies and supplements out there which could rebalance my system and combat my infections.

So life has just been incredibly dull and grinding. With so much trauma and negative conditioning having occurred over recent years. My depression and anxiety has been so severe coupled with extreme physical suffering that there has been no point to my existence.

I have not giving up and remain resolute but I decided several months ago that it may be worth me exploring psychedelics which I have used extensively in my past before my illness came in 2005 but I have only used cannabis since then except for 72 LSD blotters in 2011/12.

So I acquired the above mentioned psyches. I tripped 3 times on 1plsd over 3 months ago but I have not been physically well enough to approach the tripping since then due to such severe physical discomfort and exhaustion from sleep deprivation. I desperately need the therapy of hallucinogens and I know what I'm doing and adamant it will help me release so much negative conditioning, thought patterns and deep emotional blockages which will be preventing progress and healing on the physical level.

Regarding the dissacociatives, I used lots of ketamine, heavily in combo with other psyches. I am pretty head strong and stable in my own reality. I'll be honest I have never studied this class of drugs at all and know nothing about them except for my experiences with ketamine between 2002 and 2005.

But in light of my general situation I have a strong feeling that a compound like 3 meo PCP could be very therapeutic for me, as something different, hopefully something fun to take my mind off of things and make a change without being such a commitment as a full trip.

I was looking at the various benzodiazepine blotters available but I do not really want to get into that class of drugs because I feel the physical side effects would be a negative thing.

I'm hoping that the 3 meo PCP could be used occasionally recreationally without necessarily having such a negative physical imprint on the body but I may be mistaken about this.

I trust myself not to let a substance throw me off the rails because I have to work so incredibly hard to manage my condition to keep life livable.
I hope that makes my position and intentions and needs a little clearer.

Thank you very much again for your advice and wishing you a splendid weekend.
 
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