FallenOne86
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If you get TRT induced gyno will Raloxifene and Tamoxifen help get rid of it or would you have to just figure out a way to spend the money to get the surgery to cut it out completely?
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SIED Moderators: Genetic Freak | Serotonin101
If you get TRT induced Gyno.. can Raloxifene and Tamoxifen help get rid of it some?
- Thread starter FallenOne86
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It really depends how far it's progressed. Can go the ralox route for a long while and see what happens as it's pretty safe side effect wise. I'd rather try the pharmacy route over the surgery route first.
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Gyno is reversible within a certain time frame, after that the only option is surgical.
At least the type I have, which happened during puberty and then never went away. Luckily it is mild.
At least the type I have, which happened during puberty and then never went away. Luckily it is mild.
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Reduce the dose, and/or inject more frequently with a lower dose.. Control adipose tissue..
FallenOne86
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Do you think it's because I've been on 100mgs for 4 years and haven't increased the dose is the reason? I've told my doctor many times I feel like the dose is too low and he constantly says, "I'd like to see you in the 700 range" and I tell him if I'm sleeping good, eating good, and working out 4 times a week and my number is in the 400 range.. that's not so good. Average maybe.. but if you want me in the 700 range maybe bump up the dose to 150 at least. I mean I have been on it for 4 years now. Because can't you get gyno if your test levels are low?
FallenOne86
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Yeah I asked my endo if I should be taking an AI or something to control estrogen but he said it was not necessary on TRT. I doubt he would know anything about raloxifene. I had to beg my nurse to put me on weekly injections because when I first started they had me doing 1 injection every 3 months on Test Cyp lmaooo
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Yeah blood work should indicate if estrogen is high. You'll want to get that in range asap as well as starve the gyno with a serm (ralox seems to be the best). Protocol that we often recommend here is like 0.5mg anastrozole on the day of injection. Since the bolus of test will be absorbed quickly during that time, the anastrozole will inhibit aromatase during that initial influx for the length of its half life. So when the anastrozole is wearing off, there will be less testosterone in circulation to aromatize as it's already been metabolized.
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If he's on trt, letro would be massive overkill. Like using an atom bomb for pest control in your house. I nuked my estro with letro on 500+ test in a matter of days. The prescribed anastrozole dosage can be increased in combination with addition of ralox for a more gradual reduction in circulating e2
FallenOne86
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Oh so you're suggesting I switch the Tamoxifen for Anastrozole? I've got the Tamoxifen and Ralox right now ready to go but if you think I should swap the Tamox for Anastrozole let me know and I'll take care of that before I start. And do I take them everyday or every 2-3 days? Just wondering since I'm on TRT and all. BTW is Letrozole and actual chemotherapy drug? And what kind of impact would that have on my body? My girlfriend had cancer when she was just a baby and she could tell you her story it's a long one and she's been through hell but she was curious about the letro and why I'd be fucking with it to begin with. She gets the whole gyno issue now but she asked about it because she looked it up and that's what it said was that it is a chemotherapy type of drug.
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Ralox would be your best bet as it'll block estrogen the best at the receptors in breast tissue. You shouldn't have any issues with a true trt dosage. To minimize issues, increase injection frequency to a minimum of twice a week to reduce the spikes and troughs in your hormone levels (less fluctuations leads to less side effects).
Letrozole can be used as a medication for estrogen sensitive cancers. It is probably the most potent aromatase inhibitor on the market. For people like us, there's really no need for it outside of maybe contest prep. I have some left over from years ago that's just collecting dust in a drawer. If an aromatase inhibitor is absolutely needed for some reason (genetic predisposed or something to converting test to estrogen), I'd start with anastrozole at like 0.5mg taken on days you inject. Timing it like this allows the drug to be at maximum efficacy during the time the testosterone from your shot is peaking and wearing off as your test levels drop from that shot.
Start off without any other drugs outside of your testosterone and wait before adding anything in to assess if you actually need it. Most people if doing their protocol properly for themselves will not need an AI or serm. Estrogen is very beneficial to your health in many ways and should never have its levels crushed.
Letrozole can be used as a medication for estrogen sensitive cancers. It is probably the most potent aromatase inhibitor on the market. For people like us, there's really no need for it outside of maybe contest prep. I have some left over from years ago that's just collecting dust in a drawer. If an aromatase inhibitor is absolutely needed for some reason (genetic predisposed or something to converting test to estrogen), I'd start with anastrozole at like 0.5mg taken on days you inject. Timing it like this allows the drug to be at maximum efficacy during the time the testosterone from your shot is peaking and wearing off as your test levels drop from that shot.
Start off without any other drugs outside of your testosterone and wait before adding anything in to assess if you actually need it. Most people if doing their protocol properly for themselves will not need an AI or serm. Estrogen is very beneficial to your health in many ways and should never have its levels crushed.
FallenOne86
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Thanks for the information guys.. helps out a lot! I wonder how hard it is going to be to switch my endocrinologist because he's not cooperating with me. Is it easy to find a TRT doc? Oh and I don't know if I'm missing something here but a bunch of guys at the gym are freaking out talking about stocking up on testosterone because of the border crisis and Americans having to struggle in the near future with their prescription medication. Umm.. are they paranoid or did I completely miss something here? I know the border crisis is a problem because we've got these fuckers crossing in the border like crazy and it's annoying but do I really have to worry about my Test Cyp prescription not getting filled or are these guys just paranoid for no reason? lol
Letrozole has worked in cases of gyno for many men! I thought it was considered front line gyno medication!!!
I know if I get gyno I am jumping on letrozole to nuke my conversion and then I am also mixing in a serm to block the receptors as well but... I would risk my health with pharm to avoid surgery but either way surgery might be needed anyways... Probably most likely so?
OpiateKiller
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Arimidex caused a large gyno growth to completely disappear for me in just one dosage id start there
finitelifeform
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Anastrozole is the recommended choice. Its effective but doesnt flatline you, unless you take too much. Others are just as effective but their affinity to eliminate circulating E2 is much higher and so regulating this can become a problem for many.
There are three main types of AI;
- Anastrozole
This blocks aromatose at the receptor but is reversible. Its probably the most common as side effects are less severe due to its temporary mechanisms in the body. It is probably among the easiest drug to control for reducing E2 while on gear
- Letrozole
Quite similiar to anastrozole only it acts much quicker. This is good if you need to get E2 rapidly but its also bad because its difficult to regulate because its got a very strong affinity. You can end up flatlining your E2 which will cause just as many side effects as having too much E2. Commonly this isnt used unless gyno is pronounced.
- Examastane
The "suicidal AI". This will nuke your E2 and the process is permenant unlike with the above two where the binding of the drug is reversible. This is some serious stuff and unless you need such a powerful tool to eradicate E2, such as on an advanced bodybuilding cycle where it is imperative to keep levels down, using it is advised.
There are side effects with all and that is worth mentioning. You probably will get increased E2 from TRT because its not guaranteed your body produces as much as the TRT dose you are on and when/if it doesnt a good sign of that is when your body balances out your hormones by increasing E2. A higher level of testosterone typically means more aromatization ie more E2. So physiologically your body is compensating because of the levels of testosterone you have. And this itself as a good indicator of the dose being higher than what you naturally produce as I am guessing you wont be aromatizing too much E2 off TRT? Hence the whole process. Doctors should know this. Its not natural test and because you are forcing dosages of test into the body that will convert to more available testosterone in the body (because you are bypassing the body naturally producing it therefore making the process more effective) it makes sense E2 will increase.
Unfortunately most doctors arent trained to a high standard when it comes to TRT, not most mainstream GPs anyway. You need a specialist and not one who is reading solely out of a book that focuses on a romantic/ideal version of reality as opposed to the nitty-gritty world of steroids and the varying applications for them, both TRT and beyond.
I would stick to Anastrozole. Take 0.5mg every 3-4 days. Get your bloodwork done reguarly. Because you are on TRT the side effects shouldnt be too bad. I have taken 1g+ a week and suffered high E2 but thats a huge dose in comparison to the 100-150mg the average male produces every week. At one point I was taking that on top of other compounds. But this is TRT we are talking about so intervention should be minimal. Minimal but also present and the awareness of intervention is necessary too. Putting hormones into your body from outside of it will naturally change how your body works. This is obvious and so understanding the full range of possibilities for your own peace of mind and overall health and wellbeing is key.
I mean, we take TRT because we were lacking something before, right? You dont want to be lacking after you take it and potentially cause other issues. TRT is a good thing meant to improve your life. Anybody who attempts to trivialize it and say there are no caveats to altering your body chemistry and its as simple as injecting something into your body need to be educated, doctors or otherwise.
There are three main types of AI;
- Anastrozole
This blocks aromatose at the receptor but is reversible. Its probably the most common as side effects are less severe due to its temporary mechanisms in the body. It is probably among the easiest drug to control for reducing E2 while on gear
- Letrozole
Quite similiar to anastrozole only it acts much quicker. This is good if you need to get E2 rapidly but its also bad because its difficult to regulate because its got a very strong affinity. You can end up flatlining your E2 which will cause just as many side effects as having too much E2. Commonly this isnt used unless gyno is pronounced.
- Examastane
The "suicidal AI". This will nuke your E2 and the process is permenant unlike with the above two where the binding of the drug is reversible. This is some serious stuff and unless you need such a powerful tool to eradicate E2, such as on an advanced bodybuilding cycle where it is imperative to keep levels down, using it is advised.
There are side effects with all and that is worth mentioning. You probably will get increased E2 from TRT because its not guaranteed your body produces as much as the TRT dose you are on and when/if it doesnt a good sign of that is when your body balances out your hormones by increasing E2. A higher level of testosterone typically means more aromatization ie more E2. So physiologically your body is compensating because of the levels of testosterone you have. And this itself as a good indicator of the dose being higher than what you naturally produce as I am guessing you wont be aromatizing too much E2 off TRT? Hence the whole process. Doctors should know this. Its not natural test and because you are forcing dosages of test into the body that will convert to more available testosterone in the body (because you are bypassing the body naturally producing it therefore making the process more effective) it makes sense E2 will increase.
Unfortunately most doctors arent trained to a high standard when it comes to TRT, not most mainstream GPs anyway. You need a specialist and not one who is reading solely out of a book that focuses on a romantic/ideal version of reality as opposed to the nitty-gritty world of steroids and the varying applications for them, both TRT and beyond.
I would stick to Anastrozole. Take 0.5mg every 3-4 days. Get your bloodwork done reguarly. Because you are on TRT the side effects shouldnt be too bad. I have taken 1g+ a week and suffered high E2 but thats a huge dose in comparison to the 100-150mg the average male produces every week. At one point I was taking that on top of other compounds. But this is TRT we are talking about so intervention should be minimal. Minimal but also present and the awareness of intervention is necessary too. Putting hormones into your body from outside of it will naturally change how your body works. This is obvious and so understanding the full range of possibilities for your own peace of mind and overall health and wellbeing is key.
I mean, we take TRT because we were lacking something before, right? You dont want to be lacking after you take it and potentially cause other issues. TRT is a good thing meant to improve your life. Anybody who attempts to trivialize it and say there are no caveats to altering your body chemistry and its as simple as injecting something into your body need to be educated, doctors or otherwise.