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Opioids Have YOU experienced precipitated WD's when IVing Suboxone w/ no other opiates in U?

Have YOU experienced precipitated WD's when IVing suboxone w/ no other opiates in U?

  • Yes, IV suboxone put me into precipitate withdrawals

    Votes: 6 13.6%

  • No, I did not experience precipitated withdrawals from IV suboxone

    Votes: 36 81.8%

  • Yes, but am not sure if I waited long enough after other opiates

    Votes: 2 4.5%
  • Total voters
    44
It can also be caused by naloxone kicking bupe off the receptors, it would seem. Usually this requires a higher dose than you get in suboxone, but apparently that isn't the case for me (and I've spoken to others who've also experienced it). There's a very immediate, obvious difference between precipitated withdrawal and an allergic reaction.
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Not necessarily an allergic reaction. Naloxone and other opioid antagonists are sometimes viewed as inverse agonists rather than plain antagonists. It would seem more probable for me. Then the reaction to naloxone from Suboxone (through whatever route of administration) wouldn't be an allergic reaction, but a normal reaction a lot of people have. I can definitely feel naloxone from Suboxone and it's after s.l. administration, I've never shot it up. The symptoms match reported naloxone effects. Naloxone kicks in faster than buprenorphine does, so I can imagine it's quite a sweaty unpleasant "rush" after i.v.'ing for some people, before naloxone is forced out of receptors by buprenorphine, it first binds for a short period of time. This however shouldn't be the case after prolonged usage as in case of maintenance when eventually your receptors become pretty much saturated with buprenorphine even when you take another dose 24 hours later.

I read that the real limit for buprenorphine is around 8mg, i.e. with increasing the dose, one doesn't get any more effects (when used for pain relief that means there's no more analgesic effect beyond 8mg). The reason for higher doses is just making receptors saturated for a longer period of time. If that's the case, then at a lower dose like 1mg or 2mg buprenorphine wouldn't saturate enough receptors, and naloxone thus may cause unpleasant effects. I noticed that at e.g. 8mg/2mg all I felt from naloxone was in my intestines, but at 2mg/0.5mg I would also get slightly anxious and sweaty shortly after putting the pill under my tongue (too soon for buprenorphine effects) and I would get a bad headache that would unfortunately continue even when buprenorphine finally kicks in and the sweating thing is gone interestingly.

PS. I did take just buprenorphine without naloxone a few years earlier and I can tell that naloxone effects from Suboxone aren't self-suggestion for sure.
 
Subutex def feels different from suboxone, even taken sublingualy. Everybody I know feels the same way; can anybody explain why?
(My keyworker tells me it's in my head, or "self-suggestion".
 
I always IV my suboxone. I had a friend give me 2(8) mg subtex and when I IVed it, it most certainly felt different. It wasn't intense or more euphoric per say but did indeed did feel better. I thought maybe placebo but had my girl fill 6 empty syringes with 3 containing suboxone and 3 subtex and only she knew which ones were which. I was able to identify subtex from suboxone all three times from effects felt so it can't be placebo. I can't explain why. I always wondered if it might be that naloxone gets there first and bupe slowly displaces it causing and even further delay. No idea. Even in WDs IV bupe takes for me a solid 5-10 minutes to banish the sickness where as H is 2-5 sec or instant.
 
StartedHydro said:
I always IV my suboxone. I had a friend give me 2(8) mg subtex and when I IVed it, it most certainly felt different. It wasn't intense or more euphoric per say but did indeed did feel better. I thought maybe placebo but had my girl fill 6 empty syringes with 3 containing suboxone and 3 subtex and only she knew which ones were which. I was able to identify subtex from suboxone all three times from effects felt so it can't be placebo. I can't explain why. I always wondered if it might be that naloxone gets there first and bupe slowly displaces it causing and even further delay. No idea. Even in WDs IV bupe takes for me a solid 5-10 minutes to banish the sickness where as H is 2-5 sec or instant.
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Are you sure you weren't able to tell the difference by the taste? Everyone I know that has IV'd suboxone says they still taste it in their mouth, so I don't see how your experiment would have been completely 'blind.'
 
i dont see why this is a poll. unless you have an very different reaction to drugs IV suboxone shouldnt react differently than any other ROA

and either way precips only come from an addict having another opiate keeping them"well" in their system and the precips come from the bupe ripping it out of their receptors

what am i missing?
 
RedRum OG said:
i dont see why this is a poll. unless you have an very different reaction to drugs IV suboxone shouldnt react differently than any other ROA

and either way precips only come from an addict having another opiate keeping them"well" in their system and the precips come from the bupe ripping it out of their receptors

what am i missing?
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Some people (only a few here and there) claim otherwise. I think someone posted about it in here.

I also did it for all the doctors out there that refuse to prescribe the cheaper subutex instead of suboxone because they are still under the impression that you can't IV suboxone ever, making it safer than subutex in their eyes. It's also for the patients that may want to show this to their doctor so they can get subutex prescribed if they can't afford suboxone (though there would need to be more replies for this to be more reputable).
 
Tommyboy said:
Are you sure you weren't able to tell the difference by the taste? Everyone I know that has IV'd suboxone says they still taste it in their mouth, so I don't see how your experiment would have been completely 'blind.'
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Taste? I have never been able to "taste" anything after I IVed said substance. Not Heroin, Amp, tramadol, coke, nothing. So it couldn't had been by taste.

To me its just a very subtle difference, nothing profound.
 
I got precipitated withdrawal from injecting subuxone once after waiting 72 hours after taking methadone. It was probably not enough time though, as I never get precipitated withdrawal otherwise.

However I feel the subuxone should not be injected. I've injected it 5 times I think or something and 2 of those times I have gotten cotton fever, something that never happens with other pills. I don't know if it's the orange flavouring or whatever that's bad for you IV'ed but something is certainly iffy with injecting these pills.
 
Precipitated withdrawal is a different phenomenon to a simple reaction to naloxone which in my opinion being an inverse agonist can bring about unpleasant effects even to those who were once physically addicted, but then recovered and aren't physically dependent at the time of naloxone ingestion. However, naloxone was also proved to block endogenous opioids analgesic effects, this further may be an evidence that naloxone truly causes unpleasant effects (or if you prefer, "dysphoria" as opposed to morphine-like drugs' "euphoria") on its own, no physical dependence necessary for this. Thus, the problem with naloxone is not exclusively related to its ability to cause precipitated withdrawal in people having recently ceased their opioid agonist use prior to naloxone ingestion.

I wonder if this couldn't be confronted with possible low-dose naltrexone side effects. And I wonder if any of reported positive naltrexone reactions during low-dose naltrexone treatment aren't by chance related to kappa antagonism that would bring about some antidepressant effects just like in case of buprenorphine.

I don't know if it's the orange flavouring or whatever that's bad for you IV'ed but something is certainly iffy with injecting these pills.
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Where I live, Suboxone are white pills with lime-lemon flavouring (more like bitter lime if anything at all, definitely not lime-lemon, and not orange either). I saw Suboxone pills in a different colour on the web, so I guess the flavouring agents in the pills have nothing to do with it all.
 
Well no but Iv subutex is a lot better than Iv suboxone nonetheless.

When I take suboxone regardless of ROA I get like a mini-5 min withdrawal before I start to feel good and warm. I'm guessing i'm extremely sensitive to naloxone. Or maybe it's the bupe knocking off the norbupe thing. My subutex shooting days are far behind me so maybe I'm not comparing the 2 objectively.
 
It's surely because the naloxone acts faster and then is displaced by the bupe when used IV or even snorted....honestly I only feel good now after my switch when I take 10mg sublingually, this way I can't feel the naloxone much, except that it will make me want to poop which is a good thing, with methadone I was scripted 4 different medication for constipation...

Toz said:
I got precipitated withdrawal from injecting subuxone once after waiting 72 hours after taking methadone. It was probably not enough time though, as I never get precipitated withdrawal otherwise.

However I feel the subuxone should not be injected. I've injected it 5 times I think or something and 2 of those times I have gotten cotton fever, something that never happens with other pills. I don't know if it's the orange flavouring or whatever that's bad for you IV'ed but something is certainly iffy with injecting these pills.
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Interesting, our suboxone in canada is white, exactly like yours but white, I don't even know if we have subutex at all, I know we have BuTrans patches. Subutex seems like a poor choice for pain problems, here docs just throw dilaudid at people and HM Contin, easier to get than empracets (codeine + tylenol), pure codeine pills, codeine contin, tramadol (it's not paid for by gov insurance so most doctors don't bother with it, I once asked for it at the ER and she was like, you mean tramacet ? this has tylenol in it, is it ok with you ? lol, I almost seized after taking 300mg and I walked back to the ER in the middle of the night a few nights later in a winter snow storm to have it changed back to empracets...but that is totally unrelated) Just pointing out how a lot of things seem different here.

As for injection, I tried it last week when I got it first, not worth it, i got chest pain a little after a 4th shot and never did it again ever. I used SteriFilts too...don't know what the deal is, but I have no interest in doing that anymore, I was injecting 1/6 of a 2mg to test the norbupe theory. I shot dilaudid with regular cottons they give with the injection kits (if you don't ask for sterifilts) tons before (brand name) and never got chest pain from that. Thankfully nothing happened and it didn't recur(sp).

and Yeah the suboxone is just like in Poland for me too....tastes like Mr.Clean...
 
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Hi guys
Sorry couldn't find a thread on this let alone some current one's, I'm a ex addict, heroin)I wear a Fent patch and don't mess around, I don't Iv anything anymore. My tolerance is so high its disturbing. Anyway I fight everyday as I get oxys 20ml I'M NO acetametaphine or anything. So I do snort a 20 or two in the mornings. Then I am taking about 80ml total a day for Chonic pain, I always Iv'ed drugs if they would break down, don't have no desire to do so, but do snort them everytime, should I not snort them all the time just for health or hole in nose reasons? I mean I have read on here people shorting offs for years. I know everyone is different. Any advise cuz I love the euphoria.
 
no, but the one time i iv'd i had a crazy, scary, o/d-like rush. In fact, ems came, but by the time they arrived it was finally subsiding so they just did an ekg and gave me a lecture. Anyone else have this happen?
 
When my subutex supplier was busted, I tried shooting my suboxone. (I had a needle fetish at the time, and was feeling desperate). It didn't give me precip wd's, but it sure as hell didn't give me anywhere near the effects I was use to from subutex. It didn't seem to really have an effect, actually.
 
If u have been kicking suboxone 3 days but during the WD period was using tagament n lope, would taking 1 mg subutex put me very behind in kicking the habit? I start a new job tomorrow n have heard that day 4 and on is hell.... any advice??
 
I didn't read the entire thread, but is there anybody else who does NOT get precipitated withdrawals from suboxone, period? I have dosed hours after an oxy habit on multiple occasions, and have never experienced any adverse effects.
 
My friend says he gets them primarily only with IV use, and only after doing true opiates for a couple of days. Something like Morphine. Then, for 15 minutes after his first shot, he feels like shit, sweaty, little nauseous, etc.

On the other hand, he can take Bupe first, then take opiates and is a-ok.

He thinks it was on Bupe only (subutex) that would make him sick if doing it after a few days of Morphine. As, Subutex is what he was prescribed and all he really did.
 
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