NEWS: Herald-Sun 18 Jan 05: Ecstasy explosion fear

[phase_dancer]

Well if you think legalizing will fix all, you're dreaming.

For a start, there will NEVER be legislation which allows open sales like tobacco and alcohol. At the very least, a buyer would be required to sign for what is purchased/ requested.

Let's look at prescription pharmaceuticals, which is the sort of regulation category that would be placed on MDMA should it ever become a 'legal' drug.

Currently, if you are prescribed particularly high amounts of a drug with abuse potential, it doesn't take long before someone is asking questions. Questions about your lifestyle, your problems etc. There is then potential for some government authority to prevent, restrict or control your drug allowance.

So would the majority of users popping 4 pills a weekend suddenly be prepared to have their use monitored, or even limited to 2 pills a month? Unlikely.

So IMO there'll always be an underground market for drugs; Those who always hoped for a "society gone wild" approach to legislation, rather than the inevitable health prioritized system which brings with it the less than appealing opportunitiy for authorities to monitor, check and control the lives of users.


Ya can't have ya cake....

 

[Sketchwreck]

From my own experience (having seen a few backyard labs) most pills in Australia are either 100% made in Australia (now theres a logo for the other thread) or imported from SE Asia in powder form and pressed in backyard labs.
Very little of Australian MDMA arrives on the docks in pill form 'import pills' is simply a marketing strategy 'if its imported it must be better'.

As far as the hygene goes it's not white coats and sterile rooms but its better than most restaurants. Again this is all from my experience.

 

[Doooofus]

Originally posted by Sketchwreck
As far as the hygene goes it's not white coats and sterile rooms but its better than most restaurants. Again this is all from my experience.

Hehe, just think of what goes into a typical frozen meat pie and suddenly aluminium foil in a dirty pill starts to sound appetising

 

[Bent]

but its better than most restaurants.

That ain't hard. Having worked in the game for years and having seen the backend of many a restaurant (including some of the finest in Australia) you'd be horrified if you knew what was going on...and you sure as hell wouldn't eat out again!

 

[Special-T.B.K]

well I know it will Never actually happen, but. They could at least Legalise Marijuana!

I mean it is already a prescription drug and it for sure wouldn't hurt. Ban ciggies and legalize buds. Make Joints instead of smokes. The government could own the crops that grow it. It's BILLIONS the government could make and It would get rid of the Marijuana Black market!

SpecTBK

 

[deano]

As far as the hygene goes it's not white coats and sterile rooms but its better than most restaurants. Again this is all from my experience.

I've found most of the cooks are pretty good and they are certainly perfectionists, The last thing they want is impurities in the end product.

 

[deano]

Well if you think legalizing will fix all, you're dreaming.


Ya can't have ya cake....

I don't actually think it ever will be legalised, but we are somewhat overgoverned in Australia, even fake/herbal ecstacy is illegal, chop chop tobacco is illegal (only country in the world). Its crazy, the penalties for growing tobacco are higher than for growing marajuana.

 

[ylep]

Hyperthetically is someone did start producing good stuff locally ...wouldn't that just about half the price ?

nah i dont think so, prices will still stay the same if the market will bare it. this is the same with every industry the only way prices would drop is if dealers have to fight for customers and bargain down there prices in hope of gaining a competative advantage, regardless of being an import or not dealers will demand the prices they do, in the uk 2 to 3 pound for a pill is standard price and 1.50 pounds each over 50 is standard. this is because the target market(customers) refuse to pay rediculous ammount for a pill that cost almost nothing to produce

 

[Nice Tits]

Its crazy, the penalties for growing tobacco are higher than for growing marajuana

I know it sounds ridiculous, but this kinda makes sense. I did some research into the black market tobacco trade and found that it was a several billion dollar industry. I think it was just less than a year ago - all tobacco plantations in QLD were shut down, largely because of losses to illegal tobacco traficing.

I've been saying that MDMA should be legalised and controlled for ages. But if the manufacturing of MDMA is controlled by heavy weight organised crime types. They are not goin to sit back and watch their industry get tacken out from under them. If it ever becasme legal wat would these crime bosses do???? I doubt they would become unemployed and apply for the dole - they would turn to some other form of illegal activity. Perhaps its in the government's best interests to let the crime bosses have this industry to keep them occupied????


Nice Tits

 

[psy_taco]

I agree totally with what people say when they say that legalisation of substances like ecstacy will reduce the harm caused to users, will increase the purity and the safety of the drugs anbd reduce if not eliminate black market supplers.
Most academics know this, most highly ranked police officers know this, and you can be damned sure the politians know this.
I'm probably going out on a limb in saying this but here goes: In my family there is a very strong political streak and on both sides we have strong links to a political party (I won't say how strong they are just coz it might attract some attention and other comments about party politics which have no place on this site). Anyway it is widely acknowledged within the government (state) that current drugs strategy is expensive and onj the large part ineffective. That said, there is little to no chance of the legalisation or even the regulation of substances like MDMA occuring. This is simply because it is political suicide for the party that proposes this. Just think about all of the uproar that is caused when any topic is broached which challanges views of morality (and yes drug use is one). HBerion injecting rooms, pill testing at raves, perscroption herion and also things like sex tolerance zones, were widely acknowledged as good moves by politians but they were not ultimately put into practice due to the uproar that they caused among the populace. The majority of Australians, I'm sorry to say it, are ignorant about these things, conservative, prejudiced and easily led by people like Andrew Boilt and other right wing fucks and whatever government that is in power must unfortunately play to the social conscience of this majority of Australia, and this is very evident in the Bracks government to not condone pill testing at raves or enforce sex tolerance zones and even more obvious in the Fed Labour governments stance on refugee policy.
Any way the point I was trying to get is that the majority of Australians are ignorant about the nature of drug use and the drug trade and quite frankly probably don't care if ravers die or herion users od, because illict drug use is wrong in their eyes and drug users were just asking for it. I don't agree with this and most politicians probably don't either but the fact of the matter is that politicians wish to remain in office and if they are to do this they are not going to do any thing significant to against the will of the majority to better the conditions of the minority (which MDMA users are, which sux i know).
The only way I forsee any radical shift in policy towards MDMA is a change in the publics perception of MDMA, when it is seem as less harmful and more socially acceptable by the community at large then there may be a shift in policy. It is happening at the moment with policy on cannibus but its still a long way off for MDMA. All we can do as users is try and intelligently inform others about the nature of MDMA use and its benefits and also its risks (all through the use of evidence and good argument), then people might not see it as something 'bad' and eventually as somethnig that is not as harmful as what it is currently perceived to be. In addition to this practice harm minimalisation and educate yourself on substances.

Anyway I'm sorry about the length of this post, it wasn't ment to be this long - I hope I explained myself ok.

legalisation, education and harm minimalisation all the way.

 

[deano]

I know it sounds ridiculous, but this kinda makes sense. I did some research into the black market tobacco trade and found that it was a several billion dollar industry. I think it was just less than a year ago - all tobacco plantations in QLD were shut down, largely because of losses to illegal tobacco traficing.


Nice Tits

The taxes are way too high with tobacco products, which makes people want to buy the illegal tobacco. For example a packet of drum in the USA is under $4 same packet here is $20

I've also heard that "chop chop" is way less addictive, maybe thats what scares the government ?

 

[eccitude]

Anyway I'm sorry about the length of this post, it wasn't ment to be this long - I hope I explained myself ok.

Unfortunately psy_taco I gave up reading your post after the first paragraph - too much effort to read through all the spelling and grammatical errors. Sorry bud, as it seems you had some valid points you wanted to raise.

 

[deano]

Unfortunately psy_taco I gave up reading your post after the first paragraph - too much effort to read through all the spelling and grammatical errors. Sorry bud, as it seems you had some valid points you wanted to raise.

You are joking?

 

[Special-T.B.K]

As Psy_Taco said, The public does not care about drug users or anything, they are not concerned if what they call*junkies* die from ODing or from a dirty pill, as they see it as being our fault and our problem to deal with!

SO REALLY. All we can do is make sure everyone tests their gear, that way no-one will die from dropping pills. Therefor people will no longer purchase Bunk pills, nor will the Sharks continue making them! The main thing we have to market here kiddies is Test Kits, we have to get these into everyone's homes and talk to national retailers about stocking them, that way the more that are sold, the cheaper they will become and it will get more people with them. You think about it, if people know that pills are bunk or full of Methamphetamines, than the Drug sharks will have no use for making them! it will make the FAKE TRADE obsolete, then the next step is after a year of no deaths... through better education and test kit sales. The public will view MDMA as not being a dangerous substance and gradually over a long period of time one of our friendly politicians will forward a motion to legalise MDMA!

SpecTBK

It will take a long time but if we work towards this goal. It will happen!

 

[Fry-d-]

Some good discussion in this thread

A quick point though Special-T.B.K, the basic test kits aren't such a magical weapon in the quest for the completely safe experience as you suggest. While they are good at showing what’s in a pill if it’s mainly made up of one substance if there is a mixture or other contaminants the test kits will not show this. Hence enlighten and other groups strongly pushing for access to better tests that will show each and every chemical and how much of it there is in the substances we consume.

When the people making the rules finally realise recreational drug use will always occur and the solution is to make it as safe as possible not try and stop it completely we will be in such a better place. Legalising things will never happen though, acceptance might.

 

[Special-T.B.K]

I do agree!

But still mate, test kits are our best ACCESSIBLE weapon against the problem. And most pills do only have a MAJORITY of substances in them, due to the fact that they're made as cheaply as possible. On the odd case obviously there may be 3 or more main substances in them.

I wouldn't say Legalisation will never happen! I doubt it ever will, but nothing is impossible. I could see it happening someday, in a long time. But what I see if it were to happen would be quality controlled substances with a monthly intake amount, meaning you would have to sign for them and induce Heavy Penalties of anyone re-selling or getting other peoples goods!

I know it sounds far fetched, but hey we are the New generation and although people in our generation do not do drugs, they accept it unlike the baby boomers generation!

I could actually see Meth-Amphetamines being legalised before MDMA but hey either... I dont care

SpecTBK

 

[VelocideX]

^^ I can't. Methamphetamine is far more addictive than MDMA. It hits up our reward centre directly. Meth addiction is a much bigger problem than MDMA addiction

 

[Special-T.B.K]

Yes,

But where we're sitting at the moment it's a hell of alot closer to be legalised than MDMA!

Also Methamphetamines are already being used on Prescription and controlled use!

when I say Methamphetamines I don't just mean Crystal! Speed is not quite as addictive but both are still extremely addictive anyway!

Although I would rather MDMA legalised anyway, but when I say I don't mind it's mainly because I can control my usage! some people become psychologically attached alot easier than others. Me being lucky!

SpecTBK

 

[phase_dancer]

I could be out of date, but I've not heard of methamphetamine being available in Aus for ~30 years. Amphetamine (Dex) is prescribed for ADHD and ADD, but not meth as far as I know. It is prescribed in other countries for these and similar conditions.

 

[VelocideX]

You're correct. Methamphetamine is prescribed under the brand name Desoxyn in the USA, but it is not available in Australia.