Opioids From Tilidine to Dihydrocodeine

[LimitSeethe]

Hello Bluelight forum,

Im new to this but i've been reading alot in your forum and now I could not resist and had to make an account
to contribute my knowledge to this community.

But I will start off with a question :

Im consuming Tilidine now for over 2 years, I got it prescribed for pain.
(its rare in other countrys but in germany its often used)

My daily dosage is : 100mg in the morning, 150mg in the afternoon and 200mg in the evening (increasing the dosage from morning to evening secures that I always get a kick)

Now my doctor went unexspected to holiday and I was visiting another doctor since I ran off Tilidine.
He prescribes me DHC 100x 30mg (Actavis)
I've read alot about DHC and was interested and tried to get high on it.

Careful as I am I started with 150mg (5 pills) and felt nothing.

The next day I've been trying 210mg with Grapefruit juice - still no euphoria just a little bit chilled/warm analgesic feeling.

The last day I took 240mg , still the same warm feeling but no sign of euphoria.

I was wondering if I do something wrong ? Tilidine has about the same anagesic power as DHC (0.18 off morphine)
(Tilidin has btw a strong euphoria, alot stronger rush than morphine or oxycodone (tried both of them once)

Do I need to take a higher dosage to feel some happiness or maybe even plug the DHC? (I read some threads about plugging DHC in this forum, not sure if it will work for me)

I would appreciate some help from this intelligent forum
(Of course I will contribute to this community whenever I can , I want to become a real member)


Sorry if my english is not the best and if I did something wrong let me know!


Greetings from Germany

 

[cuivre]

I'm not totally sure if plugging will work with this form of DHC but I don't see why it wouldn't. They don't sound like extended release.

I'm not that familiar with Tilidine because as you said it's mostly used in Germany, Switzerland, and a couple other countries. From what I've read though, it sounds like it has a crazy fast onset with oral use which I suspect might be part of the problem. I would guess it's taking a lot longer for the DHC to kick in by mouth than the Tilidine, no? If you're taking two things that have roughly the same potency and one kicks in a lot quicker, chances are that one will feel stronger Plugging the DHC would bring it close to Tilidine oral in terms of how quickly it kicks in.

But... is your doctor coming back, and is he going to probably switch you back to Tilidine? How long are these DHC supposed to last you? If it's only a short term thing idk if I'd bother getting into the plugging or much else. You can take an antacid before oral use which might help, and may as well keep trying the WGFJ. I plug a lot myself so believe me I have no real issue if that's what you decided to do. I just think it's unnecessary if you're going right back to a drug that works just fine by mouth. Then again, returning to the Tilidine may make you want to try the plugging more as you know it will be short term.

Lastly, there is a reason people have preference for certain opioids. Some are just more enjoyable for some than others. DHC may simply not be your bag, but if you're determined to get it to work and the Tilidine does I imagine you'll be able to. Just please be careful and be safe, and feel free to ask anything else you need to in order to be so.

 

[LimitSeethe]

Wow !
Thank you for the answer , I really appreciate it, yes Tilidin (the solution, 100ml) kicks after 10minutes.
Yes when my GP is back he will keep prescribing me Tilidine, but I need to try this Plugging with the DHC , and yes they are instant release tablets.
Is there such a big difference between oral use and plugging? and with what dosage shall I start over?
maybe 150mg oral / 120 mg rectal?

thank you alot , and have a nice day

EDIT: as mentioned above, I did not feel much with 240mg DHC oral

 

[cuivre]

Yes, there can be a really big difference between oral use and plugging depending on the drug. I have a lot of experience with plugging but very little with DHC, so it's honestly hard for me to give you any dosing advice (especially knowing so little about Tilidine, too) or know just how big of a difference it will be, but with certain opioids it is night and day. Unlike codeine, DHC has a low oral bioavailability so plugging is likely to [possibly greatly] increase absorption and will certainly decrease time to onset.

There are a whole bunch of threads on here about plugging DHC; I can try to find some links and hopefully that will be of some help. HERE'S ONE. HERE'S ANOTHER pretty basic one.

Without giving you a specific mg number suggestion, I think you want to make a pretty big reduction from oral use your first time plugging. It can hit a lot harder and it's very easy and effective to add more (at least with other opioids IME) but pretty well impossible to take less. Even though you did not feel much with 240mg oral DHC, with plugging I would reduce by 40-50% or so to start. This is pretty conservative but the worst that is likely to happen is you'll have to take more. It's always good to have a relatively safe baseline to know how your body reacts and from which you can move forward. Plus you seem to have plenty of pills.

Especially with how quickly the oral Tilidine kicks in with a "bigger rush" (in your words), plugging DHC may end up somewhat more similar to that than oral use of other opioids. I don't want to give you such conservative advice that it's a waste of drugs but I'm just telling you to be careful Also, it was unclear whether you were asking if you should take some rectally and some by mouth when you asked "maybe 150mg oral/120 rectal" or if you were just trying to ascertain a conversion ratio. Like I said, start as low as you find reasonable, and I wouldn't take any by mouth concurrently with plugging until you know how the rectal use effects you.

To be perfectly clear, while plugging is safer than IVing and arguably about equal to insufflation on the risk-taking scale, any method of consumption that decreases time to onset and at least partially bypasses first-pass-metabolism has its own inherent risks. Without a doubt, oral is safer and in a perfect world it would be better to continue on that way but there are plenty of good reasons that may explain why it's not working so hot for you (low oral BA, the low time of onset with the drugs you're used to, etc.). I think based on how it sounds like Tilidine works you'll be fine but just keep all of that in mind and be smart about your dosing.

Good luck and let me know if there's anything else I can do.

 

[LimitSeethe]

dear cuivre,
thank you alot for all the nice help, I will try plugging them this time, I will report the difference if there is any

again, thank you for all that help,

good evening sir