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Opioids High intake; high tolerance - whats next?

JoeDobbin

Greenlighter
Joined
Jun 7, 2015
Messages
27
Hello.

I have occasionally read this forum from time to time, albeit for purposes of information on what other people have taken for general tolerances. I have read some very interesting and helpful things; information that has been able for me to become further educated on opiate based medications, allowing for informed discussions with my doctors.

Interesting enough, I have never taken any illegally prescribed or street drugs. I don't drink (rare occasion), and I don't smoke.

Yet, I am ill. I have been fighting various things all my life. Things became very ugly for me about a year ago, when my neurological system decided to go haywire on me. In which, my central nervous system has taken a hit, and various damaging effects to some critical organs. In short, I am dying.

Each medical institute I have been to has given me some interesting prognosis's, from dying in 10 months to becoming a quadriplegic by the end of this year. Right now, my doctor and I have been working on regulating my quality of life.

Enough of the background, I wanted to cover my experiences with some various medications I have been on for the past 6 months now (regularly) and some changes to my body. I believe the BlueLight community would have much more information than any other group or individual that I could inquire with. I appreciate any and all feedback.

For the past 6 months, I take on a regular basis for pain control:
- SUBSYS 1200 MCG (Fentanyl Sublingual) 4 times daily; separated by four hour increments (i.e. from 7:00 AM until 7:00 PM)
- Oxycodone 20MG, 4 times daily (immediate Release) (i.e. from ~9:00 PM, 1:00 AM)
- oxycontin 40MG, 2 times daily (extended Release) (i.e. 7:00 AM and 7:00 PM)

What I am finding is that this cocktail has worked wonders to allowing me to not be over-medicated and be able to function in life. I am very coherent and sober with this mixture (compared to many other cocktail attempts). Yet, I have noticed that in the past 2 months, the pain has been harder to subside. In which, I have found myself increasing the usage of the SUBSYS 1200MCG frequency to every 4 hours continuous (consuming 6 sprays per day vs 4); therefore depleting my weekly supply faster. In which, I stopped taking the Oxycodone (but still take the Oxycotin).

In the past 1.5 months, I usually get to Friday (filled on Monday) from the increased dosages. Then, I am left in a bad state where I have to go for about 40-45 hours without any SUBSYS. I have never officially felt a withdrawal to something, but I think I had been going through them. It is hard to tell, as my body is in terrible neurological and muscular pain. I cannot differentiate the source for "feeling bad".

What I have been doing to offset the lack of SUBSYS (and my doctor is aware of this, per our ongoing conversations) is to 40MG every 3 or so hours on the weekends until I can get a SUBSYS refil. Then, my I repeat the cycle.

As I have mentioned, I think I am building up a tollerance. I have noticed that the pain isn't as well controlled as it was before. I am now finding myself taking 60MG of Oxy per dosage, trying to cover the pain. One last note as an example of information; I was in the hospital two weeks ago. During my stay, I was prescribed dilaudid (through my IV - typical treatment drug). Normally, I take 2MG per 1.5 hours or so. In this last go around, it seemed like it had no impact on me what-so-ever. We increased it to 3MG per Hour - and that had some reduction in pain, but very little compared to previous hospitalizations.

I am worried. I feel like I am at my maximum levels that the doctors can push to me. We did a lot of blood panels, in which I had some low vitamin levels (B12, D); my doctor mentioned that studies have shown an increase in those will increase the effect of the opiate effect. Yet, I am just afraid that I am reaching an end here.

When I was at one of the major medical institutions, the head of their neurology department spoke with my wife and I, regarding the overall prognosis. In which, they said it was a rare illness that I have. That doctor had only seen a few patients with my same condition, and 3 of the 4 committed suicide as they could not handle the pain. The 4th died of a cardiac arrest (CNS failure).

I dont want to be another suicide statistic, but I am worried that we are running out of pain control methods. Hence ,I am reaching here but figured through the vast knowledge on BlueLight - someone can offer some opinions on what to do with high tolerance/resistance or some other pain control medicine?

Thank you.
Anonymous Joe
 
have you tried pregabalin? it's indicated for neurological pain. as are some benzodiazepines, i believe. you're on a lot of opiates at high doses, but i think they could still up your oxycodone dose or switch you to Opana (oxymorphone) or something stronger than oxycodone. also, have you asked about methadone? this is what wiki has to say: Due to its activity at the NMDA receptor, it may be more effective against neuropathic pain; for the same reason, tolerance to the analgesic effects may be lesser compared to other opioids.

that's all i've got, really. i'm not a doctor or anything - just an enthusiastic junkie, so i'm sure someone more qualified can discredit everything i've just said.

i hope that does help though and good luck, mate.
 
Last edited:
Try for Pregablin, it helps with pain and makes opiates far more potent. I think you would be surprised by Pregablin.
 
sir, i must write as I was moved by tremendous sympathy for your condition. That is some seriously terrible shit. Because of your physical condition, a hard ibogaine trip is out, so where you need to be looking is POTENTIATORS. liver enzyme inhibitors etc. I happen to be an expert on this subject. I would recommend: proglumide, black seed oil(nigella sativa), agmatine, dxm/other NMDA antagonist(agmatine is, but they're different enough that I seperated them). Harmala alkaloids are a possibility as well. All of these extend the duration and quality of analgesia, albeit through different means. The proglumide is really going to be your best friend. you can cycle on and off of it in week increments. It allowed me to drop my opiate dose dramatically while still taking medication, while also potentiating the effects of the medication I was using. I am so sorry for your situation, I don't know how you can stare that down, but by god you should be able to do it without worrying about your meds not working ;) all the best to you, sir or madam(assuming sir, but that may just be me reading into things)
 
Hello.

I have occasionally read this forum from time to time, albeit for purposes of information on what other people have taken for general tolerances. I have read some very interesting and helpful things; information that has been able for me to become further educated on opiate based medications, allowing for informed discussions with my doctors.

Interesting enough, I have never taken any illegally prescribed or street drugs. I don't drink (rare occasion), and I don't smoke.

Yet, I am ill. I have been fighting various things all my life. Things became very ugly for me about a year ago, when my neurological system decided to go haywire on me. In which, my central nervous system has taken a hit, and various damaging effects to some critical organs. In short, I am dying.

Each medical institute I have been to has given me some interesting prognosis's, from dying in 10 months to becoming a quadriplegic by the end of this year. Right now, my doctor and I have been working on regulating my quality of life.

Enough of the background, I wanted to cover my experiences with some various medications I have been on for the past 6 months now (regularly) and some changes to my body. I believe the BlueLight community would have much more information than any other group or individual that I could inquire with. I appreciate any and all feedback.

For the past 6 months, I take on a regular basis for pain control:
- SUBSYS 1200 MCG (Fentanyl Sublingual) 4 times daily; separated by four hour increments (i.e. from 7:00 AM until 7:00 PM)
- Oxycodone 20MG, 4 times daily (immediate Release) (i.e. from ~9:00 PM, 1:00 AM)
- oxycontin 40MG, 2 times daily (extended Release) (i.e. 7:00 AM and 7:00 PM)

What I am finding is that this cocktail has worked wonders to allowing me to not be over-medicated and be able to function in life. I am very coherent and sober with this mixture (compared to many other cocktail attempts). Yet, I have noticed that in the past 2 months, the pain has been harder to subside. In which, I have found myself increasing the usage of the SUBSYS 1200MCG frequency to every 4 hours continuous (consuming 6 sprays per day vs 4); therefore depleting my weekly supply faster. In which, I stopped taking the Oxycodone (but still take the Oxycotin).

In the past 1.5 months, I usually get to Friday (filled on Monday) from the increased dosages. Then, I am left in a bad state where I have to go for about 40-45 hours without any SUBSYS. I have never officially felt a withdrawal to something, but I think I had been going through them. It is hard to tell, as my body is in terrible neurological and muscular pain. I cannot differentiate the source for "feeling bad".

What I have been doing to offset the lack of SUBSYS (and my doctor is aware of this, per our ongoing conversations) is to 40MG every 3 or so hours on the weekends until I can get a SUBSYS refil. Then, my I repeat the cycle.

As I have mentioned, I think I am building up a tollerance. I have noticed that the pain isn't as well controlled as it was before. I am now finding myself taking 60MG of Oxy per dosage, trying to cover the pain. One last note as an example of information; I was in the hospital two weeks ago. During my stay, I was prescribed dilaudid (through my IV - typical treatment drug). Normally, I take 2MG per 1.5 hours or so. In this last go around, it seemed like it had no impact on me what-so-ever. We increased it to 3MG per Hour - and that had some reduction in pain, but very little compared to previous hospitalizations.

I am worried. I feel like I am at my maximum levels that the doctors can push to me. We did a lot of blood panels, in which I had some low vitamin levels (B12, D); my doctor mentioned that studies have shown an increase in those will increase the effect of the opiate effect. Yet, I am just afraid that I am reaching an end here.

When I was at one of the major medical institutions, the head of their neurology department spoke with my wife and I, regarding the overall prognosis. In which, they said it was a rare illness that I have. That doctor had only seen a few patients with my same condition, and 3 of the 4 committed suicide as they could not handle the pain. The 4th died of a cardiac arrest (CNS failure).

I dont want to be another suicide statistic, but I am worried that we are running out of pain control methods. Hence ,I am reaching here but figured through the vast knowledge on BlueLight - someone can offer some opinions on what to do with high tolerance/resistance or some other pain control medicine?

Thank you.
Anonymous Joe




Wow ... Good luck brother try dxm adjunct to ur opies works for my nerv pain
 
Cannabis.

Though somehow I'm guessing you're in a state without medical cannabis if you have neurological pain and no one has mentioned it. Where are you located?
 
I wanted to thank everyone for all of their feedback. I wanted to ask a few more questions and provide an update.

The SUBSYS is no longer available at this time (Insurance Company won't pay for it). We are trying other things. We have tried Liquid Morphine and Liquid Methadone. Neither helped with the pain at all. I don't remember the dosage on the morphine, but the methadone was 10 MG per ML; 2ML every 4 hours. It did nothing, other than hurt my diabetes due to the high sugar content.

Right now, here is what I am on:

- Fentenyl 100 MCG Patch (just started the titration of it - not an ending dose). I am in 30 hours into the patch, so it should be under effect. Nothing worth while at this point.
- Oxycontin 60 MG twice per day
- Oxycodine 60 MG every 2 hours, 12x a day.

I am not sure if I am just extremely tolerant, but I do not get the feelings from the drugs anymore. Honestly, I don't care. I just want the pain to stop. All day today, I have been taking 90MG Oxycodone every two hours with zero effect. Its weird how different drugs interact differently with people, but this does nothing to me. I have read that others would be OD'ing or wiped out. The only side effect I have had with any of this thus far is a lot of gas. I know constipation is an issue with opiates, and I take a lot of stool softeners (3 capsols a day). My bowel movements are a tad rough, but not too irregular. I just know that I have never had this much gas in my life. Gross - I know, sorry.

I am not sure if the Fentenyl really just did me in for tolerances, but the only way I ever know that the medicines have barely started to work is by my vision. My vision will get blurry some, and that has been consistent with my high dosages of Fentenyl (i.e. up to 2400 MCG Sub-lingually).

In my original post, I mentioned that I don't drink. This is because it takes an extremely large amount of alcohol (to the point of a major risk of poisoning) to get me buzzed or drunk. Therefore, it is extremely expensive to drink and since I get no effect from it, I just don't do it. I know it sounds like a bragging thing, but it honestly isn't. I am just noticing some tenancies here.

In regards to THC / Canabis - that is no good either. I have tried smoking it and doing a bunch of gummies and it didn't get me high. I didn't like the smoking aspect of it for no return, so we stopped and moved on. My brother in law is into that stuff on a daily basis, and he didn't believe my wife that we couldn't get it to work either. He had came over and tried even some of his wax stuff that he has. No luck.

I am not sure if there is something wrong with me, or broke with me, or because I have a Neuropathy issue, I have higher tolerances to drugs interfering with my nerves or body. Honestly, I am glad I am not hooked on a high feeling, because it is extremely difficult to achieve it. Yet, I want the pain to stop. I am not having much luck.

About three weeks ago, I was in the hospital. It was a last minute thing with my doctor and I, meant to get hydrated and stuff. Anyhow, I didn't bring my pain medicines along so they wrote me dilaudid. We started with 2MG every 2 Hours, but it had no effect. We continued to increase the dosage, and by the time I left we were at 3mg per hour. At that level, it was lowering my pain levels, but it didn't knock me out like it use to do. This freaks me out. Out of all things, dilaudid was always the drug that would "get me high" and "get me to sleep".

The nurses and techs were having trouble getting an IV on me, so they ordered a PIC line. While we were waiting for that, they gave me a 3mg IM shot. It also had no impact on my pain at all. The PIC line was in my left arm. I am not sure if that makes the feeling go differently, but normally when I have had an IV and when I got dilaudid, it would feel like someone was hitting me in the chest with a hammer or I got kicked in the tummy, but almost (I say almost) in a good way. Huge rush to the head, but almost to the point where you can't breath. It was always a weird feeling, one I couldn't tell if I liked or not. Yet, the results were always good. This last time with the PIC line - that feeling never happened at all. Not even a tiny rush like that before. It was just like a saleen water injection (without the nasty taste in the back of the throat).

I spoke with my doctor about possibly doing an in-hospital stay and detoxing or something to see if I can get my tolerance levels way down. He is going to look into it and see what we can do. I am sincerely worried that I am not getting relief anymore from my pain medicine. Even when on Subsys, I was having to take the sprays much more frequently to get the same result as I had previously done before.

Going back to my first post, I am extremely worried at this point. I feel like I am near this mythical borderline where drugs won't do anything to me anymore, until I cross this magical line and just die. I also feel like I am inching closer to the statistical numbers - if I can't make the pain go away, I won't be able to continue on-wards! The only relief I am getting is some random sleepiness from the Oxycodones I believe. It isn't always consistent, but sometimes it comes on harder - sometimes it never comes at all.

This is going off into a rabit hole, but I have been researching afterlife and general information. I am agnostic on the whole subject and have never been a church going person. Yet, as I have been reading about it and talking to various individuals, I do not like the answers I am getting. I was under the impression if there was a god, and you died, you would go to heaven if you were a "good" boy, etc. Nope - not according to the religious people I have talked to and the scriptures I have read. I have to wait until the resurrection (which hasn't happened yet in 2k years since Jesus died), to be judged. Even then, Matthew 22 says that people won't be married anymore. Again, not what I want. All I am looking for in an afterlife is to be with my wife and children (when they get there after living a long great life!). Since it doens't look like this is what the main-streamers think will happen, I need to maximize my time here now!! Sorry for going into a tangent there, and I don't want to get into religion on this site, but I am just terrified now.

A few questions.

1) My Oxycodone 30mg IR looks to be a white pill. It could be a very lite tinted blue, but nothing like the pictures blue I have seen on google. It really looks white. The pill looks identical to the blue one; round with an M in a square on one side, and 30 over the cut line on the back. Why can't I find a white pill like this on the net (could be my bad google skills) - it just seems like they are all a good darker shade of blue. Mine clearly isn't.

2) I was worried about #1 - as I wanted to just clarify what in the hell I have. I have been taking them all orally with soda or water, but thinking about changing it up? I am not going to snort or IV it - sorry. But I have read that chewing them can help? I know people use to crush or chew the ER stuff, before they made it plastic-ish to prevent addicts from doing that. I don't want to mess with my RED Oxycontin 60 mgs ERs, but want to figure out how to make the 60 or 90 MG of Oxycodone I am taking work better?

I am coming up to my two hour window here, and I guess I will try 60 vs 90, and chew them? Any immediate feedback would be extremely helpful.

3) I have been reading about OD symptoms; specifically issues with CNS. Heart attack, respitory depression, Oxygen C02 count, blood pressure, etc. I was wondering what I could buy from the local Pharmacy store to keep in check here. I can order a finger O2 reading device or an automatic blood pressure checker/cuff - if anyone here believes that would help identify any potential OD issues? I am just afraid that the typical signs are not apparent for me, until I cross that line.

I wanted to thank each and every one of you for your assistance. It means a lot to me that you would take time out of your day and provide some feedback, helping me continue to live.

Thanks,
Anonymous Joe.
 
You know, right, that opiates do not generally work for neurological pain?

You never even said what's wrong but I'm not sure what you're expecting here.
 
I feel so bad for you. Much love, from Florida. Have you tried the actiq fentanyl lollipop? Sounds like you need IR Fentanyl, nothing else to it..
 
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