• AADD Moderators: andyturbo | Ashley

MDPV vs a-PVP

BongoBongo

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 20, 2002
Messages
563
Location
noitacol
Can anyone share experience's and or comparisons of the two chemicals: MDPV & A-PVP?

What harm minimisational recommedations would one recommend for A-PVP?
 

mister

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 8, 2005
Messages
1,623
this was copied from the European section.....

aPVP (alpha-PVP) vs. MDPV comparison:

**These are two very similar chemicals in structure, based on pyrovalerone and resembling non-identical twins in their nature, or a "female" vs. "male" mallard duck... however, they both walk, look and quack like a duck, not a duck/crow (as an example) **.

Also, my qualifications: Regular and in-depth experience with MDPV practically since the day it came out in the early-mid 2000's, and a recent introduction to aPVP via a well-trusted and reliable source.

MDPV (appearance): Powdery white-to-tan.
A-PVP: Clumpy tan to dark tan.

MDPV (odor): Mild "pyrrolidine" type odor (like smelly sweat-socks).
A-PVP: Heavier (moderate) "pyrrolidine" type odor.

MDPV (solubility): Dissolves in H2O with difficulty, mild "pyrrolidine" type odor in solution.
A-PVP: Dissolves readily, heavier (moderate) "pyrrolidine" type odor in solution.

MDPV (smokeability): Vapes somewhat uncleanly, mild to moderate harshness/odor.
A-PVP: Vapes very easily/cleanly, moderate to heavy harshness/odor.

MDPV (onset and duration): Slow to medium onset of effects, lesser dosage needed, greater duration.
A-PVP: Rapid onset of effects (all tested ROA's), 1/4 to 1/3 greater dosage needed, lesser duration.

Summary (useful info): a-PVP vapes better than MDPV, but is harder on the lungs and harsher. Effects come on faster, but last a shorter period of time and more is needed than with MDPV. A "rush" is possible/likely with a-PVP (particularly if smoked or injected), and unlikely with MDPV.

The "highs" are otherwise quite similar -- plain old NDRI (norepinephrine/dopamine) reuptake inhibition and stimulation with varying/unpredictable euphoria, an increase in sexual tendencies and unpleasant tweaking at higher dosages.

APVP "feels like" a cruder, harsher and less sophisticated (but faster-acting and smoother burning) version of MDPV. MDPV is like "high end/fancy/fussy" and aPVP is "low end, poor man, easy-going" version of the same thing.

Given the faster onset and shorter duration of effects, it is possible that a-PVP will be more compulsive than MDPV via rapid onset ROA's (smoking, slamming), but it may take longer to take hold and have an easier/shorter comedown when the user regains willpower. Vapers may experience lung damage/pain with a-PVP (temporary, most likely, but who knows). It is likely (from my research, including contact with a professional source that suggests it) that a-PVP degrades/loses potency substantially faster than MDPV, whether in solution or not, and so care in storage is more of a factor.
thanks to Dedbeet :)
 

Dedbeet

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
1,561
Location
USA
Glad to be able to contribute that, sometimes plain old information is helpful to people without any "social" content (rights, wrongs, shoulds, coulds, etc) and this is an example perhaps... I hope it helps reduce harm for someone, that was (and remains) my only goal in providing posts of this nature.
 
Last edited:

jason7

Bluelighter
Joined
Sep 14, 2011
Messages
680
Haven't tried a-PVP yet but I ordered a little so I'll report shortly. I noticed that the chemical structure is the same as a compound called Prolintane except for the ketone group. It's the same as the difference between cathinone and amphetamine. a-PVP is a ketone and Prolintane is a pure hydrocarbon like amphetamine.

Prolintane is considered very safe medically, and was often prescribed to the elderly. I guess it's a pretty mild stimulant. It was even sold over the counter as a vitamin/tonic drink in Spain. Students used it for long studying sessions. So a-PVP should be a mild stimulant with few bad effects. It still can have side effects though and does have a withdrawal syndrome so I wouldn't go nuts with it or anything. At least it's unlikely to be neurotoxic like MDMA and meth. I'm sure they would have noticed that before selling it publicly. Doubt you would get particularly high off it though, if they were giving it to old folk. My guess, it's probably about like ephedrine. You'll probably get a little tingle off it but nothing major. I just bought some because they had a half price sale on it. They were practically giving it away. The shipping cost was almost as much as the product cost.
 

Halif

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 4, 2011
Messages
1,049
Location
Melbourne
jason7, be careful with a-PVP. When are describing it as mild and sounds like you're expecting something weak.

I have limited experience with it, but what I had was far stronger than regular amphetamine. I have never tried MDPV, but I know that a-PVP is a close relative, so I was cautious when I first tried it, only using a small amount. But I was still surprised at how powerful it was.

You can take this with a grain of salt (or other white powder..ho ho) because I seem to be one of those people who get a paradoxical effect from stims - virtually all I've tried make me talkative but physically sedated. I get stuck on the couch! For me, stimulants generally don't stimulate. But a-PVP definitely does.

Just start super small and do all the safe things, is all I wanted to say:)
 

mister

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 8, 2005
Messages
1,623
Haven't tried a-PVP yet but I ordered a little so I'll report shortly. I noticed that the chemical structure is the same as a compound called Prolintane except for the ketone group. It's the same as the difference between cathinone and amphetamine. a-PVP is a ketone and Prolintane is a pure hydrocarbon like amphetamine.

Prolintane is considered very safe medically, and was often prescribed to the elderly. I guess it's a pretty mild stimulant. It was even sold over the counter as a vitamin/tonic drink in Spain. Students used it for long studying sessions. So a-PVP should be a mild stimulant with few bad effects. It still can have side effects though and does have a withdrawal syndrome so I wouldn't go nuts with it or anything. At least it's unlikely to be neurotoxic like MDMA and meth. I'm sure they would have noticed that before selling it publicly. Doubt you would get particularly high off it though, if they were giving it to old folk. My guess, it's probably about like ephedrine. You'll probably get a little tingle off it but nothing major. I just bought some because they had a half price sale on it. They were practically giving it away. The shipping cost was almost as much as the product cost.
Mate you are in for a shock if you think its just going to give you a tingle, these compounds are active at 10mgs. I hope you read this before you ingest.
 

RaveToTheGrave

Bluelighter
Joined
Jun 1, 2009
Messages
82
I got a whole bunch of sample grams from a vendor and a-PVP, MOPPP, MDPPP, as well as Pentadrone were included, a long with phenazepam which has been a great thing to have around. I was very scared to try any RC stim that was related to MDPV. I mean I do have to admit satin is a good chemist and all, I mean it tops even cocaine in the negative effects it induces, yet somehow makes crave endless excessive doses. Well after some reading and having all the safety gear I tried MDPPP, and was pleasantly surprised at the very non-pushy nature of this chemical. Since I did maybe 60mg of that I did around 25mg of a-PVP with it. I was able to sleep without redosing 2 hours after with about 4mg phenazepam, no paranoia, slight headache, but nothing huge. Later, I tried about 150mg and I expected more from it. I got a bit of a headache, I did get euphoria, but I do not feel I can do anything useful under the influence of this stimulant. Its nice how its very non-anxiety inducing in nature, only things I do not like are it has a slight body load at larger doses, it is nearly impossible to dose the kind I got without a scale. The powder is so dense and clumpy and what appears to be 25mg can be 125mg or more. Anyway I intend to try the MOPPP as well, but I'd say its not a bad chemical, especially mixed with MDPPP.
 

The King of Beans

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 21, 2012
Messages
404
Has anyone tried MDPV mixed with APVP? Was just thinking about the combo and could not see any information on it.
 

drug_mentor

Bluelight Crew
Joined
Jul 12, 2006
Messages
7,515
Location
Melbourne, Australia
Tried this A-PVP stuff a fair bit earlier in the year, can't honestly say that I was impressed with it. Was smoking it in a crackie and it seemed to me that more than a few hits was too much and caused anxiety combined with a strong body load, still felt compelled to redose as the shit starts to wear off a bit and feel less intense though which is fucking stupid. I would say that I enjoyed MDPV more overall than A-PVP, but A-PVP did smoke better (although still not particularly well). MDPV was far from my favourite stimulant too, I can see why one might use small doses to get through a work day or something but for me personally I don't see the recreation in either of these substances.
 

Halif

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 4, 2011
Messages
1,049
Location
Melbourne
it seemed to me that more than a few hits was too much and caused anxiety combined with a strong body load, still felt compelled to redose as the shit starts to wear off a bit and feel less intense though which is fucking stupid.
Hit the nail on the head, D_M.

It's a shocker of a drug, because less is more with this but it is the single hardest thing to put done I have ever come across. Nothing else has created such an intense love/hate relationship for me than a-PVP. It always, without fail ALWAYS, ends in a horrific binge that lasts as long as it takes me to get through the amount I have on hand. And no matter how much I try to prepare myself mentally beforehand, it always ends up the same way. If I've got 150mg, I'll smoke it in a couple of hours. If I've a gram (1,000mg), I'll smoke it within 30 hours, during which time I won't be able to eat or sleep.

The one time I ended up with two grams (2,000mg), I did the lot within four days and had the full "PV" experience: massive anxiety and paranoia, delirium and auditory hallucinations, severe dehydration and impaired motor coordination brought about by a lack of sleep, lack of food, and an overload of the drug in my system.

During those times, I will enter a catatonic state whereby I can't move for long periods. I am frozen to the spot, feel extremely anxious about moving and making any sound. My hearing seems to expand in range and sensitivity to a ridiculous degree, so that every sound is very loud and clear, and sounds always appear to be coming from much closer than are they. For instance, when walking in the street I will hear people shouting loudly at each other (or at me?) and I will turn around to see who it is, but realise they are on the other side of the road, a good 30 metres away, and they're aren't souting at all. THey're just talking to each other.

One thing I can say about a-PVP, is that I won't go anywhere near it unless a have a large supply of benzos on hand. The anxiety it produces is unbearable in higher doses.

So, finally, to answer the original question - I prefer a-PVP to MDPV, but they're both horrible drugs which are way too hard to manage.
 

The King of Beans

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 21, 2012
Messages
404
Never abused AP-Vp.....It was too strong for me. Well I did do it like 15 days in a row, but really small doses. I think 3-MMC is far worse for your heart consdiering ive had problems ever since my 8 day binge. I didnt find APVP to be that addictive, since the buzz wasnt that good.
 

The King of Beans

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 21, 2012
Messages
404
If it wasnt for idiots, we wouldnt have to abuse random chems. There'd still be good MDMA around and that'd be all you'd need. But unfortunatly Good MDMA is about as scares as my dead ancestors
 

Halif

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 4, 2011
Messages
1,049
Location
Melbourne
APVP "feels like" a cruder, harsher and less sophisticated (but faster-acting and smoother burning) version of MDPV. MDPV is like "high end/fancy/fussy" and aPVP is "low end, poor man, easy-going" version of the same thing.
You know, despite what I've written earlier in this thread about them being horrible drugs, I have changed my mind (or have had my mind changed by the devil's drug) a bit.

And it's strange, because I would say the exact opposite of that quote above.

For some reason, I kept going back to a-PVP - the reason being I'm an idiot, I guess - and, miraculously, have just about learned to control my self with it.

Just as Drug_Mentor said, very wisely, a-PVP can be a very nice thing to vape in SMALL, INFREQUENT amounts. It smokes up so clean in a proper glass pipe and is just... well, pleasing as an instant pick me up. I've had terrible trouble with it in the past because the urge to re-dose is beyond anything I've tried (aside from MDPV). The thing is, that urge, as overwhelming as it is, doesn't last very long, and if you can avoid redosing for 15 to twenty minutes, then you can enjoy an hour or two of feeling pretty good without much of a comedown or difficulty sleeping.

I'm sure that in the past there was a lot of confusion with vendors (knowingly or unknowingly) selling one as the other. A couple of years back people kept talking about tan powder VS white and different strengths/effects.

When you kept pure a-PVP and get to know it really well, there's no way you could confuse the two anymore.

a-PVP caused me trouble, but I kept coming back after month breaks and trying again. I guess I'm a slow learner, but now I see that it can be used with minimal side effects. It's not a beginner's drug, and shouldn't be sold - even hugely diluted - in "novelty snuff bath salt plant food" branded products. It's just way too easy to get into trouble. Too much a-PVP and you'll get some of the most shocking anxiety, which is almost unstoppable without taking a stupid amount of benzos or alcohol (not together). You won't be able to sleep. You'll keep redosing even though you've entered a state of delerium and just want it to end. Won't be able to eat or sleep.

Take a little - and it should be fine. Even nice and enjoyable in a way that is quite unique.

One thing I will say though, is I haven't changed my thoughts towards MDPV - that is one of the worst drugs I've ever had, in any amount. I've tried it about three times, over the course of a couple of years, and from different sources, and I got the same thing every time - a powerful rush and euphoria well beyond a-PVP, followed by the most god awful crash. Even a small dose would leave me feeling like roadkill. A few doses and I'd feel so bad I could barely believe it was possible to feel so rough; feverish, nauseous, aching body, fatigue, auditory hallucinations, very low mood.

MDPV is one I'm happy never to cross paths with again. Strange. I've abused (and I do mean abused, very, very stupidly) a-PVP and gone through 3 grams in under 50 hours. You can imagine how I felt after not eating, sleeping, or doing anything other than redosing over and over.

But even that horror didn't compare to what comparatively tiny amounts of MDPV (like 250mg - I know that's a lot for MDPV, I'm just saying compared to 3,000mg of a-PVP it's a lot less) did to me.

Right, long enough post. Last thing, though:

I got a whole bunch of sample grams from a vendor and a-PVP, MOPPP, MDPPP, as well as Pentadrone were included, a long with phenazepam which has been a great thing to have around
Ravetothegrave: please tell us you're still alive and sane. That sounds like the worst fucking combination of things to have at hand all at the same time. Did you read up well on phenazepam? I can't think of a more dangerous benzo to handle. Just as MDPV is one of the worst stims to manage. Also, 4mg is a hefty dose which will linger in your system for a long time and likely cover up some of the signs that your body is telling you to stop taking all those stims!! That benzo in combination with those stims sounds like a recipe for blackout and rampage.

Please be careful.
 

lovepsychadelics

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 10, 2011
Messages
1,377
Location
Crime capital of Australia!!!
aPVP is not as hash on the body as peevee and dose is slightly more forgiving but treat with caution as outlined in the above post. 250 mg of peevee I can see why you had such a bad experience, does not sound like much but 98% pure MDPV is a crazy drug! Cheers Halif great post and could not agree more except that I'm not using any of those particular substances again. aPVP just don't do enough for me to be worth the side effects and MDPV is just way to much after my near OD on the stuff. Phenazepam is crazy, crazy stuff lost almost 3 days from dosing just over 2 mg. Real blur of almost zombie like stupor. May have been inclined to eat someone's face if i'd had some stims and pcp in my system!
 
Last edited:

Halif

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 4, 2011
Messages
1,049
Location
Melbourne
^yeah man, 250mg MDPV is not a small amount. I didn't take it all at once, of course. I vaped it over a few hours - but that's still more than enough to make a man ga-ga, face eatin' crazy.

And just to reiterate: I only posted the above amount about my a-PVP binge (3 grams in less than 3 days) to point out how compulsive a drug it is. For those that aren't familiar with these substances, please know that what I did was extremely stupid and dangerous. I did it because I had completely lost control of my will power.

a-PVP is noticeable for a novice at 10-15mg when vaped. With MDPV the amounts are lower again.

These are seriously potent chemicals.

And while we are at it:

Phenazepam is crazy, crazy stuff lost almost 3 days from dosing just over 2 mg. Real blur of almost zombie like stupor. May have been inclined to eat someone's face if i'd had some stims and pcp in my system!
Phenzepam is a benzodiazepine (ie. same family as Xanax, Valium, Temazepam, etc), but it is NOTHING like any benzo that most people come into contact with. Lovepsychedelics comments above are virtually the rule rather than the exception, regarding memory loss.

Anyone who has phenaz, or who wants to try it (the temptation is there because it's so very, very cheap and long lasting - know this: it is a full spectrum benzo with an extremely long half life and an unusually long onset time (ie. you won't notice anything for a good three hours, and if you are feeling effects before that, you've probably taken too much already). It is notorious for causing lengthy blackouts - full on blackouts - during which people who done things which have ruined their lives.

On top of all that, in my experience, it is not 'fun' or enjoyable in the slightest.

I resisted aquiring phenaz until about two months ago when I realised that I had really developed a dependency on diazepam and etizolam, and that if I were to suddenly run out I would be in serious trouble. So I got some as an absolute last resort.

Guess what? Two weeks ago I lost a bag contain a rather large amount of benzos (all for personal use) and then raced home to get out my emergency stash of etizolam and found.... that it was gone. 150 x 2mg tablets gone. I was stunned, then bewildered, then very scared and the reality set in that thee only answer was that I'd taken them all (not at once) by dipping into the emergency bag now and then, and it turned out that now and then was far more than I thought.

So, it was time for plan Z - that is, PhenaZePlan. The absolute last resort. I am terrified of that drug, but within just a single day I started feeling intense rebound anxiety from the etizolam and realised that I was going to have to risk it, or go to a hospital and fess up. The second option wasn't really an option, so I took a toothpick and dipped it in the bag of phenaz (I have scales, but nowhere near accurate enough to measure 1mg with precision, and I didn't have time to make a liquid solution - I was shaking already).

I used the pointy end of the toothpick and made sure that there was only some powder sticking to the tip, not sitting heaped on there. I then tapped that onto a bit of foil and vaped it. There was almost no vapour. I then sat and waited for two hours, with a sense of doom growing by the minute, by two a half hours the doom sense stopped growing. By four hours I realised that I actually wasn't very anxious.

I continued this - using the minimum amount, two days on, a day off - for a week, and it held me until I got some etiz. I'll say that it is potent stuff, because although I was feeling the WDs and sure as shit didn't feel relaxed or good, the fact is that I managed to get through a week functioning fairly normally, apart from mood swings and occasional minor anxiety attacks.

But knowing what I know about phenaz, I was only every going to use the absolute minimum amount to hold me sane. After I got the etiz and diaz back, I immediately started planning a very slow taper. I never, ever, want to have to rely on phenaz again, let alone any benzo.
 

AFA

Bluelighter
Joined
Sep 28, 2011
Messages
339
Just getting back into apvp again, dead white fluffy crystaline goodness.

Vapes like a champ into nothing, dosnt feel harsh at all. If i dose after work 5:30pm (vaped 20mg) im able to eat dinner at 6:30pm and sleep at 10pm without any benzo or anything

Such a good pick me up and nice rush.

Next up test out plugging the stuff, i hear it give a good rush via that roa
 
Top