Opioids making poppy seed tea..

[Forever Changes]

I know you didn't ask me but in the spirit of being helpful I'll tell my method if it's allowed;

1. Weigh your pods, about 5g maintains me, 20g feels fantastic, I started on about 3g and haven't changed it much.
2. Put pods in coffee grinder until it's powdery
3. Add freshly boiled water with a pinch or two of citric acid granules
4. Blend again for a few minutes
5. Strain through a cloth teabag, catching the pod sludge in the teabag
6. Drink the strained liquid (90% ought to be in that)
7. Add the teabag, citric acid and boiling water together in a cup a few more times until the water doesn't colour any more, just because I hate to waste any.

The estimated morphine content in the "average" pod is 3mg to every 1g of pod, but that is going to be highly inaccurate of course.
I take it every morning because I have a chronic pain condition that is harder to manage than a pod habit. It's a really slow come down, the feeling lasts until the next day sometimes, which is always a bonus.

if this post breaks the rules then moderators, go ahead and remove it

thanks. I used a similar method but always boiled the pod grinds to kill off any unwanted pathogens or pesticides. Some people say boiling the pods destroys the opium content though - don't know if that's true. I add lemon juice as well. Simmer in a saucepan for about 30 minutes. Then strain the grinds

I think I used way too much - about 30 grams of pod powder which didn't give me a high but made me feel very sick the next day - like copious vomiting

I wonder if just eating the pod sludge is enough, rather than only drinking the tea? Athough that would probably make me more sick

btw, are you in the UK?

 

[The Wizard of the Creek]

Some people say boiling the pods destroys the opium content though - don't know if that's true.

Boiling hot water will break apart and ruin the morphine molecules. It’s best to use really hot water to help wash off the opiate alkaloids from the pulverized pods, but not boiling hot water.

 

[Forever Changes]

Boiling hot water will break apart and ruin the morphine molecules. It’s best to use really hot water to help wash off the opiate alkaloids from the pulverized pods, but not boiling hot water.

but don't people smoke opium? Fire must get much hotter than boiling water (100 degrees C)

 

[The Wizard of the Creek]

but don't people smoke opium? Fire must get much hotter than boiling water (100 degrees C)

Sure people smoke opium. They also smoke heroin and fentanyl and other opioids. I’m talking about morphine though (which you cannot smoke). Morphine (codeine to a lesser extent) is the alkaloid you want making poppy pod/seed tea.

 

[Forever Changes]

Sure people smoke opium. They also smoke heroin and fentanyl and other opioids. I’m talking about morphine though (which you cannot smoke). Morphine (codeine to a lesser extent) is the alkaloid you want making poppy pod/seed tea.

oh right. i'm just concerned that the pods I get may have bacteria/pathogens/pesticides on them, so boiling them would hopefully kill off those nasties

Is there a maximum water temperature you should steep the pods in?

 

[JessFR]

Boiling hot water will break apart and ruin the morphine molecules. It’s best to use really hot water to help wash off the opiate alkaloids from the pulverized pods, but not boiling hot water.

Do you have any proof for this? Cause I'm increasingly of the belief that it's a druggie urban legend.

I once looked into this question, and while I wasn't able to get a definitive answer, I was pretty convinced it's probably not true.

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

Sure people smoke opium. They also smoke heroin and fentanyl and other opioids. I’m talking about morphine though (which you cannot smoke). Morphine (codeine to a lesser extent) is the alkaloid you want making poppy pod/seed tea.

But morphine is the main constituent of opium is it not? I've never found that boiling poppy pods is detrimental to the 'high' as opposed to just using very hot water.

I also used to use lemon juice, but found that made fuck all difference either.

The effects from pods are very much an acquired taste. They can last a very long time, almost too long tbh.

But don't underestimate their potency. If you're opiate naive, you can get more than you bargained for...

 

[Forever Changes]

Do you have any proof for this? Cause I'm increasingly of the belief that it's a druggie urban legend.

I once looked into this question, and while I wasn't able to get a definitive answer, I was pretty convinced it's probably not true.

I've also read conflicting reports about the whole 'you mustn't heat opium/morphine to higher than 80C' line, and wondered if it's an urban myth that just gets perpetuated for no particular reason.

I did find a post by someone on a rival forum (so I won't link to it) where he explains why he think it's a myth, but I have no idea what hs credentials are or if what he says is true, but anyway here it is:

So I'm here again looking at more preconceived notions about opium. I proved a little while ago that you can use it in a hookah quite beautifully, and now I'm back to talk about something else.

Generally when we're extracting our alkaloids we say it should be done at temperatures below 75C or so. While doing a little research for writing I accidentally came across a paper that's well-sourced and describes opium purification as involving the boiling of the solution.

So I did a little more Googling around, found some posts on and so did some research myself on thermal decomposition. As far as I could find, there are no substances with a melting point that decompose before that melting point. Wikipedia notes a substance with a very low thermal decomposition temperature, which is still 80C-440C above its melting point. And it doesn't have a boiling point, which makes sense; it's hard to measure the boiling point of something that no longer exists because it's decomposed.

And looking through all the major alkaloids of opium...morphine, codeine, thebaine, papaverine, narcotine...they all have melting points, and they're all well above that of water, all ranging between 120C-250C, which makes sense as they're all roughly in the same group of organic chemicals. So they really can't break down at the temperature at which water boils, which is always around 100C (it can't get hotter than that without becoming steam).

Note that this doesn't negate the fact that when smoked, opium alkaloids are pretty useless. I haven't looked into this yet, but I haven't heard of anyone actually lighting opium on fire and getting anything out of it. Note that a cigarette burns at about 900C, and a candle burns at about 1400C, so it's a huge difference between that and boiling water. I have read people saying that they boil the snot out of their opium tea, though, and that it works perfectly well if not better.

This last word is important. Morphine is not soluble in cool water. That's why we have to heat it up. If we can heat it up more, we're going to get more morphine into the solution. Not only that, but it will also break up the latex more with greater kinetic energy, so it's possible that boiling is also a better way of removing those oils and plant matter. So it makes perfect sense that these individuals are having a better time from boiling their water.

The fact you can create psychoactive Cooked Flake Opium from pods by boiling them for considerable time is proof the heat isn't destroying anything. Would opium be smokable if the heat killed the main event? The morphine? Would heroin be smokable?

I think the 85 degree myth comes from a misunderstanding of the Merck extraction process where Opium is boiled in Eth at 85 degrees.

 

[negrogesic]

There's something off about the tea itself. I think its possible the first digestion of the tea is not a good time for many people. I can't think of an opiate containing so many alkloids other than the poppy tea. My first experience making it was somewhat pleasant, but then I was scratching myself non-stop and dazed eyed for an entire weeek. I've never heard of anyone who experienced effects so prolonged like this..

But its possible the army of alkoids taken were not something I was used to. I wish I tried more attempts at making it.. but then again looking back on it--I can't imagine myself having self control with the tea. Obviously then withdrawing to impossible-to-hide levels in all the wrong places, lol. Such is life

I was reading that filtering the poppy seed tea cleans it up quite abit. Apparently the thebaine and other alkaloids can be filtered out somewhat since they are poorly soluble and are sort of floating in suspension as opposed to dissolved in the solution. Will definitely try filtering next time.

 

[JessFR]

I've also read conflicting reports about the whole 'you mustn't heat opium/morphine to higher than 80C' line, and wondered if it's an urban myth that just gets perpetuated for no particular reason.

I did find a post by someone on a rival forum (so I won't link to it) where he explains why he think it's a myth, but I have no idea what hs credentials are or if what he says is true, but anyway here it is:

Yeah this is very similar reasoning to what I've previously found researching this.

I think it's probably a myth. But I wish I knew more chemistry to have more confidence in saying that.

The one big part of doubt I have, is that meds always have set temperatures for storage. They aren't always the same and they are waaay below boiling point.

Presumably it's a temperature at which they're rated to last up to their expiration date and remain effective. With higher temperatures resulting in less time.

I just dunno. I'd love to hear from someone who really knows their chemistry what they think.

 

[Xorkoth]

Sure people smoke opium. They also smoke heroin and fentanyl and other opioids. I’m talking about morphine though (which you cannot smoke). Morphine (codeine to a lesser extent) is the alkaloid you want making poppy pod/seed tea.

The melting point of morphine is 255 degrees C, which is 2 and a half times the temperature of boiling water. So boiling it will not destroy the morphine. I couldn't find the melting point of codeine, which is the other main alkaloid. Thebaine is another alkaloid present in poppy pods, but it is an undesirable alkaloid, though generally found in much lower quantities.

Also, opium is mostly morphine, so you can in fact smoke it, quite easily.

 

[negrogesic]

Yeah this is very similar reasoning to what I've previously found researching this.

I think it's probably a myth. But I wish I knew more chemistry to have more confidence in saying that.

The one big part of doubt I have, is that meds always have set temperatures for storage. They aren't always the same and they are waaay below boiling point.

Presumably it's a temperature at which they're rated to last up to their expiration date and remain effective. With higher temperatures resulting in less time.

I just dunno. I'd love to hear from someone who really knows their chemistry what they think.

It is a myth. I use to steam extract morphine from poppy pods and it worked tremendously. Morphine is robust and can be boiled for quite some time.

The argument however for not using hot water is to preferentially extract morphine over other alkaloids. For instance, thebaine isn't very soluble in cold water whereas morphine is.

 

[Forever Changes]

It is a myth. I use to steam extract morphine from poppy pods and it worked tremendously. Morphine is robust and can be boiled for quite some time.

The argument however for not using hot water is to preferentially extract morphine over other alkaloids. For instance, thebaine isn't very soluble in cold water whereas morphine is.

Do you think it's worth trying to put the pod grinds in coldish water instead?

 

[papercuts]

Sure people smoke opium. They also smoke heroin and fentanyl and other opioids. I’m talking about morphine though (which you cannot smoke). Morphine (codeine to a lesser extent) is the alkaloid you want making poppy pod/seed tea.

If you can't smoke morphine then what is in opium smoke to make it worthwhile? Genuine question.

Edit; I read on and you already asked something similar, so does anyone else know?

 

[papercuts]

The melting point of morphine is 255 degrees C, which is 2 and a half times the temperature of boiling water. So boiling it will not destroy the morphine. I couldn't find the melting point of codeine, which is the other main alkaloid. Thebaine is another alkaloid present in poppy pods, but it is an undesirable alkaloid, though generally found in much lower quantities.

Also, opium is mostly morphine, so you can in fact smoke it, quite easily.

I've found a herbal vaporizer very useful for this as you can set your temperature on most of them.
I'd also heard morphine is easily destroyed by heat so started vaping extracts at about 170'C.
It didn't work as well as I expected so I kept increasing the temperature with fresh goo or flakes or just lightly gound up pods if they are strong enough, the max temp is actually the best, that's just below combustion at 235'C
But I'm not looking to get off my head as much, I'm after a warm gentle buzz and pain relief, which it does beautifully

 

[papercuts]

thanks. I used a similar method but always boiled the pod grinds to kill off any unwanted pathogens or pesticides. Some people say boiling the pods destroys the opium content though - don't know if that's true. I add lemon juice as well. Simmer in a saucepan for about 30 minutes. Then strain the grinds

I think I used way too much - about 30 grams of pod powder which didn't give me a high but made me feel very sick the next day - like copious vomiting

I wonder if just eating the pod sludge is enough, rather than only drinking the tea? Athough that would probably make me more sick

btw, are you in the UK?

Eating sludge sounds gross, I'd agree it'd make you sick, but on the other hand it would make it last even longer I think.
I used to boil my pod powder in a pan with lemon juice, it took a while to refine my method to what felt best, not necessarily what felt strongest.
Reading some of the other posts makes me think I'm getting a better morphine to thebaine ratio by not overheating it.
Your extended boiling probably increased the thebaine extraction too much, I've never thrown up with pod tea except one time, but I was already in withdrawal from buprenorphine and was panicking because I felt so bad already I couldn't keep it down and the tea was all ending up wasted down the sink just when I needed it most .
Apart from that my experiences are all positive and I hope that pulverising it in a blender with boiled water is enough to kill pathogens, I don't use the very mouldy pods you sometimes get.
btw yes

 

[Xorkoth]

If you can't smoke morphine then what is in opium smoke to make it worthwhile? Genuine question.

Edit; I read on and you already asked something similar, so does anyone else know?

You can smoke morphine, that information was incorrect. Morphine is primarily what gets you high in opium. Codeine as well.

 

[Ganjcat]

Boiling hot water will break apart and ruin the morphine molecules. It’s best to use really hot water to help wash off the opiate alkaloids from the pulverized pods, but not boiling hot water.

but don't people smoke opium? Fire must get much hotter than boiling water (100 degrees C)

omg yet another contradiction to the he said she said boiling water argument this is why I think I suck at pst every few months the census seems to change one month boiling water is needed to extract the alkaloids properly another month boiling water destroys the alkoloids and another month you shouldn't use warm or boiling just cold water...

 

[Ganjcat]

You can smoke morphine, that information was incorrect. Morphine is primarily what gets you high in opium. Codeine as well.

the only seeds I can get have so little alkaloids on them I'm better off just buying a pack of cocodomal

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

omg yet another contradiction to the he said she said boiling water argument this is why I think I suck at pst every few months the census seems to change one month boiling water is needed to extract the alkaloids properly another month boiling water destroys the alkoloids and another month you shouldn't use warm or boiling just cold water...

Seeds are different though. They don't contain any active alkaloids. The goodies you want are coating the external shell of the seeds. Therefore, to make poppy seed tea, all you need to do is wash them. This is where using boiling water is a bad idea because that will extract shit you don't want from the seeds.

Basically, boiling pods is ok, boiling seeds is not.