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Heroin Heroin: Another drug that I really don't understand

plumbus-nine

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Its amazing that people automatically think that if one drug works for most people that it should work for them. Our brains and chemisty is unique to each other and should never presume something is ok because other people can take it.
+1
Unfortunately too many health professionals, judges, etc.pp. believe exactly this.

Fully agreed, drugs are just tools. They can't do anything our body couldn't on it's own (it just tends not to do these things in these moments we want them), like keys and locks. Or the red button and the finger.. Also good & bad is very relative depending on your individual situation, experience and point of view. People tend to forget these points.
 

hylite

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I am going to take a little bit of oxycodone with some milder opioid that I already took. It always seems to knock me into orbit but ,aybe it is just because I am was run down or lacking sleep.
Hopefully I am not drugging myself too badly but fuck it. I am tired of being on the edge of DEATH from pain.
God. The sad thing is that I am going to live.
 

hylite

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Hopefully I can just nod out instead though. I ran out of dabs. I think that I might have just a bit of resin somewhere. That always helps with prolonging the pain relief too. Maybe the heat will help with some sleep. It's been like over 100 forever now.

Heroine is filled with too much dangerous residue. For mho.
 

lovemissile66

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Mar 22, 2018
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Yeah, instead I got a huge Benzo addiction, and if I ran out of pills and I go WD, I can die, sounds better right?... I guess it's the same stuff at the end.

I experienced Benzo WD 2x times and it was horrible. The second time I literally dissociated myself for days, it was a living nightmare, the scene from Trainspotting was nothing compared to what I experienced. Not even 4 tabs of LSD giving me a bad trip were remotely close to what I experienced. The solution to end all of that? Keep eating benzos :)
Hi Brickk!

just wondering how much benzos you are taking daily. I'm slowly becoming tolerant/dependent. But my love is heroin. And the first time I used it, I mainlined. Didn't get the big deal about it. It was the

second time, about a week later, that it was perfect for me. I've never puked from heroin and I have been using for 18 years. Its just the perfect fit for me, unfortunately. I get shit done and at night when

I finally go to sleep, that is when the nod comes. Its not until I am still, that I get that feeling. I fucking love and hate this drug. But I'm prescribed 1mg xanax and wondered about you.
 

brickk

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Okay, I accepted that everyone reacts different and I am probably the best example (or I just got ultra-garbage street Heroin).



But let's be real, how many of you have achieved these faces lol?


(Breaking Bad)


(Twin Peaks - 2019)


Thats something I would immediately associate with MDMA, not Heroin (again, my experience).

Also, take a look at this...

https://www.reddit.com/r/tooktoomuch/comments/nhuebe
I mean, that's a lot of difference, also also disinformation... If it wasn't for all that stupid media stuff with those faces, I would never have tried Heroin, I thought it was like MDMA but even more potent...I was just fine with MDMA (I am still fine with MDMA, but I feel scammed about the Heroin situation lol)

They make the "It's 100x better than an orgasm" as a 100% rule. It's not.
 

lovemissile66

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Okay, I accepted that everyone reacts different and I am probably the best example (or I just got ultra-garbage street Heroin).



But let's be real, how many of you have achieved these faces lol?


(Breaking Bad)


(Twin Peaks - 2019)


Thats something I would immediately associate with MDMA, not Heroin (again, my experience).

Also, take a look at this...

https://www.reddit.com/r/tooktoomuch/comments/nhuebe
I mean, that's a lot of difference, also also disinformation... If it wasn't for all that stupid media stuff with those faces, I would never have tried Heroin, I thought it was like MDMA but even more potent...I was just fine with MDMA (I am still fine with MDMA, but I feel scammed about the Heroin situation lol)

They make the "It's 100x better than an orgasm" as a 100% rule. It's not.
Okay, I accepted that everyone reacts different and I am probably the best example (or I just got ultra-garbage street Heroin).



But let's be real, how many of you have achieved these faces lol?


(Breaking Bad)


(Twin Peaks - 2019)


Thats something I would immediately associate with MDMA, not Heroin (again, my experience).

Also, take a look at this...

https://www.reddit.com/r/tooktoomuch/comments/nhuebe
I mean, that's a lot of difference, also also disinformation... If it wasn't for all that stupid media stuff with those faces, I would never have tried Heroin, I thought it was like MDMA but even more potent...I was just fine with MDMA (I am still fine with MDMA, but I feel scammed about the Heroin situation lol)

They make the "It's 100x better than an orgasm" as a 100% rule. It's not.
Ok see, I take offense to this pic! Because my aim with heroin was never to get fucking blotto. I used enough to feel comfortable and get on with my day. I really wasn't trying to kill myself with it. Although the drug has taken plenty from me, including my mate of 20 years. So. I've had some of the best raw out there and NEVER got like those dudes. They don't give a fuck.
 

OpiateKiller

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Nowadays USA “heroin” is trash on the wide spread scale with fentanyl destroying any real euphoria of real heroin and permanently tainting its image.

But even when I was puking sick as hell on real heroin from taking too much I was in heaven every second I never cared how sick it made me and couldn’t wait to do it again.

It is a warm heaven.
 

Xorkoth

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Your description sounds like a mild overdose, as in, not dangerous, but too much, which causes a lot of nausea and vomiting and ataxia and is pretty shitty, it also isn't very euphoric at all. A lower dose probably would have been a different story. But as others have said, consider yourself lucky because once you "get" opiates, for many there is no going back. Almost 20 years of my life (with 5 in the middle where I was clean and not struggling) has been spent struggling against opiate addiction. I have had shitty experiences, for example the first time I tried heroin, but by then I was already an opiate addict, just on weaker things. I didn't "get" opiates the first dozen or so times, because I was just eating 1-2 5mg hydrocodones and I am a natural hardhead to opiates and that little never did basically much of anything for me, even when I had no tolerance at all. Then I got into kratom, ironically, and my early experiences with the traditional tea method(which lets you consume more before you get the shitty side effects) had me feeling better than I've felt off of almost any other opiate ever since. And from there, that was it. Once I got a proper euphoric opiate high, I slowly increased my usage until I was addicted and it's been extremely hard to shake since then.
 

Athena777

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my personal story/ background accounts for my want to get hooked on heroin as well as benzos (which thanks to the doctors i was already extremely hooked on when all of sudden they cut almost everyone off cold turkey which most drug intellectuals should know.... can cause horrible and even deadly side effects.... mine are mostly siezures and body twitches that are basically convulsions while asleep. anyways... i digress.... so my personal mental health is very very severly fucked up. i have PTSD, BPD, DID, as well as agoraphobia and psychoaffective... so my life is constantly hell but the heroin helps numb not only the physical pain but the psychological as well.... that being said.... i hate fentanyl and always test my heroin for it. but i started out as most of us junkies have.... by being given perscription pain killers.... and when that became nearly impossible to get the legal route well heroin became our go-to... it was also cheaper and more available. well thats a little about my story.
 

Athena777

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Stronger opioids are only good when you're already addicted to them imho, there's really something about being too high and sick. I never got any nausea from (dia)morphine, but it made me feel ... weird. Like a sensation of impending doom of that I don't care the least about in the same time, but it's still there. Like a signal from my CNS, what you just took isn't good for you - might be an interpretation/nocebo effect, I was and am overly cautious of respiratory depression (actually got it more than once but it doesn't happen when titrating up specially nasally - really hope you're either snorting or smoking). There was even slight dysphoria. Other description might be more accurate, it takes away the natural pleasure you're been feeling every time even when you don't consciously feel it, and replaces that with artificial pleasure and warmth and carelessness. The feeling of not caring can be painful itself, as many people on antidepressants know. This also already gives you a taste of the withdrawal, which (besides some heavy CNS overreaction/dysbalance) consists of lack of pleasure.

Codeine was pleasurable without this discomfort, even when it's metabolized to the exact same substance, morphine - just at a slow rate and in little amounts. The surge in exogenous morphine causes a negative feedback and your body to stop producing endorphins, possibly enkephalins (which are antidepressant) too.
People in pain, be it physical or emotional, will feel more instant pleasure from taking a strong opioid, as do people in withdrawal (which imho isn't due to the body not producing endorphins, it will possibly produce even more of them than before addiction, but there are just too many receptors around as the body adjusted to them being constantly activated).

Yet even when people don't like it, they usually come back to H. Good question why, maybe you don't actually need to feel pleasure for your reward circuit to be activated - some say while dopamine motivates reward and pleasure, it itself isn't actually pleasurable, which then gives some room for philosophical discussions about whether "we" are just chemicals or not..

(Writing this while 100mg morphine begin to unveil their pleasurogenic effects. Remember, I didn't like H at first. But I did like O-DSMT, methadone [it has a slow onset, thus circumventing said adverse reaction] and codeine. I withdrew twice from higher doses of morphine, got more or less around the withdrawal, and am still using again. If you have the chance, run.)
Also having experiences with dissociatives, and possibly just different drugs before, might give one an advance over addiction. Might be a slight one but possibly relevant. Most people (I knew of) who were deep into H addiction didn't do dissos or psychedelics.

Also, acute opioid effects are pretty unlike these in chronic users for which imho secondary mechanisms like hormonal suppression are to blame for. Opioids can and do cause worse depression than they seem to treat in the beginning, even when they doubtlessly are effective antidepressants, even in the long run for some but here bupe is superior because of its kappa blocking effects. I'm still trying to find something to reverse the hormonal shit opioids caused in me - I lost any interest in sexuality, for example, even when I'm still able to 'perform'.
question reguarding the last part about lack of sex drive... do you ever experience an uncontrollable need to masturbate when coming down? because i cant stop myself from touching myself when im sick... like ill wake up with my hand in my lips unconsciously.... do you know what i mean? idk if guys experience it as well or maybe its just me altogether....
 

bingey

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I mastubate like every 2 hours when I'm in WD and it makes me feel terribly dirty, also I'll be done in like 20 seconds tops.

So yah happens to guys too
 

brickk

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Your description sounds like a mild overdose, as in, not dangerous, but too much, which causes a lot of nausea and vomiting and ataxia and is pretty shitty, it also isn't very euphoric at all. A lower dose probably would have been a different story. But as others have said, consider yourself lucky because once you "get" opiates, for many there is no going back. Almost 20 years of my life (with 5 in the middle where I was clean and not struggling) has been spent struggling against opiate addiction. I have had shitty experiences, for example the first time I tried heroin, but by then I was already an opiate addict, just on weaker things. I didn't "get" opiates the first dozen or so times, because I was just eating 1-2 5mg hydrocodones and I am a natural hardhead to opiates and that little never did basically much of anything for me, even when I had no tolerance at all. Then I got into kratom, ironically, and my early experiences with the traditional tea method(which lets you consume more before you get the shitty side effects) had me feeling better than I've felt off of almost any other opiate ever since. And from there, that was it. Once I got a proper euphoric opiate high, I slowly increased my usage until I was addicted and it's been extremely hard to shake since then.
Not really overdose imho, I had multiple past experiences with Opioids and Heroin, and the last assumption was a ""line"" (double quotes because it was so tiny that it would be an heresy call it a line). Just shitty stuff, that's it.
It's literally impossible that I got an awful experience because of too much dosage, again the line was so small, just because I wanted to be careful, even if I had Oxy/Opioids tolerance since weeks.

The only real time that I OD was on Methadone, as soon as I took a sip from the bottle I fainted and blacked out for 4 hours straight and when I woke up the last thing I remember was me drinking it. And 0 nausea btw. I skipped directly the nodding phase and fainted immediately. Kinda stupid and risky, I already know.

With Oxycodone, Tapentadol, Subutex I went (i think) near OD, I mean I was nodding really hard but didn't black out 100%, I was just awaken->asleep->awaken->asleep for the entire time. Never fainted/blacked out completely, and never felt nausea. Just some little confusion in my head, having difficulties to concentrate and yea kinda falling asleep.

Also, the itching, god I hated it on Heroin. Every, single, time.

With pharma Opioids I never itched, with Heroin everytime I felt like shit and I was constantly scratching everywhere.

I can agree that from some Opioid-addicted PoV, I'm lucky that I didn't get hooked, but as a 8+? years Benzos addict, I could say the same to people who don't understand/like Benzos.

I got hooked since the first pill (Clonazepam), went into WD several times and I think overall, they are more dangerous than Heroin. The WD are a nightmare at open eyes that no one should experience.
And well I think Heroin WD can be painful too, but correct me if I'm wrong, you can't die. You die from OD not from WD. With Benzos you die from WD and not from OD (speaking of only benzo, not benzo +alcohol or other shit).
At least this is according to my knowledge and experience, but feel free to correct me, it's important to not spread false rumors.
 

Xorkoth

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question reguarding the last part about lack of sex drive... do you ever experience an uncontrollable need to masturbate when coming down? because i cant stop myself from touching myself when im sick... like ill wake up with my hand in my lips unconsciously.... do you know what i mean? idk if guys experience it as well or maybe its just me altogether....

Oh yeah, happens to guys too. Sex drive comes back with a vengeance but as a guy you last like 30 seconds tops. But can do it pretty often since you're so horny. Gives a nice few minutes of relief from the dopamine rush, I assume, and the full body relaxation afterwards. When I'm laying in bed thrashing in withdrawal I often will try to rub one out and occasionally I can actually relax and get a little sleep after.... the best is a long hot shower, masturbate at the end, immediately get into bed.
 

Xorkoth

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I got hooked since the first pill (Clonazepam), went into WD several times and I think overall, they are more dangerous than Heroin. The WD are a nightmare at open eyes that no one should experience.
And well I think Heroin WD can be painful too, but correct me if I'm wrong, you can't die. You die from OD not from WD. With Benzos you die from WD and not from OD (speaking of only benzo, not benzo +alcohol or other shit).
At least this is according to my knowledge and experience, but feel free to correct me, it's important to not spread false rumors.

This is generally the but people HAVE died from severe withdrawal, mostly though it's because of other factors, ie, your health is very bad to begin with and it becomes too much for you. It's very rare though. Benzo withdrawal is way more dangerous (any gabaergic withdrawal actually)
 

S.J.B.

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I always puked a ton but some of the strongest nostalgia in my life is from a period of opioid use. It's hard to describe, but it somehow makes doing pretty much nothing feel deeply romantic. I've sampled the whole pharmacopoeia, much of it beyond a reasonable extent, but haven't done much of anything for years. If I were to jump back into doing drugs tomorrow my immediate choice would be opioids. I feel like it's a sort of inevitable destination for polydrug users.

The physical stimulation does not compare to MDMA and the rush is nothing compared to IV methamphetamine. But that's not really what it's about.
 

bingey

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This is generally the but people HAVE died from severe withdrawal, mostly though it's because of other factors, ie, your health is very bad to begin with and it becomes too much for you. It's very rare though. Benzo withdrawal is way more dangerous (any gabaergic withdrawal actually)
Yes, in severe withdrawal the risk of dehydration to the point of dying is also always present even for a healthy person.
 

JessFR

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So my first assumption was in 2018 I think, based on the movies (which are exaggerated of course) and popular believe, I thought it was going to feel me warm inside, full of love and stuff...kinda like mdma but more potent.
The result was me puking for hours and having difficulties to concentrate on anything, itching everywhere and this constant nausea that wasn't going away, and there wasn't one single positive effect in the whole experience (rush, peak, down...all garbage).

Obviously I tried it again, expecting different results, but no I puked again like crazy and I decided to flush the whole bag down the toilet. Since that day I never touched that stuff again.
Let me just say that I have experience with Oxycodone, Tapentadol, Methadone and that is was I call a good "nod". I can't say that there was a rush of -love- like on mdma, but the experience was pleasant. I can't say the same with Heroin.

And in 99% of cases, when I try a drug for the first time, it's always a yes/no. MDMA was immediately a huge YES, same with Ketamine and Speed (amphetamine). Then there are benzos and other stuff (Clonazepam is my friend since day1...tried every other benzo and at the end I always stuck with Clonazepam and occasionally Alprazolam).

So, I don't think I need to tryhard the same substance over and over again to understand it, I repeat, for me the first assumption always tell me if the drug is good or bad.

Not saying that is a rule for everyone, maybe it's my body reacting in a different way, but the moral of the story is yesterday, after more than 1 year, I was bored as hell so I bought Heroin.
Same color, same putrid smell that I remember...and same vomit and nausea for the whole day. 0 positive effects. I really don't understand where is the flash/rush... where is the peak (oh maybe I know, when you keep scratching all over your body for no reason? Yeah what a beautiful experience, kinda like the MDMA peak....jk), the comedown is horrible too, I couldn't kill the effects with any benzo or stuff and I just wanted to sleep and stop the nausea. So yeah, toilet flush here we go again.

Can you tell me what (some of) you find so special in Heroin, that you can't find in Oxycodone, or other Opioids, or maybe some Benzo? Literally, its the WORSE I've ever tried.
Personally I'm an upper/psychedelic guy, so I'm for MDMA, K, Speed, LSD, and stuff like that, so maybe I can't understand you....like we see the world from a different prospective. Even though, I appreciate some downers like Benzo or in rare case Antipsycothics when I want to get knocked out. But well Heroin is just no, no and no again. Im okay for some Oxy if I'm extremely bored, or some Methadone, but I don't want to touch that again, only thinking of it and its smell makes me vomit.


I personally got hooked to Speed-Amphetamine for 4 years (sober since 2018 )...and to Benzos since almost 8 years (this stuff is the devil, can't quit it) so yeah, to each its own addiction. I like speed because it is a cheaper MDMA that I could use daily without damaging the brain too much (I mean for sure it isn't healthy, but MDMA needs 2 months to recover serotonine...) also speed was giving me energy and social skills, while benzos keep me quiet if Im nervous and they help me to sleep, and I also love the flavour of them, these are my addiction reasons.

Obviously I don't want to offend anyone, but I'm just curious what makes you hooked to something like Heroin (rather than Oxy, Tapentadol, Morphine..or anything else that I refer as "First Class Opioids").

Ok well first off, forget about feeling any kind of love or empathogenic effects like you get with MDMA or sometimes some other amphetamines, opioids don't do that.

Opioids make you feel warm and safe and comfortable, they don't really change how you think other than by removing pain and replacing it with a euphoric, warm comfort. And by making you sleepy.

Also, if you live in north america, there's every chance the heroin you've tried isn't heroin by fentanyl.

I love heroin, I've been a heroin addict a long time (where I live we don't yet have a big fentanyl problem). Some people do get nausea and itching when they first try opioids, and some opioids cause it more than others, but it's not universal, I've never had much in the way of nausea and even less with itching.

I love opioids because they make me feel good, they make me feel content, they take away any misery I'm feeling and replace it with comfort. As much as they have destroyed nearly everything good in my life at one point, I can't honestly say I don't love them. And I love heroin because of its rush of that feeling when I shoot it. It's one of the most euphoric opioids to me.

That's what hooked me, combined with the horrible withdrawal, from the moment I tried opioids I was in love with the feeling, and that that feeling replaced more negative feelings in my head.

Opioids aren't for everyone though, and frankly I've heard of people who initially didn't like them but kept playing with fire and ended up hooked, so I'd quit while you're ahead.

To me it's the reverse, I can't understand how anyone can NOT love opioids or heroin (assuming it's actually heroin). But they may not be having the same experience I am. In the same way as I probably don't love benzos as much as other people because my anxiety isn't as bad, you're probably more likely to enjoy opioids if you feel in pain, physical or emotional, so much of the time and they replace them with feeling good.

EDIT: Opioids aren't really a party drug, they won't do the kinda things that amphetamine related drugs do. Opioids, to me anyway, are more a support drug. I love them because for much of my life it felt like they were the only thing that helped me get through the shit I was going through. They made me feel good and able to tolerate otherwise intolerable conditions.

You can also forget about movie depictions. Nearly everything opioids do are so internal and subtle that they can't be interestingly depicted. The feeling can't be easily described. They feel like a very enhanced version of the comfort you get waking up on a weekend morning nice and warm in your bed, maybe on a rainy day, with nothing to worry about, drifting in and out of sleep.

That's what opioids feel like, warm comfortable contentment on demand, and that's not something you can easily and interestingly depict in media.
 
Last edited:

JessFR

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This is generally the but people HAVE died from severe withdrawal, mostly though it's because of other factors, ie, your health is very bad to begin with and it becomes too much for you. It's very rare though. Benzo withdrawal is way more dangerous (any gabaergic withdrawal actually)

Yes. Saying you can't die from opioid withdrawal is something of a myth IMO.

You are unlikely to die of opioid withdrawal, but if it's a really bad withdrawal, and you're not medically supervised, it can happen. From fluid loss messing with your electrolytes messing with your heart and other shit. Especially in people who are already more likely to not be in the best state of health to start with.
 

emkee_reinvented

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Oh, I'm offended OP. Nobody talks about my ex-wife like that. Even if she is a wicked bitch, she still is a person.

There's nothing really to understand here. Different strokes for different folks. I think you probably just got too high and got sick. It's pretty common, especially with illicit Heroin. One of my first experiences with Heroin was being violently sick for like a full 12 hours. It's funny looking back on it now, but it was definitely uncomfortable at the time. I had the strongest urge to keep smoking buts and everytime I would light one and inhale, I'd puke after two seconds and say "well, we don't do that again", only to nod out, wake up and light another but. My face was itching so bad that my nose was absolutely raw by the time morning came around.

You don't need to solve every mystery. Maybe you like Heroin and maybe you don't. Some people love Tennis but hate Squash whereas I, personally ask, "what's the big deal, aren't they both sports where you hit a ball with a racket"? You could spend your whole life wondering what made some people like Tennis and some people like Squash, but it would probably make you happier just to find out the sports that you like and to enjoy those sports.

I'm not condescending or anything. I've often asked myself the same questions. Why do some people love Benzodiazepines? Why do some people prefer Alcohol over a shot of Morphine. We are all different.
this sums it up nicely this and the reply freom Bingey. Its a comforting high somehow. Talking bout 0-DSMT as i have no exp with Heroin.

As it will have you scratch your nose off, allmost. But it will feel comforting to do so. Never saw anyone do that on MDMA. The nex day you wonder what did i do to my nose. and what was that itch between my leg's on my scalp going on for hours.

And why did i enjoy it?
 
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