Give up your pill

[Stuart]

i was thinking, once laboratory testing is introduced in Australia (im trying to be positive!!) who here would send in one of there pills that you have payed *insert amount of money here* to get tested by a laboratory for the benefit of others.

i can see a lot of people not wanting to 'waste' a pill just to get a laboratory test on it...

what is your opinions on it, who would be willing to donate some of there weekend fun for the greater good of harm reduction!

 

[lok1]

Me.

 

[Rubber_Duck]

Interesting question.

i assume, they would test the pills in similar way that we do, but with more complicated chemicals. I only use a couple crumbs of my pill.

SO id send them, the un-licked baggy, that should be enough in there. hehe

 

[charlesbronson]

if australia had a public submission testing program, you could probably expect it to work much like the US version - ecstasydata.org

that would mean you would have to submit a whole pill - so (sadly) no crumbs for testing while the greater portion waits to be gobbled once the results come through.

and as far as $ sacrifices go, without a fully funded operation, you could expect to submit not only one of your disco-bizkits , but also a 'co-payment'. how much? that would depend on the amount of funding from other sources supporting the program. ecstasydata.org request a US$30 copayment, but at the moment the only option is US$115, which is the full cost of having a pill tested, because they are out of funds.

personally, i'd be willing to dish out a pill for testing, especially if the actual amount of active components were published, rather than just the ratio of active chemicals.

does someone know how other public-submission lab testing projects operate?

 

[Tronica]

In the UK, they had an amnesty bin operating in a nightclub - people would donate pills and other drugs - then the contents of the bin was taken away, tested and published. They obviously pay a lot less for their drugs in the UK to make this work.

In the Netherlands, the Drug Information Monitoring System (DIMS) involves anonymous providers bringing drug samples to different offices who provide testing facilities. Information about content is given orally and only on the drug samples they personally delivered, however if a highly dangerous tablet is analysed, warnings are issued quickly and widely. My understanding is that the samples are not returned - they are destroyed.

It might be difficult to ID a pill based on a sample of crumbs - but it would be possible to test the content of the crumbs I'd imagine.

 

[phase_dancer]

A whole pill or least a relatively large amount would be desirable for lab testing. This is because some substances, particularly some amines are hard to extract and test for using HPLC or GC/MS (the considered standard). Sometimes derivatives have to be made and several runs be done.

As for who would send in a whole pill for testing; I'm sure dealers everywhere would be keen as mustard ......

That statement, or words to that effect have been bandied about in some corners of the outspoken opposition to lab testing.

And within that above statement is another school of thought on the virtues or otherwise of testing this way. Although I don't agree with this approach, there is nonetheless some merit to the idea of only releasing the results of pills other than those which contain MDMA. This would tend to limit those dealers wanting a free add for pill X, "...now proven by lab science to only contain MDMA"

Weak as it may sound, you can bet opponents to lab testing will raise this argument.

 

[ar_gee]

I would give the odd one if all stat's are provided.

Surely, there would be legal implications for sending drug's through the mail - how would you get around that?

Sounds like a good idea in theory, but there is a lot of other related issues involved.

 

[eggman]

Excellent point. Given the prices paid in Aus compared to Europe for example, the comparisson of any such program that *may/may not* happen here to those programs in Europe would be flawed. Whilst personally I would do it, i could imagine that 200 others would not. As such, our data would really be lacking

Same question goes for people who have thier pills tested by groups like enlighten for example. From what I have seen and been told many of the people who have been told that thier pill contains some bad shit still take it!

 

[phase_dancer]

The logistics involved in getting the pills to a testing facility have been discussed before. The most sensible thing to do would be to have an amnesty bin as Tronica has mentioned. Mailing would be out of the question unless special provisions were made. It is a federal offense to send drugs through the mail.

Just where these would be located, and just who they would be run by is another subject of possible contention. That meaning the authorities if ever in agreement, would most likely would want an authorized body such as the police to handle it, whereas the wider community would probably prefer a group such as Enlighten.

 

[Tronica]

Same question goes for people who have thier pills tested by groups like enlighten for example. From what I have seen and been told many of the people who have been told that thier pill contains some bad shit still take it!

I do wonder why people would bother to get the pill tested if they are just going to take it anyway. Depends on the individual's definition of 'bad shit', whether ketamine is bad or just different, whether to take a speed bomb, etc. Especially if you've already bought the pill, and you are familiar with the effects of speed or K, I'd imagine you'd still take it - even though others might see that as strange because the pill was meant to be ecstasy...

As to why people would take a pill that has had no reaction to a marquis or mandelin test, well that has me pretty confused!

 

[Tronica]

Although I don't agree with this approach, there is nonetheless some merit to the idea of only releasing the results of pills other than those which contain MDMA. This would tend to limit those dealers wanting a free add for pill X, "...now proven by lab science to only contain MDMA"

Weak as it may sound, you can bet opponents to lab testing will raise this argument. [/B]

For this very reason, the DIMS system (from the netherlands) only releases infomration on pills considered to be very dangerous - including those with very high MDMA. Being this system is the most sophisticated in the world, I wonder if an approved service anywhere would be able to release all information. Being approved has meant they have access to the laboratories, the staff, the funding... and it does get around the issue BT has described above - providing precise info on 'awesome pills' is great advertising for dealers.

Then again, if users could purchase better pills with this information - then perhaps there would be less shite pills - and this would reduce drug related harm in the long run

 

[dada]

imagine a policeman posted at an amnisty bin just cuffing cunts who extended their hand

 

[aBitOfAWorry]

I would submit pills but only if they failed to show MDMA with the standard reagent tests.

How easy would it be for a lab to determine the quantity of a substance in a pill? Eg your submitted pill has 120mg MDMA? This would be more valuable information in terms of dosage etc but I imagine very hard to do.

 

[Cheshire Cat ^..^]

How easy would it be for a lab to determine the quantity of a substance in a pill?

It's not about whether it's easy or not. It's about the fact that a proper lab with GC/MS will give you exact percentages on every chemical present in a substance and the exact mass.

Just because of that I'm ready to spend 50$ and sometimes even more in order to definately know what substances are inside that pill.

Everyone says harm minimisation. Anti-prohibition. Etc. Well, boys and girls, this is where it starts. With knowledge.

 

[phase_dancer]

How easy would it be for a lab to determine the quantity of a substance in a pill? Eg your submitted pill has 120mg MDMA? This would be more valuable information in terms of dosage etc but I imagine very hard to do.

Nah, it's pretty easy really. In principle, the drug is extracted (usually with an optimised, buffered solution). It's then run through the GC/MS. It's retention time and mass spectra are noted. Different substances have different retention times at particular settings on the chromatograph.

A known quantity of a pure sample of the chemical that the peaks are thought to represent is then run through the machine. The height/area of the GC peaks of unknown are compared against the height of the known sample, and presto, the amount in the unknown is established.

 

[Black Octagon]

I'd definitely do it.

 

[chugs]

wouldn't it just be easier for the state to produce MDMA instead of modifying the crimes act and pushing through huge amounts of legislation whilst trying to make other drugs illegal - why stop at MDMA, why not heroin testing or coke testing?

 

[fcuking_in_heaven]

I'm pretty sure any 'decent' big time dealer/manufacturer would love to be able to submit their pills in for testing just to add a coupl of dollars for the real deal. No one in their right mind woukd buy thousands of bunk pills. They would much rather pay a higher price for a better quality product, that can be proved. You get what im sayin?

fuck in heaven

 

[eggman]

wouldn't it just be easier for the state to produce MDMA instead of modifying the crimes act and pushing through huge amounts of legislation whilst trying to make other drugs illegal - why stop at MDMA, why not heroin testing or coke testing?

^ and there is the sensible answer to this whole arguement.

Govt produced pills, supplied in a pack of 25 pills with the % content of MDMA, K and Amphetimine listed on the side of the packet.

Hang on... I just woke up from a dream, thats 'safe' and 'tax revenue producing' drugs like alcohol and tobacco I am thinking of, sorry! 8(

 

[che_melbourne]

^^^ wouldnt that just induce drug spiking and lacing instead of drink spiking and cig lacing

but if this system worked like pillreports, posting the size and pic of a pill and its contents, wouldnt that just cause shit pills getting pressed alike? if the results wern't released public and the donor got a printout of the contents, couldnt this printout be re-used to promote a shit pill. this system in the end does not help dealing other than a large quantity buy where the buyer can get one pill sent off whilst the rest stay in holding where they cannot be switched. it does however help the end user, letting them know exactly what they are taking except.... oops.... you dont have anything to take and the ~150 u just spent on the pill and its testing could have been put to better use buying more drugs. unless the costs of pills being tested are covered or subsidised then i dont see this taking off