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NEWS: Cairns Post - 22/4/09 'Charged over 'death' drug'

mushi, not much people intentionally make PMA to sell as ecstasy although some people will just sell it anyway. There is a small market in doofs for people that know the drug for their body and they take it. I've seen PMA in some areas but its a highly unpredictable drug. as someone mentioned it may not do anything for you, it may feel like mda or it may just kill you. PMA and MDMA is a very dangerous combination i think because any serotonin releaser or MAOI with PMA is bad news for your brain and body. I would think DXM and PMA would be pretty bad also.

But phase dancer is right alot of PMA is made by cooks getting into cooking MDA or MDMA and they want to use less expensive ingredients first to test their chemistry skills, but some cooks will get greedy and think why not cut my MDMA when i make it with PMA???

There was also some very dirty sassy oil going around SE QLD for a while that was cheap and nasty and being pushed to newbie cooks which was dark, not normal yellowish colour, and contained anethole and safrole in it.. alot of anethole actually, and alot of people wouldnt know or bother to clean it so end product of MDMA would contain PMMA or if they made MDA first (if they were tought that way) to make MDMA, then PMA would be in the end product. This is how the D & G's contained PMA. Badly synthed SMELLY MDMA but had PMA left over in it. Sadly it was enough for one sensative person to die, but wasn't enough in there and the reaction testing them was instant black so people would not even know it contained PMA.
 
permastoned said:
PMA is only dangerous if you don't know that the drug is PMA, phase dancer is right about everyone here jumping the gun before they know any of the actual details of the situation.
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Considering most people qualified their statements with 'may have been', 'if' or are questioning the article then I don't think there is any need to worry about people getting sucked into the sensationalist journalism we are all to well familiar with. :)
 
its incorrect thats for sure.
most people wouldnt buy PMA anyway. personally i dont get any effects from it unless its mixed with MDMA and then its a horrible experience especially the comedown.. felt very dangerous and the peak feels like you're sweating your organs out of your pours. I do think impure PMA is more risky than 98%+ pure stuff
 
I'd rather him practicing making PMA over and over (but dumping the product safely) so its just not another two bit cook making another shitty mdxx synth that smells of putrid safrole and is about 65-70% pure... a lot of people seem to disagree though, clean MDMA doesnt seem to be liked as much as the mdma synth'd for quick street presses.

I think some research needs to be done on the by-products of an MDMA synth. Theres a fair few and sometimes even if its pure 80%+ a presser will add dirty chemicals with a sassafras smell, that are known to cause acculmlative liver damage, but how much of these intermediates are needed to cause adverse health effects?

Maybe people who only dropped in the 80's and mid 90s could get a free liver check by the doctor, assuming they didnt overly abuse anything else including alcohol especially. And then a liver test of todays pills where people look for that sassy smell to know if a pill is good or not? and that abuse it every weekend.
 
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Fuckn fat piece of shit I hope he dies in gaol if it was his intent to synth PMA and distribute it...Fucking dog!
 
Be interesting if there is a follow up on this case and whether or not he was actually synthing PMA and if so for what reason.
 
phase_dancer said:
While I sympathise with you filenet in regards to your friend's death, it must be said that nothing in this story has been conclusively proven.

To be honest, I find it utterly disgusting that so many Bluelighters are willing to shoot first. When are you going to learn that sensationalistic journalism is just that. IT'S WHAT NEWSPAPERS DO.

Even filenet acknowledges the lowlife nature of some tabloid journalists



I know this was said somewhat tongue in cheek, but I would say the jounalist by far. It's far easier to silence a used car salesmen, and generally speaking, they have far less effect on the general public.

Makes you think.
Sorry i too jumped on the PMA hate wagon.
RIP to the BL'er who died.
Yeah i don't trust the fucking papers.
I know all too well what it is like being caught with chem gear and chem books like pihkal.



Let's turn to hipocracy then shall we 8)

As a well proven example, many of you are all too ready to lay shit on any journalist or article that implicates MDMA (or your fav substance) as a cause of death and/or a substance capable of causing potentially serious acute side effects, but these same people will immediately jump on board to "kill the crook" whenever something like this is published.

Just stop for a bit and remember a while back when 4-MMC was labelled incorrectly as 4-MTA -"Flatliners" another "Death Drug". In case you'd forgotten, that came from a Cairns newspaper as well. IT WAS COMPLETE BULLSHIT!! but probably was seen by the prohibitionists as having served well to scare a few away from 4-MMC. But for anyone with a scrap of knowledge or sensibility, it didn't take much to smell the poo.

Let's say the guy in this story did have anethole or aniseed oil. We don't know whether or not he had other essential oils or essences. It could have been one of hundreds. How many people have a few different essential oils at home? When I was experimenting with aroma producing hazer fluids I had a cupboard full of essential oils, but I had no intention of making drugs from them.

....And of the other chemicals, did he have only those required for drug syntheses? Depending upon the proposed synthesis route to PMA, many of the chemicals could be found in or around the home - that's how simple an OTC synth of anethole would be.

So, let's say he was intending to produce PMA. The big question then is; was he intending to use/sell it? Virtually since the advent of Internet drug chemistry discussion, it's been widely suggested that anyone attempting an MDMA synth for the first time who hasn't a background in chem, start by practicing with synthesising PMA. If it goes wrong, the cook hasn't wasted an expensive and hard to get precursor. So, if he was intending to make PMA, was this merely a practice run to see if he could pull off the synth without wasting the more valuable amine and starting materials such as those used for an MDMA synth? I don't condone the making of any illicit drug, but that's not my point. The point in question is: Is the journalist/editor/ newspaper reputable enough with their facts for you to believe this article 100%?

Until this can be conclusively proven, or at least more details provided, this should be seen as it's currently presented; i.e. A hyped up story full of holes. As for the consultant chemist; any chemist who couldn't automatically see whether a synth route is possible or not from the chemicals found, isn't worthy of being called a consultant, litte lone a chemistry expert IMHO. I wouldn't employ him to evaluate my effluent :p
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Yeah what ya make in ya own backyard is different to what you sell to someone as some other drug. I have purchased PMA before knowing what it is.. not sure why now but anyway. I know how fucked it can be getting raided and police finding things and drumming up a story to fit there own goals.

Fuck get court with some lab gear, legal chemicals, PIKHAL & TIHKAL and u looking at trouble these days. What ever happened to Chemistry kits and people being able to have an interest in chemistry?
 
tadfish said:
Yeah what ya make in ya own backyard is different to what you sell to someone as some other drug. I have purchased PMA before knowing what it is.. not sure why now but anyway. I know how fucked it can be getting raided and police finding things and drumming up a story to fit there own goals.

Fuck get court with some lab gear, legal chemicals, PIKHAL & TIHKAL and u looking at trouble these days. What ever happened to Chemistry kits and people being able to have an interest in chemistry?
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The chem set isnt intended for drug manufacturing lol
 
you could maybe make some really impure l-meth with some sugarines on a chemset :)
 
Wow they didn't mention ecstasy once in that article. I read a local story about a Vet that got broken into. They stole ketamine and the article said ketamine is used to make dirty ecstasy pills ¬_¬. I just assumed they would have done the same thing.
 
Doctor War said:
Gives his cover stoy I'd be inclined to say he was probably pulling brown camphor oil and not distilling it right, so there was a proportion of PMA present ion the final product because of the mixed oil input...
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LOL, since when does camphor contain anethole? You and Margo Zlotkowski must have gone to the same chemistry class 8)


PMA is a crap drug, but because many budding chemists don't want to waste their safrole or simply can't get safrole, they use anethole first. At least that was the case when starting with propenylbenzene was the normal starting material. The advent of palladium chemistry a decade ago kinda put that concept in the background as only allylbenzenes are suited to this. I think these days for anyone to be playing with anethole they are either working out propenylbenzene chemistry because they have their eye on other [more expensive] propenylbenzenes such as myristicin, dillapiole, etc, or they are indeed aiming at PMA.
I am curious what the supposedly new method might be. Anyone know?
 
Tabaluga careful u might get in trouble here on BL people are pretty @#$%*# about synth talk.
Though i would love to discuss it but i wonder these days if going to drug snyth sites gets u watched by law enforcement or something.
Well i would rather get an old fashion K bomb pill than whats in bag pills these days.
 
my interest in the chemistry is not from a synth perspective, but from a harm minimisation and legal perspective. I have no intentions of going into any further detail, and what I have posted so far is only related to the legal argument in regards to the charges that were laid. ie, the assumption that anethole is used to practice synth on might have been true 10 years ago, but doesn't generally hold up now.

I am pretty sure the mods will see my post for what it is, but if they have an issue with it I hope they'll let me know.
 
^Nothing wrong with Tabaluga's post IMO.

Could anyone synth anything from those comments alone? Not a hope!
 
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