Misc Is kratom strong enough to induce sleep after functional stim usage?

[deruyityn]

I would be interested in low dosing of 2-fa maybe around 20-30mg max. but Ive avoided it since stims I get terrible insomnia and trying things like weed just caused awful paranoia/fighting for my sanity and benzoes too afraid of getting into a spiral of usage. Kratom I feel really comfortable with so would not be worrying about that.

I didnt used to take kratom back when I dabbled with stims so dont know how well it would work but red veins can really put me in a cosy place to get ready for sleep. I wonder though if the reamining stimulation would overpowert the kratom or if a nice dose of a red vein would be strong enough to wipeout the tailend of the stimulaiton and allow you to drift off to sleep.

I usually sleep for 40 mins or so in the afternoon but yesterday being kratom day and on some red vein borneo I had a nice long nap of 3 hours which reminded me of its posible potential for stim comedowns.

Maybe take a larger dose than usual would do the job? Obviously keep it to the red veins. Ive read mixed responses on people's success using it for this purpose.

If it didnt actually induce sleep that same night I imagine it would at least put you in a nice headspace and get rid of the remorse factor you can get when stims wear off.

Interested if anyone has have any success using kratom for this purpose without having to use benzoes etc for sleep?

 

[hangyourhead]

First off, you would only want a sedating strain of Kratom e.g. Bali or UEI at a higher, sedating dose. Kratom can be very stimulating (between the stimulatory effects of caffeine and ephedrine/low dose amps), which in your case would be undesirable for sleep. I'd throw an antihistamine e.g. hydroxyzine or promethazine (very sedating IME) in the mix for potentiation of Kratom's mu-agonist/opioid properties and add to the sedative effects. I'd also highly suggest an indica-dominant cannabis strain (will also potentiate Kratom's opioid/sedative effects; cannabis does a lot for potentiation of opioids and esp Kratom. I find it a crucial companion to Mitragynine and its alkaloids e.g. 7-Hydroxymitragynine; more potent than morphine supposedly and a full-agonist ofc).

Best of luck, I definitely need sedatives to come down from stimulants/amps. I have rough comedowns esp with Adderall/d,l-amphetamine and m-amphet.

 

[Mycophile]

Sorry I didn't read these two posts and just jumped to the end, but FOR ME Kratom all by itself makes it harder for me to sleep than any other drug I've ever used in my life including proper stimulants like Dexadrine and even Cocaine.

I need Kratom to have actually WORN OFF at least 5 or more hours before I can even TRY to fall asleep.

Add in ANOTHER stimulant and I'm lucky to sleep within like 15 hours lol.

But others can sleep on it, so don't necessarily take my word for it cause everyone is different.

 

[Ziiirp]

Depends on the strain and ROA. When dry leafs are chewed (or a tea is consumed) the Kratom is primarily broken down by the enzymes in the saliva and transported to the receptors via the membranes in the mouth. That way Kratom is ALWAYS stimulating, no matter the strain, (in my experience) so do not try this when you want a sedating effect. Otherwise overstimulation can occur in your case.

When ingesting the powder, the Kratom is decomposed in the stomach. That way the calming effects are more revealed.

Generally, if you want sedating effects, take red vein or green vein powdered strains via toss and wash.

By the way. IMHO those kind of questions could also be asked in the Kratom Megathread .

 

[Mycophile]

Depends on the strain and ROA. When dry leafs are chewed (or a tea is consumed) the Kratom is primarily broken down by the enzymes in the saliva and transported to the receptors via the membranes in the mouth. That way Kratom is ALWAYS stimulating, no matter the strain, (in my experience) so do not try this when you want a sedating effect. Otherwise overstimulation can occur in your case.When ingesting the powder, the Kratom is decomposed in the stomach. That way the calming effects are more revealed.Generally, if you want sedating effects, take red vein or green vein powdered strains via toss and wash.By the way. IMHO those kind of questions could also be asked in the Kratom Megathread .

Well, the ONLY way I ever take Kratom is via toss and wash and I get about 75% stimulating effects and about 25% sedating effects regardless of strains, red, white or green and I've tried multiple so I don't think your theory is necessarily universal.

The only truth I've found is that larger doses are usually more likely to be sedating than smaller ones but that's it.Not to say I have any issue with the stimulant effects as I love them, the only problem for me is that I need to wait SO long after it wears off before I can count on being able to fall asleep which can really cause issues.

It's odd because I'm also a big fan of Dexadrine which is a more classic stimulant but if I'm tired enough I can fall asleep just 2 hours after Dex has worn off (it usually lasts for me for me about 4 hours and takes 45 mins to kick in, so we'll say I can be asleep 7 hours after I last ingested Dex, or maybe even 6 with some melatonin).

With Kratom it also usually lasts me about 4-5 hours and takes approx 45 mins to kick in but I won't be able to sleep till AT LEAST 10 hours after ingestion and that's if I'm DEAD tired.

The standard for me is that usually I can sleep about 6--8 hours after the kratom wears off, or about 11-13 hours after my last ingestion.

It's a real bitch and has kept me up countless nights so I've learned that if i want to sleep I better take my last dose around mid afternoon like no later than 2 or 3PM or I won't be getting much shut eye.

If anyone knows a solution I'm all ears but I really don't think there is one and that it's just how my body reacts to it.

Worst of all, I won't even feel the pleasant side of the "stimulant high" after it has worn off, I just simply won't be able to sleep, so it's the worst of both worlds.At least if I was still high when up at night on it I'd get that out of it...

 

[Burnt Offerings]

Kratom keeps me awake, personally. I find it stronger than coffee in this respect.

 

[Ozekat]

Interesting that so many kratom users here get such a stimulating effect from it. I know about the differences in strains.

For me Maeng Da is not good to take while on stims.....but every other strain is like magic. I actually enjoy taking kratom (especially white vein) while I am still tweaking or even a few minutes after I've dosed on stims because the kratom calms my nerves and seems to calm my heart-rate down as well. So it takes that nasty edge off the stims and makes the entire experience more enjoyable.

I've been swearing by using the more sedating strains of kratom to unwind from tweaking or being all stimmed out. The borneo white vein in particular works so well for me while I'm still speeding from the stims that it easily replaces the need or desire to seek after benzo's.

But the best way to counteract stims is to eat a bunch of food......a LOT....eventually you will go to sleep. Hamburgers and steaks in particular.