NEWS: $540 million bust!!!

[hoptis]

Police hit jackpot with ecstasy haul
Les Kennedy
January 5, 2007

Victoria Police's Pat Boyle and NSW counterpart Debbie Wallace announce the find.

WHEN a van hired by Sydney man Patrick Pak Lamb Li and Singaporean tourist Keng Chuan Koh broke down in Geelong, the last thing they wanted was a helping hand from two passing police officers.

The good Samaritan act by police on a routine patrol in North Geelong on December 18 triggered a chain of events that ended with the seizure of chemicals for the manufacture of more than half-a-billion dollars worth of ecstasy.

Police said last night the discovery of 1900 litres of methylenedioxyphenyl-2propane (MD2P) ready for conversion into 18.5 million ecstasy tablets was beyond anything they imagined to find.

The chemical, the second-last step in the process to make ecstasy, was found in Sydney on Wednesday night when police executed a search warrant on a storage unit in Castle Hill, Detective Superintendent Debbie Wallace said yesterday.

After initially being driven back by a strong chemical odour, hazardous chemical officers wearing protective clothing and breathing masks found 69 cardboard boxes containing the chemical inside the unit.

Superintendent Wallace said detectives had spent the past two weeks probing the movements of the two men arrested in Geelong, in particular 50-year-old Li, who said when arrested that he lived in the Sydney suburb of Campsie.

Koh, 27, has proved a mystery and Australian Federal Police are investigating his background.

Both men were arrested when the police officers in Geelong found 340 litres of MD2P inside the van.

Superintendent Wallace said police had no information linking either of the men to any crime gang.

All that is know of Koh is that he arrived in Sydney on a visitors visa in late November.

He and Li have been remanded to face the Melbourne Magistrates Court on July 13.

Police have yet to establish who the men intended to offload the drugs to in Victoria, or where the remaining chemicals found in Sydney were intended to go, though police held suspicions they were destined for a number of clandestine "super laboratories".

And while police suspect the chemical was imported into Australia, it is possible it was manufactured here.

"It would have to be one of the biggest seizures in Australia. Our inquiries have indicated that on conversion of this, that can amount to some 4.5 tonnes of MDMA (ecstasy) with an estimated street value of $540 million … some 18.5 million ecstasy tablets," Superintendent Wallace said.

"We entered the premises believing there would be a large quantity there but certainly the amount was overwhelming. We believe this will be a huge disruption to the drug market, not just in NSW but nationally. I certainly hope there are some people hurting somewhere as a result of this."

The Age

 

[hoptis]

Probe of SE Asian drug link
Dan Box
January 05, 2007

POLICE are investigating whether chemicals seized in one of Australia's biggest drug busts are linked to a crime syndicate operating across Southeast Asia.

A raid involving officers from the federal, Victorian and NSW police on a western Sydney factory unit on Wednesday night uncovered enough chemicals to produce about 18.5 million ecstasy tablets, with a street value of about $500 million. Detective Superintendent Deb Wallace, commander of the NSW police Southeast Asian Crime Squad, said the raid followed the chance discovery of a smaller quantity of the same chemical in Victoria last month.

"I would certainly hope there is some kingpin hurting somewhere," she said.

The Australian

 

[hoptis]

Drug bust one of the biggest
January 04, 2007 03:30pm

A HALF-billion-dollar ecstasy bust in Sydney has been hailed by acting NSW Premier John Watkins as one of Australia's biggest drug hauls.

Police last night seized 1,900 litres of a chemical capable of being turned into $540 million worth of ecstasy, from a Castle Hill warehouse in Sydney's north-west.

"This is believed to be one of the biggest drug seizures in this country's history," Mr Watkins said today.

"An estimated $540 million worth of illegal drugs has been taken off the streets in this joint police operation.

"I want to congratulate the NSW Police who, with their Victorian counterparts, have dealt a major blow to drug dealers with this large drug haul."

No new arrests have followed last night's "liquid ecstasy" seizure, which police say could have produced 18 million ecstasy tablets.

However, officers from the multi-agency police force behind the raid say it follows the seizure of 340 litres of the chemical in Geelong, in southern Victoria, last month.

Two men have been charged over the December 18 raid that netted $51 million worth of ecstasy.

Methylenedioxyphenyl-2propanone, otherwise known as liquid ecstasy, is a final stage precursor for the production of ecstasy.

The NSW State Crime Command's South-East Asian Crime Squad, Victoria Police and Australian Federal Police were all involved in the bust.

The Advertiser

 

[lil angel15]

Thankyou for the well thought out post Biscuit

Lil angel15

 

[phase_dancer]

To refer to a precursor chemical as a liquid form of ecstasy is plainly wrong.

Absolutely. As you also mentioned Biscuit, there is potential for additional danger, particularly considering the properties of MDP2P. This ridiculous terminology increases the likelihood that the chemical will be consumed. If a user were to come across, or be offered MDP2P and believed it to be a pyschoactive chemical, the results could well be fatal. I'd certainly not envy the medics who'd be treating such poisonings.

MDP2P is a corrosive ketone, capable of eating through some plastics. It is nothing like MDMA - the bioactive part of the molecule (the amine) hasn't even been added. You wouldn't call safrole or isosafrole liquid E for the same reasons, and yet these are structurally closer to MDMA than is MDP2P 8)


It does makes you wonder just a bit though; Is it just stupidity, or is there a more sinister element at play here? Just think, if people were turning up to emergency after consuming "MDP2P /liquid E", it would definitely be a notch on the board for prohibitionists; "We told you Ecstasy is a dangerous drug....."

Therefore, you can, in WA at least, be charged for possession of a "prohibited drug" under the drugs legislation even though the chemical is a precursor. Other States may well be the same,

From what I've been told, Qld was first to introduce a similar broad reaching precursor legislation, whereby possession of so named precursor chemicals is considered to be assumption of guilt in regards to manufacture and carries similar penalties to possession of a final product.


While in principle this is probably quite a sensible law, even if it does bypass the "innocent until proven guilty" form of justice - it unfortunately has potential to affect many legit businesses and individual researchers.


An annoying problem for legit researchers - and one which stems from the ability of the legal fraternity to redefine the meanings of scientific words - concerns other chemicals that are not, according to the original and scientifically accepted meaning of the word actually precursors, yet are included in this legal definition. It would seem virtually any chemical that can be used in the manufacture of drugs can now be defined as a precursor. Just how far this definition can be extended and what substances it may encompass doesn't seem to be very clear.


I also have issues with the amounts said to have been seized. As I detailed in the original thread on the van seizure, the figures simply don't add up. As another poster mentioned in this thread, perhaps the MDP2P was not all MDP2P but in fact was dissolved in a suitable solvent? If so, one would hope for the sake of justice that these people are prosecuted and charged with the actual amounts rather than the diluted totals.

 

[Fry-d-]

Great info as always Biscuit and p_d

 

[Coolio]

This may not effect supply at all - what if this was just the first stage of a large scale operation being planned, and someone ratted them out before they could start actually producing anything?

 

[Splatt]

Probably right.
There'd be alot more out there.

But I only see it being for Australia only. Criminals have made prices of drugs, especially ecstasy and meth, way above most countries (basically except New Zealand) so they won't be exporting any, unless it was for a trade of a drug Australia has for cheap, which I only see as weed, or stolen pharms... can't really think of anything else, besides Tassie for opium.

And the max pills bought each week in Australia is one million (I remember from one article, not sure how reliable it is), and there's only like 20 million people living here, most of them aren't pill poppers .. So this could of been one of the operations that were bringing MDMA to Aussies for quite some time. It wasn't that long ago when 50% of Australian pills were meth and K, with not a hint of anything MDMA related.. but now most pills seem to be MDMA only.

 

[MyDietMainlyAmines]

I also have issues with the amounts said to have been seized. As I detailed in the original thread on the van seizure, the figures simply don't add up. As another poster mentioned in this thread, perhaps the MDP2P was not all MDP2P but in fact was dissolved in a suitable solvent? If so, one would hope for the sake of justice that these people are prosecuted and charged with the actual amounts rather than the diluted totals.

Same here when I heard this you wonder who is doing even the most basic maths.

Victoria Bust: 340 Litres = 320kg produced = 1.28 million pills (@ a whopping 250mg per pill!!) = $51 million dollars. Therefore price used is $40/tab.

NSW Bust: 1900 Litres = 2 Tonnes produced = 18.5 million pills (@ 108mg per pill, more realistic) = $540 million dollars. Therefore price used is $30/tab.

As the Vic bust and above figures mentioned in most articles about the new bust, the figures contradict each other within a single article (and the police have stated that the two are related and it is the same substance). Not considering assumptions regarding efficiency of synthesis and cutting of final product prior to pressing and disrtibution or even final price, there is a major and obvious difference in the info circulated: The simple ratio of 340L = $51 million, 1900 L = 1900/340 = 5.59 x $51m = $285 million, not $540m. So one of the figures ($51m or $540m) is clearly wrong unless the purity and price is really that different! Just makes the police and authorities look like idiots if you ask me

So what should the figures be?

I am no chemist but according to phase_dancer 1 Litre MDP2P = (approx) 1kg MDP2P which can produce 1.289kg MDMA at 100% efficiency or 0.645kg at 50% efficiency. phase_dancer said reported yields are between these extremes.

Using the 100% figure (for maximum media effect!) 340 Litres will produce 438.29kg of MDMA. If this is pressed into pills with 120mg each in them (which I think everyone would be quite happy with!) this gives 3.65 million tabs. Again for maximum media effect use $50 as the street price (which I assume is the maximum anyone pays) and the media could have reported $183 million for Victorian bust and a whopping $1.02 billion for NSW (20.4 million tabs).

Can easily compute for any efficiency and price, e.g:

At 50% efficiency, $50/tab the figures become $91m Vic, $510m NSW
At 100% efficiency, $30/tab (NSW police assumed price): $110m Vic, $612m NSW
At 100% efficiency, $40/tab: (Vic police assumed price) $146m Vic, $816m NSW
At 75% efficiency, $30/tab: $82m Vic, $458m NSW
At 75% efficiency, $40/tab: $110m Vic, $611m NSW

So it would seem that the NSW figure is reasobaly close but the Vic figure should have been $100m not $51m

Like many I am fascinated by these busts and get a bit sad wondering whether they will affect supply all around the country and affect my enjoyment of upcoming events!

And dont even get me started on the "Ecstacy is as bad as ice" headlines.

Back to maths nerd land....

 

[phase_dancer]

Thanks for the calculations MyDietMainlyAmines

Like many I am fascinated by these busts and get a bit sad wondering whether they will affect supply all around the country and affect my enjoyment of upcoming events!

From as far back as the early nineties, online discussions have addressed sources of starting material/s, particularly those associated with MDP2P. The mid-late 90's was quite an amazing time for alt.drugs newsgroups, perhaps because of the invulnerability felt by some of the more active contributors. Even when the MDMA chem-guru "Eleusis" went down, he concluded his online antics (and those of his alter ego "Zwitterion") played no part in his arrest/charges. If you haven't heard of Eleusis you can read his story here

Between that period and the past few years, much research has been done towards identifying indigenous and introduced plant species which contain high levels of these starting materials, with published findings confirming several Aus plant species contain the desired alkene for synthesizing MDP2P. One recent study on camphor laurel also revealed some interesting figures. While the online version of the paper omitted tables regarding the alkene content, it did briefly mention levels in local chemotypes relative to Chinese sub-species. The print version however, did include these tables, which stated that while levels varied considerably, max levels of the alkene comprised up to 54% of oil derived from certain parts of the tree. If anyone was to find a way of identifying the traits associated with these higher levels, a virtually limitless source would be available.


So, in my mind, anyone intent on mass producing MDP2P could obtain the raw material from nature. Sure it would take quite a setup to do this continuously, but as camphor laurel is a pest xenotype in most places along the eastern seaboard and hinterland, there is an abundance of raw material. Simple modifications made to a standard still would be all that's required- well within the abilities of the average industrial chemist.

Perhaps the MDP2P in this story was made via another route, one that uses unwatched starting materials, or piperonal, which is used extensively in the perfume industry? Piperonal is regulated, but because of the amounts used in this industry (several tons/ day produced in Japan ) it's quite plausible large amounts are being diverted to drug manufacturing. Of course, several routes also exist that require more chemistry but use completely unsuspicious chemicals (please don't ask). As it's nigh on impossible to effectively regulate these products, it's also quite possible they too are being used to mass produce the ketone.

Forensic chemists can profile the seized product and thereby establish what routes were used to produce it. This is a relatively simple task so if authorities are intent on limiting production, it makes sense they would ascertain how it was made and from what. For obvious reasons this info wouldn't likely be made available to the public.


On the other hand, perhaps as Police claim, this has upset local production of MDMA. If so, then as has been suggested, maybe the next batches of pills will contain adulterants, substitutes or even new or previously unseen chemicals. Recent net talk around BL and elsewhere indicates we're about to see a whole range of new substances, many of which will probably have not been evaluated in human trials. Due to anethole being so widely available, PMA or PMMA could also make a reappearance; PMA being a completely OTC process. Perhaps a more worrying aspect of this concerns the possibility that a drug like PMA will be mixed with MDXX compounds.

I believe we'll probably see some dip in availability, but who knows to what extent or for how long it will last. However, until it can be conclusively shown that the MDP2P originated from OS, one can only assume the producers - who, it seems, have so far avoided identification - are in a position to continue production. I would expect there would also be some pressure to continue, if not only to prevent another group from jumping in and filling the market void.

 

[Biscuit]

^ Agreed. Thanks for the info P_D. And thanks for the calcs above MyDietMainlyAmines.

On the Keelty comment, a journalist has already given it the exact interpretation that I knew would follow from his ridiculous comment.

In the West today at page 55, the first paragraph says:

Aust. Federal Police Commissioner Mick Keelty has described so-called party drug ecstasy as a bigger threat to the community than the highly publicised form of amphetamine known as "ice"

The above is why Keelty's remark was so irresponsible and dangerous. Anyone working with criminal offenders or in the justice system would know that MDMA poses almost no threat to the wider community by contributing to property or violent crime, whereas a majority of these types of crimes are clearly linked to methylamphetamine abuse (and of course alcohol.)

For the public to now believe that MDMA is going to potentially harm them or their community as much as ice might is very unfortunate indeed.

 

[tribesman]

If so, then as has been suggested, maybe the next batches of pills will contain adulterants, substitutes or even new or previously unseen chemicals. Recent net talk around BL and elsewhere indicates we're about to see a whole range of new substances, many of which will probably have not been evaluated in human trials.

This idea intrigues me too. I still wonder what were in those Purple Lexus, Yellow Ghost and other such 'mysterious RC' pills that appeared over here in Perth in early 2006.

 

[chugs]

Has anyone noticed no one has been arrested?

This stinks to the high heavens that half a billion dollars worth of product has been found but not a soul arrested.

Who are the people behind the chemicals, the money and energy that was spent purchasing it and importing it into Australia?

I'd say its just self-serving coppers & crooks doing deals and battling it out for the all that wonderful drug money.

You know they didn't even fine the lab or the pill presses, just the chemical. Not even cash etc.

Usually when the coppers do a raid, they find cash/weapons/drugs. Not in this case, it was just one item.

 

[phase_dancer]

I don't think it implies corruption took place. The December 18th find was after-all just a stroke of luck. It could very well be that the couriers knew nothing i.e. pick up the van at location A, deliver to location B.

Law enforcement would no doubt have staked out the delivery point - for the ~2 weeks or so in-between seizures - before moving in. Any crook with half a brain would have heard the news reports and kept well away.

What it does show is that there is at least one fairly major organisation going on in Aus that the cops either know nothing about, or have yet to associate connected criminals/ criminal activity with i.e. they haven't yet joined the dots.

 

[Dave82]

*REMEMBERS* when people thought locals were pure shit, looks like that has changed It was only a matter of time.

That's because they used to be. With a more competitive marketpace of course you will get a better product You always used to associate locals with speed bombs, now not so much.

 

[sonicnature]

what is methylenedioxyphenyl-2propanone actually used for? is it just a stage of synthesis?

 

[Splatt]

It's a stage of synthesis or a shortcut (if you aren't starting with safrole) if you will. With MDP2P, methylamine, mercury, methanol and foil you will get a freebase MDMA oil with a little bit (or a lot) of magic!

 

[phase_dancer]

It's not really a shortcut as there are somewhat simpler pathways. However, these are reported to either be of low yield or result in high levels of impurities.

MDP2P is simply a reactive intermediate.

In chemistry, sometimes a target molecule will appear to the uneducated to be only one short step away, yet to synthesize it will require a long, more round about way.

While other routes exist that don't go through the ketone, the ketone pathway is fairly standard and can be arrived at using various methods, some of which employ chemicals available over the counter (OTC). Many ketones, including MDP2P, can be purified either through distillation or by forming a bisulphite adduct, and as Splatt pointed out, the final stage of amination uses relatively simple and easy to obtain chemicals. (well, the methylamine isn't easy to obtain but can be made from several easy to get or OTC sources)

MDP2P doesn't really have many other uses, although it is a useful intermediate for preparing other substances - not necessarily drugs. However, commercially speaking, it's uses are limited. It has been said it was once used to prepare compounds for perfumery (it has an odour like cardamon) but I haven't been able to find much on it and my perfumer friend has never heard of it.

The main point to all this is that the MDP2P in this story was made specifically for producing MDMA. It may have come from OS, or from Australia, but either way, the buyer, the middleman [?] and the producer all knew what the intended purpose was.

 

[scumlord]

Mick Keelty's comments are frustrating in some respects although good in others, as most would agree the media's fascination with ice has become overblown.

The top-down nature or 'hierarchal' structure of government departments and bureaucracies such as the police/health/education mean that media pressure does in fact have an influence on policy direction/resources because of the pressure it brings on it's political masters to fix highlighted problems within society. The same moral panic is repeated over and over, we have just substituted heroin with crystal amphetamine and will do the same with cocaine when it undoubtedly becomes mainstream and available to the wider society in quantities.

There are real concerns by health/welfare/police that give some substance for the wide spread media attention, but I've found this usually results in increased funding for police agencies to reduce supply and increase interdiction efforts while health/welfare come up with policies and strategies to ease the 'burden' on the system. Mostly re-active instead of pro-active policy if you know what I mean, it gets better but it's just basically plugging hole in the dam that will eventually leak again.

NOW in relation to this bust I think the most cause for concern would be that it's not finished product that MAY have been smuggled into this country but the chemicals itself. While MDMA may not be high on the media's/polices shit list, you can bet the smuggling of chemicals into Australia is. It's deluded to think it doesn't happen but in the current context of world events it doesn't look good for authorities when it actually is revealed/highlighted by the media and questions start to be asked .