[Combo Subthread] Psychedelics & Amphetamines

GrOwThSpUrT

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I could not find anything suggesting it is not a good combo, but I haven`t seen anyone advertise it either. So I would like to know if anyone out there knows any reasons not to combine amphetamines and lsa, or hawaiian baby woodrose in particular. Thank you very much, becaus e I thought it might be fun to do lsa right now, and when I go out tonight, I`ll probably take some amphetamines to help me be awake all night.
 
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themagicmushroom

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Ummm... this probably sounds like some hippy shit to some ppl but... hey, shit happens! My advice would be to not cross an 'expansion' spirit like LSD/LSA with an 'angry' or 'power' spirit like amphetamines. I've found it a fast track to paranoia and fucked up trips. I've never done HBWR or morning glory seeds but I get the impression that LSA trips can get pretty nasty under the wrong circumstances anyway. I think you should take the speed another time. Hell, then you get two nights of fuckedness!
 

GrOwThSpUrT

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I intend to use it after the trip, not during the trip, ie, I`ll trip in the afternoon, and do some amp`s tonight, would be no problem right? I intend to do it after the trip is completely over? I was only checking to see if it`s not plain dangerous.
 

GrOwThSpUrT

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Oh yeah, and a friend of mine says that if I take them sublingually, and follow by swallowing them, that 1/3 will not count.
ie. If I take 6 seeds orally, he says it is equal to doing 4 seeds my way( taking them sublingually, to decrease come-on time, and swallowing not to lose potency etc. etc.) Now I am prettu damn sure that if I do it my way, sublingually followed by orally, it will work just as good as taking the 6 seeds orally right?? I mean, what kind of thing would have to happen for the 2 of the 6 seeds to disappear right?

I understand that with normal sublingual administration you will lose a bit because you spit it out after x amount of time, but since I did not spit it out, I`ll get the same effects as 6 seeds orally right?

Sorry for repeating my point over and over again, but I thought maybe it would be clear to you, because he does not seem to understand it.
 

Blowmonkey

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I understand that with normal sublingual administration you will lose a bit because you spit it out after x amount of time, but since I did not spit it out, I`ll get the same effects as 6 seeds orally right?
my "understandings" say no, i'll keep it a short as possible..

different ways of ingestion will end up in different experiences most of the time. now i don't know if this counts for lsa too, but since there is a significant difference in effects with "normal sublingual" dosing (spitting out the seeds after holding) i have to say that there is also a difference in first sublingual, then swallowing. you're getting the most out of them by swallowing them after, but still..

for instance. dpt rectally and dpt insufflated will end up in two different trips. absorption is a great factor in intensity in trips. now if you take them sublingual, you'll need twice as much (bluedolphin's statement) because of absorption, i think it hasn't got to do with the fact you'll lose some by not absorbing it all, but rather with the fact of different ways of ingestion. it hasn't got to do with the amount your taking, but as i said numerous times, because of different ways of ingestion.

now i don't know this for sure, i mean i'm going to find out in a week or so, then i'll have my own and plenty of them :))), but i'm just suggesting something here, the only thing that you didn't want to take for granted was my explanation, because you learn this in your school :)p) and since you know so much about it you're sure of it that YOU are right, maybe I am right here. we'll just have to see muhahaha...=D
 

GrOwThSpUrT

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And I say that the trip might not be as hard on the come-up, but it will start faster, and the peak will be the same, the experience will just come on smoother.

And 2 different ways of absorption usually boost each other, but I know that more will get absorbed then when you just use it sublingually, and itmight even get absorbed better than with just orally. If it gets absorbed in the mouth already, it has no chance of being destroyed by the stomach, or passing through the stomach right? I think it is just as good, or at least just as good to keep them under your tongue for 10-15 minutes first, and then swallowing them.

At the very least I can say that I experienced no nausea whatsoever on 6 seeds of HBWR, not yet at least, but I think I`m safe 3 hours after inegstion.
 

Piper methysticum

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In a short reply, I would say this would be a bad idea for many people and for many reasons. LSA is stimulating anyway, and Amphetamine would make me completely crazy during or after a trip. I would feel like I was in physical and psychological hell for a while. I personally only like mixing Cannabis with stronger psychedelics, but If I ever used anything else it would be during the wearing off, and it would be either a mild Opiate like Codeine or a Benzodiazepine.
 

Blowmonkey

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LSA is stimulating anyway
lsa has got a wide range of effects, mostly it's sedating as hell, stimulation can also accur. it's listed as a depressant though.
I ever used anything else it would be during the wearing off
he does, read all of the posts. he is taking the lsa in the afternoon, the speed in the night. i would say it's a safe thing to do, only problem that could happen is that your stomach can't handle all of those chemicals and will regurgitate. amph in particular, lsa is mostly nauseating in the beginning, but i've read reports that mentioned a never ending nausea throughout the trip. but for the rest, it's doable.
 

Morninggloryseed

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Back when I used to take stimulants for ADD, I did this combo a few times. I didn't like it at all. It made my mind race.

These seeds are somewhat sedating, but that's what they do. If one doesn't like that, I'd recommend a psychedelic with more stimulating properties.
 

Morninggloryseed

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Blowmonkey said:
lsa has got a wide range of effects, mostly it's sedating as hell, stimulation can also accur. it's listed as a depressant though.


d-lysergic acid amide is a schedule 3 substance and is listed as a depressant.

LSA however is not d-lysergic acid amide. LSA refers to ALL of the amides of lysergic acid that are in the seeds, not just d-lysergic acid amide. There are are nearly a dozen alkaloids in the seeds, though most only in trace quantities.

The code names for d-lysergic acid amide are ergine, LA-111, or lysergamide.

LSA (or more properly LSAs) are not listed as a group in the USA's federal scheduled drugs list.
 

Joe Rob

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If your going to be eating amps later in the night i suggest you use the no nausea method of ingesting the HBWR. Sublingually can still cause some pretty nasty stomach cramps. Heres what you do....

1. Use a blunt object such as a butter knife to scrape off the fuzzy shit on the seeds.
2. Crush the seeds into as fine a mess as you can using a hammer or something.
3. Mix the powder in a little bit of lemon juice/lemon extract.
4. Let sit for about 3-4 hours.
5. Drink that shit

I had a friend use this method when he also ate 20mgs of 2c-i and a vallium. He said he had absolutely no nausea and he had a great time...

Good luck and happy tripping :D
 

Morninggloryseed

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Joe Rob said:
1. Use a blunt object such as a butter knife to scrape off the fuzzy shit on the seeds.
Why? There is nothing in the fuzzy layer that makes you sick. It is inert. This issue has been addressed many times and it should be well known now that the "cyanide in the fuzzy layer of woodrose seeds" is a myth.

It is the soap-like glycosides IN the seeds that causes the nausea.
 

GrOwThSpUrT

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I ate 6 seeds, didn`t feel that in the beginning, than I felt the seeds that I had in my stomach kick in, my stomach felt a little weird, I felt really relaxed, and enjoyed smoking some pure weed. A friend of mine came by and we smoked some more weed. I didn`t feel nausea or anything. I had a great night, I`ll tell you all later, b`cuz:

</Midget lghts the jonkoe/>
 

R-717

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The neighbor across the way said that he had tried AI and MGS extract together. Not HBWS, so maybe a little off-topic, but AI is similar to amphetamine. A love/ hate experience.
 

GrOwThSpUrT

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I decided not to do the amphetamines, because I felt the seeds reasonably well, and had a nice headbuzz goin` on, so i decided to just drink a few beers instead. only problem was that I was already not feeling so well before, and the combo of not sleeping untill deep in the night, lsa, and a few beers was definitely not good for me. I woke up feeling ok, just a little queasy, but I also felt that that was not from anything like a hangover, and I got sick, damn, fucked the rest of my weekend. But I`m feeling a bit better today, so I`m going to get some grade-a weed, and smoke some of it, and I know I`ll have no trouble falling asleep tonight.
 

Piper methysticum

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I have only had two sedating LSA trips out of around 10. All others have been very stimulating. Even the two I had that were sedating I could blame the fact that I was already drowsy for one, and the other was my first time.
 

Hypercloud

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Ehy guys just a question: how long should I keep the crushed seeds inside the water/juice?
I've read anything, from 1 minute to 24 hours... which is a good threshold to have the potion done?
 

Morninggloryseed

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Ehy guys just a question: how long should I keep the crushed seeds inside the water/juice?
I've read anything, from 1 minute to 24 hours... which is a good threshold to have the potion done?
You should not need juice (citric acid) if you use distilled (pure) water. LSAs are water soluble so will dissolve into water with a neutral PH. Now I don't know if the juice would make them dissolve better of not (which would convert them into citrate salts), but as the amides of lysergic acid in the seeds are very delicate molecules I'd be cautious about adding anything. I guess this sounds like the making of an experiment. ;)

BTW, 6 to 12 hours is plenty, just make sure you grind them into a fine powder. You will then need cheese cloth, or a peice of a tee-shirt to filter it. It will clog a coffee filter. I've never made extracts with less than 6 hours of soaking time, so I don't know about shorter periods of time. I've done them for several days, and it's not nessessary. It just gets nastier and slimier.

I always started out with warm (not hot) water, shook vigorously, then kept it in the fridge and stirred it every hour (when possible). Leaving it at room temperature the whole time seemed to make it more nasty to drink.

But I don't like water extracts of MG/HBWR seeds. The seemed to lack something of the experience of eating the whole seed. More narcotic/sedating and less psychedelic. Sure there was little to no nausea with the extracts, but I didn't mind the puking that eating the seeds entailed.

I have only had two sedating LSA trips out of around 10.
Mine were only really sedating if I made a water extract. Eating the whole seed was not.
 
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swayne

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morninggloryseed said:
Why? There is nothing in the fuzzy layer that makes you sick. It is inert. This issue has been addressed many times and it should be well known now that the "cyanide in the fuzzy layer of woodrose seeds" is a myth.

It is the soap-like glycosides IN the seeds that causes the nausea.
hey man, not doubting you at all, but how come erowid hasn't recognized this myth yet, it seems they may still be fueling it:

Note: the fuzzy coating on the outside contains cyanogenic glycosides
which can make you really sick if you eat enough (same kind of stuff in
apple seeds).

this can be found here : http://www.erowid.org/plants/hbw/hbw_info1.shtml

so assuming this is in fact a myth, perhaps erowid should be made aware of this by someone with authority so they can edit it and spread no more misinformation.
 

Archaic Revival

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I have read some 'recipes' on how to make a solution of LSA-alkaloids in an alcohol mixture. A few of them said that when putting the ground up seeds (either HBW's or MG's) in cold H2O and remove the thin layer that appears after a few days you thus take those chemicals that couse the nausea. I haven't tryed is yet, but it could make sence ...

Another method to 'exclude' the nausea-factor is to ingest the ground-up seeds mixed in ice-cream. That way the compounds pass the stomach much faster and the LSA's will be absorbed in your bowels.
 
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