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Kratom with Citric Acid or Antacid?

chicken hoagie said:
Obviously chemists will soon find a way to isolate mitragynine and co. If they don't straight up find a way to synthesize it altogether.
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According the wiki, that has already happened when it was synthesized first in the 1995.
"The first total synthesis of mitragynine was reported by Takayama et al. in 1995.[17]"
Depending on which would be more cost effective, one would either use mitragynine isolated from plant, or mitragynine synthesized from raw material. It then can be altered into more potent substances.
chicken hoagie said:
it would take a very concentrated form of alkaloids and an extremely high amount of them to truly cause a potential overdose of this substance.
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Not necessarily. Morphine and strychnine are both alkaloids. and neither would need to be extremely concentrated or in, what I'd consider, extremely high doses in order to be fatal. Soup tainted with rat poison will kill just as well as pure rat poison, assuming the same fatal dose is administered.

The fatal dose would be determined by the properties of the chemical and how it interacts with the human body. Individual physiology certainly comes into play, but there is what is called an LD50, at which 50% of the population will die at that dose. The LD50 is typically considered a "fatal dose" even if everyone doesn't die at that dose.

It is also possible that the source of the toxicity isn't even an alkaloid or mitragynine, but some other undesirable chemical that is found in kratom.
 
Mafioso said:
According the wiki, that has already happened when it was synthesized first in the 1995.
"The first total synthesis of mitragynine was reported by Takayama et al. in 1995.[17]"
Depending on which would be more cost effective, one would either use mitragynine isolated from plant, or mitragynine synthesized from raw material. It then can be altered into more potent substances.

Not necessarily. Morphine and strychnine are both alkaloids. and neither would need to be extremely concentrated or in, what I'd consider, extremely high doses in order to be fatal. Soup tainted with rat poison will kill just as well as pure rat poison, assuming the same fatal dose is administered.

The fatal dose would be determined by the properties of the chemical and how it interacts with the human body. Individual physiology certainly comes into play, but there is what is called an LD50, at which 50% of the population will die at that dose. The LD50 is typically considered a "fatal dose" even if everyone doesn't die at that dose.

It is also possible that the source of the toxicity isn't even an alkaloid or mitragynine, but some other undesirable chemical that is found in kratom.
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I read somewhere that mice were administered around 940mg/kg of pure mitragynine and did not show signs of respiratory depression...so the LD50 would likely be much higher. Don't know what the record is on most kratom leaf consumed, but I imagine it is ridiculously high.
 
Respiratory/CNS depression isn't the only potential way of causing fatal overdose, but you are right that it doesn't seem to be a huge concern with kratom. You could have read that in the kratom wiki page. The page also states that it's understudied and the safety profile is unknown and possibly side effects include seizure, heart problems, psychosis, and rarely liver toxicity.
 
Mafioso said:
Respiratory/CNS depression isn't the only potential way of causing fatal overdose, but you are right that it doesn't seem to be a huge concern with kratom. You could have read that in the kratom wiki page. The page also states that it's understudied and the safety profile is unknown and possibly side effects include seizure, heart problems, psychosis, and rarely liver toxicity.
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It is definitely understudied..I'm not sure how seizures or heart problems would arise from kratom use alone..psychosis could be caused through excessive NMDA antagonism..there could possibly be liver problems in individuals with damaged or poor functioning livers, unless there are undiscovered compounds in the leaf that are taxing on the liver.
 
All this is VERY INTERESTING,, seein I don't know much about kratom at all.... BUT, for me, it is all overwhelming!!! I wish there was a way to break summa this down for a kratom newbie like me...
 
For some great kratom info look up Dr. Christopher McCurdy's(currently at University of Florida) work if you havent. He is, and has been, the leading kratom(and salvia) researcher for a number of years now and has a decent amount of published work online. He had a lecture on youtube about kratom pharmacodynamics/pharmacokinetics a couple years ago that i used to recommend to people back when the US first attempted to schedule it. During the initial wave of ignorant hysteria.
 
busted.produk said:
For some great kratom info look up Dr. Christopher McCurdy's(currently at University of Florida) work if you havent. He is, and has been, the leading kratom(and salvia) researcher for a number of years now and has a decent amount of published work online. He had a lecture on youtube about kratom pharmacodynamics/pharmacokinetics a couple years ago that i used to recommend to people back when the US first attempted to schedule it. During the initial wave of ignorant hysteria.
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Do you have any specific links that I could check out?
 
Youtube Chris mccurdy. He has a few lectures on there that are great! As well as another kratom scientist, I cant remember his name though. I will post when I remember it though!
 
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