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Nolvadex

PuLsER

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 8, 2003
Messages
211
Hi, thinking of doing my first ever cycle of roids. Just wondering how essential nolvadex is in preventing some of the unwanted negative side effects that result from steroid use??

My cycle will consist of sustanon and anadrol. Clomid will be utilised in my post cycle.

Not really all that loaded at the moment (dont have much money) so i just wanna know whether it is important to purchase nolvadex or not?

Ta fellas!
 

5alphareductase

Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 25, 2004
Messages
964
At the very least, you should have nolvadex, although it would be better to have an anti aromotase like arimidex, femara, or aromasin. If you want to save money, you can use the nolvadex in place of clomid post cycle and it will be just as good.

Not to be a dick or anything but sustanon and anadrol are both poor choices for a first cycle. Anadrol makes a lot of people lose their appetite, and you dont want that on a bulking cycle, and sustanon will cause so many peaks and crashes in your testosterone level, and waiting 3 weeks for it to build up to good plasma blood levels and waiting 3 weeks for it to leave the body just mean 6 weeks are basically wasted. Sustanon is also compareitively expensive and faked a lot more than just a good quality one ester test like ICN test enanthate or schering primoteston. If you go in to a cycle with test and anadrol, which can both cause problems with estrogen and/or progesterone, without something stronger than nolvadex, it is stupid in my opinion. You have no idea how much estrogen you will produce, and if it is a lot, you should have an anti aromotase on hand. People bitch about how expensive they are, but they are much cheaper than gyno surgery.
 

ImperialAussie

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Jul 27, 2004
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Location
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Take 5alpa advise, for a first cycle Sus and Anadrol is not a very good decision.

Just run a single ester like enanthate with some eq, u will be so much better off with a cycle like that.

You will definatley need some nolva if using sus and drol, its not worth the risk without it.
 

PuLsER

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 8, 2003
Messages
211
oi thanks very much for the advice, it'll deffo be taken on board!

so you both recommend a single ester! With this being the case is it still important to purchase Nolvadex. If so could this be used in replace of clomid?

Initially with the sust and anadrol i calculated a fairly inexpensive cycle, are you saying that a cycle with a single ester could be even cheaper? I'll be stoked if it is coz unfortunately i aint all that loaded at the moment!

Sorry if i'm being repetative but it's better to be safe than sorry and i do want my first cycle to be a success!

Cheers ;)
 
Last edited:

5alphareductase

Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 25, 2004
Messages
964
I would rather answer tons of questions that to have someone fuck themselves up with a porrly planned cycle, so ask all the questions you want.

In general, one ester test products are cheaper than sustanon, or very close in price. I feel that they are of better quality for our purposes as well. Since sustanon has 4 test esters that are designed to peak at different times, you will have daily up and down cycles of test in your body, and that will cause side effects. If possible, you want a nice constant high level of test in the body, with very little crashes or peaks.

Listen to this advice because this is very important, but you will ALWAYS need to have anti estrogens on hand, no matter what cycle you do. Even if you use something like tren and winstrol, which both cant aromotize to estrogen, you will still need nolvadex (or clomid) for the post cycle. I think that nolvadex is better because it is very comparable to clomid in its effectiveness to restore the HPTA, and it is a much better anti estrogen than clomid. Nolvadex also has much less side effects that clomid, which is always good.

I might be in the minority here, but I also always recommend that you have an anti aromotase like arimidex, femara, or aromasin for your cycle as well. Especially for a first cycle, you have no idea how much estrogen you will produce, and nolvadex will block the receptor, but estrogen still has non receptor mediated effects (like some steroids) so just blocking it isnt as good as stopping it from being produced as much as possible. You can stop much estrogen from being produced by using an anti aromotase. The anti aromotases arent cheap, but it is better to save for 6 months and to get them, then to not have them and find out that your produce lots of estrogen and dont have anything to combat it well.

For a first cycle I would recommend going with 1 or 2 of the following drugs, plus test.

500mg test a week (one ester product like prop, cyp, or enanthate)

then 1 or 2 of the following
25mg dianabol a day for the first four weeks
400mg equipoise a week

I would go with one of the two drugs, plus test, probably equipoise, and then save the dianabol for next cycle, but it is up to you. I would go with this cycle for 8 weeks, then start nolvadex post cycle on week 10, as it will take at least two weeks (and maybe three) for the equipoise and test to get down to non supressive levels where the HPTA can be restored.
 

Sphinx

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Nov 8, 2002
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Single ester is cheaper than human grade sustanon.

I dont see whats wrong with a sust/drol cycle, 90% of users started off their careers with a sust/dbol cycle... and why would a single long ester such as ICN offer any benefit over a mixed ester? I mean ICN is still gonna take 3+ weeks to take effect and take 3 weeks to leave the body so your still having those 6 weeks gone, at least sustanon has short esters so you also get the instan benefit from them as opposed to just a single long ester...
 

5alphareductase

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Feb 25, 2004
Messages
964
Assuming two shots a week, sustanon is only giving 60mg of prop and that wont do anything except shut down the HPTA. I dont like sustanon because of the peaks and crashes that you have in blood levels of test because of the different esters.
 

Sphinx

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True that. Ive never been a fan of mixed esters (nor long esters really) but I know alot of people who swear by sustanon as if its some sort of god-send, not to mention sustanon is the easiest human grade steroid to get your hands on except maybe nappies.
 

PuLsER

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 8, 2003
Messages
211
riteo..heres the deal, im gonna follow ur advice 5alpha.

500mg test a week (will see what test i can get my hands on)
400 mg equipoise a week

The cycle will last 8 weeks and then on week 10 i will start using Nolvadex.

With this type of cycle what kind of gains could i come to expect?
More than likely will this cycle end up costing less than my original cycle?

once again ta for the advice!!!!!!
 

5alphareductase

Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 25, 2004
Messages
964
It is really impossible to guess what you will gain during your cycle, as that is very individual. I think if you follow a good bulking diet with plenty of protein, and train well, you will be happy with your gains.

Be sure that you have at least nolvadex during the cycle, in case you feel itchy nipples, which is one of the first signs of gyno, so you can take it and stop the estrogen from binding.

Again, I will say this because it is important. I would get one of the anti aromotases that I mentioned, as they deal with estrogen much better than nolvdex. They will stop it from being produced while nolvadex just blocks estrogen from binding with the receptor.
 

Dr. McBudstoke

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Joined
Mar 5, 2004
Messages
2,851
i would spring for some letrazole, liquid letrazole isn't scheduled in the US and can be obtained through various online suppliers.
 

ImperialAussie

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Jul 27, 2004
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40
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Hey mate, good to see you have taken 5alpa advise. A single ester is a much better choice as your blood levels will be alot more stable. Also orals are not needed in a first cycle, leave them for later cycle's when your more experienced. Also make sure you get some nolva.

As for what gains you can expect, it is entirely up to you, if your diet is good (loads of protein) and training is spot on, as well as getting plentey of water and sleep. Then you will be very happy with your gains. Just remember if you dont eat you wont grow, its as simple as that.
 

Powder_Sports

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 28, 2003
Messages
177
Always have nolva on hand, it can stop gyno in its tracks and reverse lumps if caught early, without the nolva or other ancilliries on hand you could be in for some trouble.

First cycle stick to single ester such as Test E, as then if sides do occur you know where exactly they came from and how to treat accordingly.
First signs of gyno to nolva at 40 - 60mg per day for 1 week and taper from there down.
 

PuLsER

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 8, 2003
Messages
211
cheers fellas...gonna wait a little while until i have more money so i can afford a decent anti aromotase.

i wanna make sure everything is done properly to avoid complications

will keep u updated with how things are travelling!
 

ImperialAussie

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Jul 27, 2004
Messages
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Location
Australia
Good to hear Pulser. You will appreciate it when you start the cycle later and everything has been planned 100% and no stone has been left unturned.
 
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